T Nation

Cycle critique

I have put together the following for my 2nd cycle. First one was a mild deca/dbol 8 week cycle, I wanted to do a relatively mild cycle. No deca dick but I was only doing 400/mg wk. So here’s the cycle I am thinking about now.

Test enanth 200mg/wk
Primo enanth 400mg/wk
Winnie 50/mg day (I may only be able to get depot though)

I was thinking about a 2 wk on/off schedule for various reasons.

I would appreciate any feedback, especially on dieting and training. I made great gains on my first cycle, but I would like to improve obviously. My main goal in keeping the T low is to avoid the moon face I got with dbol. Clomid will be my anti-e during and after cycles. Thanks.

you can help avoid moon face by using an antiaromatase like femara and keeping your carb intake under control.

As for this cycle, your 2 week on and 2 week off approach will not be effective. With the enantate esters, it will take two weeks just to begin to reach effective blood levels to make gains, you will then be d/c for two weeks which will cause levels to drop, but to the point where you do not make gains, but are still suppressed at the htpa. Then you restart again for two weeks, and once again do not have enough time on cycle with blood levels steady at a high enough level to make good gains. I think you need to rethink this cycle.

Thanks P22, yeah I was thinking that the whole two week idea wasn’t a great one. What do you think of the combination though? I would love to have some Tren in there, but this cycle is basically a result of what I can obtain from a reliable source.

Primobolan and Winny is a good cycle as neither drugs aromatise, both are minimally suppressive, one is class 1 and the other class 2 which means they are complementary, and there is no need for clomid during or after cycle to restart the htpa since no estrogen has aromatised. You should be able to retain a large portion of your gains on this cycle. Since summer is fast approching I would say this cycle is not a bad idea. I recomend a dose of primo in the 400-600 mg range per week and winstrol in the 350- 700 range depending on whether it is oral or depot - depot meaning you shouldn’t have to use as much to get the same effects. Cycle length could be anywhere from 6-8 weeks, a lot of people recomend only 6 wks on a 17-aa, but I believe an extra 2 weeks isn’t going to cause chronic liver damage.

Thanks for the input P22. I agree about the primo/winny combo, but man is it expensive! I was going to throw in the test for the first half to try and get a little extra bang for my buck. However, I think I will skip it and the hassle associated with aromatization. I think 8 weeks, 600mg Primo and 350 mg Win Depot. I’m currently 205, 10%. I’d like to get up around 220 8%. Seem realistic? Any ideas on diet, other than standard massive eating would be appreciated. Thanks! BTW, can I really get away with no clomid at all?

Its summer time comming anyway,who wants to be big and fat? I recommend you increase your protein consumtion to 350-400 grams per day, and decrease your carb intake to less than 100 grams a day. Include a refeed day each week or “cheat” day and you should be good. Also morning cardio or post workout cardio sessions would be a good idea as well. Once you reach your target bf%, slowly increase your carbs so you maintain your bf%, begin gaining more muscle. Make a goal of being down to your target bf% by week 4. I recomend you begin pre cycle by starting your diet and doing about 5 days of cardio a week for 2 weeks. this will get you into the groove and help rev up your metabolism, giving you more time on cycle to focus on puting muscle on.