T Nation

Cycle help?

Hey guys!
Alright, so with all these new sales going on I’m going to give mag-10 a go. Any tips or suggestions would be great guys.I’m thinking about going 4 weeks of mass building on mag-10, would this be optimal? I then would like to cut for a couple of weeks to shed the excess bodyfat. Im thinking aobut using 4-ad-ec during the cutting phase. WHen i go off Mag-10 how long should i wait to use the 4-ad-ec? I know i need to do two weeks of tribex and M. After that should i use the 4-ad-ec or can i start using the 4-ad-ec along with the tribex and M to preserve mass while cutting?
thanks guys

See Mag-10 Plan For Success: www.t-mag.com/articles/mag10plan.html
Not sure about the 4-AD-EC question.

Josh, were you planning on using Mag-10 for 4 straight weeks, or using it at 2 weeks on, two weeks off, and then another two weeks on (totalling 4 total on weeks?)

I would suggest the latter option. In terms of retaining muscle, this plan seems to work best. And, obviously you should use Tribex/M between your cycles, and after your last one.

I would make sure to eat at maintanence calories or slightly above for the two weeks between your cycles; and then for another two weeks after your final cycle. You may put on a tiny bit of extra fat, but it will help you tremendously in terms of solidifying and holding onto the muscle you've gained.

Remember to check your weight and body fat at the end of each cycle so that you can better determine how many calories you need to eat, as it will obviously not be the same number as pre-cycle.

After a month or so of maintaining, slowly transition into a cutting phase. If you only drop cals slightly, then 4-AD-EC is a bit over the top and Methoxy-7 is a better choice.

If you choose to go the way of severe dieting, which I do not recommend so soon after a bulking phase, 4-AD-EC will help you hold onto a good amount of the muscle you've gained.

My advice is to be patient and diet the excess fat off a bit slowly. Hope this helps.

Hey john, do you think it would be a good idea to be on mag 10 for four straight weeks or would I get better gains from cycling on and off the the 8?

Actually, this was very recently addressed on the forum. I tried to locate the thread but couldn’t find it in the archives. I will summarize, though. That posters question was in regard to 8 weeks, rather than 4, but it works either way. Hope this helps.

Essentially, Bill Roberts informed the poster that if his priority was how he looked specifically 8 weeks from "today" then 8 weeks straight is the way to go. However, doing 4 cycles of 2on/2off is likely to give better results.

So, if you have the time and the patience, it will be more beneficial to use Mag-10 for two weeks at a time, for two cycles, rather than one cycle of four weeks.

Even if you don't make more gains in terms of LBM, the amount that mass that you will retain post-cycle will almost certainly be greater.

My goal is long-term gains, not a date-specific goal. Is it possible that doing several 2 week “mini” cycles separated by (for example) a month or more “off” in between each bottle, would be better in the long run than doing one long single consecutive cycle? I’m planning on buying 4 bottles of Mag-10 while it’s on sale. What would be the ideal way to make the most out of my time and investment? Any advantage to stretching things out over time? Thanks for your help!

Lumpy, generally speaking I think there may be some benefit to longer off periods, but I’m not certain about your specific case. Bill Roberts would obviously be the person to answer this question, but he has been slighlty absent from the forum lately.

I think the reason to use longer off periods has something to do with a saturation of the androgen receptor; this is why steroid users cycle instead of just being "on" forever. Most of them, the is. The smart ones.

Although Mag-10 is not a steroid, it works in much the same way. What I mean is, if I understand things correctly (and it is very possible thatI do not) longer off periods allow for the potential to make greater gains while "on." I suppose you could think of the Law of Diminishing Returns.

Personally, I don't think it's necessary to make too much adjustment to the Mag-10 plan as it is. However, I think that if you used off periods of 4 weeks or longer, you could probably do more consecutive cycles safely.

For example, let us define a "cycle" becomes a 6 week split of 2 on, 4 off. Compare this to the previous cycle of 2 on 2 off. If it is recommended to do no more than 3 cycles of 2 on, 2 off; you MAY be able to safely do 4 or more cycles at 2 on, 4 off. This would obviously total a greater number of "on" weeks, potentially leading to greater gains.

However, keep in mind that with each 2 week cycle, your overall gains will seem smaller and smaller. If you gain 20 pounds on your first 2 week cycle, chances are you will not do so well on your second, if it's only a month later. The closer you get to your genetic limit, the harder it is to make gains.

If it turns out that you are able to do a few cycles of Mag-10 and make phenomenal gains each time, such as 20 pounds or more, then in all honesty you were far enough from your limit that using a pro-hormone was completely unnecessary.

I know I've gone off on a bit of a tangent so let me summarize: I think that 2 on/2 off is fine, unless you want to do a greater number of total on cycles. In that event, the longer off periods would suit you better. However, we should wait for Bill to respond before we come to any definitive conclusions. Hope this helps.