T Nation

Cycle Help


#1

Hey all,

I have testosterone enanthate, and my friend has an identical cycle only with 3 weeks worth of winstrol (40 mg ed). I'm trying to convince him to just use the test as it is our first cycle for the both of us. If you could help with the planning it would be much appreciated, because I have done most of the research between the two of us but I feel like I have a lot of pressure on me to get it right and my friend is stupid enough to just start the cycle asap and most likely will even if I tell him not to because he hasn't done enough reading up. The cycle is as follows:

Weeks 1-12 (or 10 I am not sure yet): 500 mg test e per week
PCT: We each have 30 tabs of nolva (@20 mg), and 40 of clomid (@50 mg).

The confusion is over the dosages and tapering off of the PCT, and whether we have enough to use some nolva for HCG or if we should combine both at the end, or just use one or the other. I am not sure if we have enough, and would really like advice on that point.

Just to clarify, my bench is 225 10 times at 165 pounds, and squat is at 325, and my friend has similar numbers except he weighs more. We have been lifting for 5 years with good diet, running, and supplements.

Thanks again if you can add some input, it would help us out a lot.

PS: Can winnie oral be ran for 3 weeks without PCT? I've heard it works but am skeptical.


#2

[quote]JohnSmith1 wrote:
Hey all,

I have testosterone enanthate, and my friend has an identical cycle only with 3 weeks worth of winstrol (40 mg ed). I’m trying to convince him to just use the test as it is our first cycle for the both of us. If you could help with the planning it would be much appreciated, because I have done most of the research between the two of us but I feel like I have a lot of pressure on me to get it right and my friend is stupid enough to just start the cycle asap and most likely will even if I tell him not to because he hasn’t done enough reading up. The cycle is as follows:

Weeks 1-12 (or 10 I am not sure yet): 500 mg test e per week
PCT: We each have 30 tabs of nolva (@20 mg), and 40 of clomid (@50 mg).

The confusion is over the dosages and tapering off of the PCT, and whether we have enough to use some nolva for HCG or if we should combine both at the end, or just use one or the other. I am not sure if we have enough, and would really like advice on that point.

Just to clarify, my bench is 225 10 times at 165 pounds, and squat is at 325, and my friend has similar numbers except he weighs more. We have been lifting for 5 years with good diet, running, and supplements.

Thanks again if you can add some input, it would help us out a lot.

PS: Can winnie oral be ran for 3 weeks without PCT? I’ve heard it works but am skeptical.[/quote]

How old are you?
Don’t post sources

Weeks 1-10

Test Enthanate 500mg (250 2x a week monday thursday)

Weeks 1-12

Adex .25mg-.5mg Every other day

2 weeks after last shot

Adex .25mg Eod (begin slowly tapering off)
Nolva 20/20/20/20
Clomid 50/50/50/50 (if you feel clomid is necessary, which I personally don’t)

If you have winstrol it should be used weeks 9-12

P.S…no


#3

[quote]JohnSmith1 wrote:
PCT: We each have 30 tabs of nolva (@20 mg), and 40 of clomid (@50 mg).
[/quote]

This won’t be enough for both of you. The Nolva alone would last only one of you the first half of a proper PCT.

??? What are you talking about, “use nolva for HCG” - HCG is a completely different compound that is used to help prevent testicular atrophy on cycle. I can’t answer the rest of that question because it doesn’t make any sense.

How tall are you? 165 is really not very heavy…

[quote]
Thanks again if you can add some input, it would help us out a lot.

PS: Can winnie oral be ran for 3 weeks without PCT? I’ve heard it works but am skeptical.[/quote]

Input: review everything, you need to do more research and probably wait a couple years. And 3 weeks of winnie with or without a PCT is a bad idea, but even worse without.


#4

I’m 5’8". So for a 12 week, 500 mg test E per week cycle, a PCT of 30 tabs @ 20mg a tab won’t work as follows?

week 1-12 test E

PCT of
days 1-6 (about 2 weeks after last injection): 40mg nolva per day
days 7-16: 20 mg nolva per day
days 16-25: 10 mg per day

days 1-21: 50 mg clomid per day

Is this really that bad? And does anyone think the clomid is needed?

Thanks.


#5

Sure, do that PCT.


#6

[quote]TRTblastcruise wrote:
Sure, do that PCT.[/quote]

Ok. Sorry, I forgot to add I’m training for the 200 meter dash. Without any arimadex, is this cycle safe for my testes considering the outlined PCT? If not, is 10 weeks a safer duration for the test? Before anyone says test is mainly for mass, I train for speed and know some sprinters who have used test successfully.


#7

I ran a similar cycle my first go round with no adex and I was fine. But that was me so I cannot comment if you will be fine but there a good chance you would be.

The pct isn’t ideal but again, I think given the cycle is relatively moderate it should suffice. Run the winny weeks 9 thru 12 then start pct a day or two after your last oral.


#8

[quote]JohnSmith1 wrote:

[quote]TRTblastcruise wrote:
Sure, do that PCT.[/quote]

Ok. Sorry, I forgot to add I’m training for the 200 meter dash. Without any arimadex, is this cycle safe for my testes considering the outlined PCT? If not, is 10 weeks a safer duration for the test? Before anyone says test is mainly for mass, I train for speed and know some sprinters who have used test successfully.[/quote]

Well…not using arimidex leaves the door wide open for bloat, water retention, gynecomstia, and other things…

But i’ve never heard of bitch tits slowing someone down in the 200 meter so I say go for it!