T Nation

Cycle Advice - Test/Mast/Var/Clen


#1

Hey guys,

Although im new to the forum, ive been browsing here for years and now im hoping to get your opinions on my next cycle.

Stats:
25yrs old
5ft 9"
185lb @ 12% BF

Cycle History
Test E / Var / Proviron / Winny
PH’s in the past (Mostly Epi)

This time around Ive got a few bottles of Test P / Mast to play around with, along with some var and clen. The goal is to add some lean muscle mass, while minimizing as much water retention as possible, but overall trying to get as hard and lean as possible.

During my previous cycle, I hated how bloated I got with Test E, so this time around Im hoping to eliminate that while switching over to prop. It is summer after all and I want to look as aesthetic as possible :slight_smile:

I respond very well to AAS, so that is why ive kept dosages as follows:

Week 1-10: 300mg test p / 450mg mast p / 50mg var
PCT - Nolva/Clomid/HCG

Ai: Letro (will use only when necessary as I am sensitive to gyno since puberty)

My questions to you guys:

  • should I front load, or is this not necessary with short acting esters?
  • should I wait 2 weeks to start the var?
  • how should I utilize the clen in this cycle? I have never used it before (trying to get as lean as possible)

Thank you in advance T-Nation!


#2

ok, so firstly this is a bad idea. If you wait til you’ve got gyno symptoms, it’s already too late and you don’t want your E to get that high in the first place. There is more to high E than just gyno, and believe me you don’t want it.

You’re only running a fairly low dose of test, so letro will be hard to dose properly unless you have liquid. I would get some aromasin or adex. It’ll be much easier to manage your E without dropping it too low.

meh, if you like. Not really all that necessary in my opinion.[quote=“ecko223, post:1, topic:217361”]
should I wait 2 weeks to start the var?
[/quote]

personal preference, really. I like an oral kickstart just to get you gaining straight away but in theory you’d get better results if you wait until the test levels peak. No right or wrong answer here.[quote=“ecko223, post:1, topic:217361”]
how should I utilize the clen in this cycle? I have never used it before (trying to get as lean as possible)
[/quote]

I run clen 5 on/9 off. So I do Mon-Fri one week, then take the weekend of that week and the full next week off. Less chance of your receptors downregulating this way, and being on clen sucks balls. As for dosage, just go as high as you can without feeling like total ass. I use 80mcg, personally.

It’s a good summer cutting cycle you’ve got there. Make sure your diet is good and you should notice some pretty positive shit going on


#3

Hey, not disagreeing with @Yogi1 about the AI, but you should consider the anti-estrogenic effects of Mast. I would not consider the Mast when deciding on AI dosage, just the Test P and the Var.


#4

yeah I agree about not considering the mast. You wouldn’t consider the var either, seeing as it doesn’t aromatise.


#5

@Yogi1 @The_Myth The reason why the test dosage is so low due to my previous side effects with test e (bloat,moon face,etc). I found that although my previous dose was low (200/week) the ethanate gave me good results in terms of muscle building but the sides were too much. I could probably attribute this to not running an AI last time due to bad advice from a colleague who told me it wasnt neceesary at such a low dose.

Regarding the letro, ive had mild gyno since puberty and I was hoping I could potentially reduce it by running a low letro dose throughout my cycle…thoughts?

Is it worth upping my masteron dose as Ive never used this compound before and ive heard that it is best utilized at 400 - 600mg.

Also, ive got a bunch of bulk 11-oxo lying around, can I throw this into the mix?

Thank you for all the advice given so far.
Thanks


#6

definitely run an AI. I have no idea where this whole “just have it on hand in case of gyno” thing came from, but it’s a really very bad idea.

I strongly recommend switching away from letro. I don’t have any science to back it up but I’ve known a few people who’ve tried to use it to reverse pubertal gyno and it hasn’t worked. I’m not saying that it doesn’t, just that it hasn’t in all of the people I know who’s tried it.

If you’re really paranoid about gyno you can always run 20mg of nolva a day while you’re on, but if you’re using an AI in theory you shouldn’t need to.

I can’t comment on the masteron dose as I’ve never used it but I would think 450mg would be fine. I don’t know what 11-oxo is so I can’t really comment on that either.