T Nation

Cutter I'm Putting Together


So here's what I'm thinking at this point.

Tren E 400mg/week Weeks 1-6
Primo Depot 350mg/week Weeks 1-8
Proviron 25mg/Day Weeks 2-8
T3 25mcg/day Weeks 3-8
Nolva 40mg/day Weeks 11-12
Nolva 20mg/day Till feel normal
Aromasin 20mg/day Weeks 11-14

I also may introduce Letro if progesterone related sides become a problem.

Ok, so here's my reasoning for what you see above. I've been looking to run Tren for a while to help put on some quality lean mass while cutting. Since its tren e I'd be injecting for 6 weeks and likely riding out it's benefits for around 8 weeks total.

Most times people will tell you that you need to run it with test to avoid fina dick. I don't wish to do this because I'm looking to keep androgenic sides in check and I don't wish to incur the negative impact to collagen synthesis. I therefore chose to exclude test and include proviron in order to maintain libido. I wouldn't start it until week 2 since it'd take at least a week for any real level of tren to build up in my system.

The primo is in there for an extra something during the cycle and continues on for two weeks after the tren e to have a nice mild anabolic supporting me as I come off the tren.

The T3 is in there to combat the potential lowering of thyroid function while on tren. I picked this up from an Anthony Roberts post/article. It starts in week 3 since tren levels shouldn't become significant anytime sooner than that.

The nolvadex in pct is for recovery of LH and all that other good stuff. Aromasin is included to keep estrogen levels low during the recovery of natural test levels. This is again from some Anthony Roberts stuff I read.

So take a look and let me know what you guys think.


I believe Letro is not for Progesterone (I actually think it's prolactin you're concerned with with tren) Dostinex is best there. Why not switch tren with masterone and primo with test. avoid proviron and use arimidex while on and aromasin/nolve when coming off.


Also, test is connective tissue neutral in most cases. Tren may increase collagen syn through growth factors through the prolactin channel...but you'll be suppressing that and the estrogen...can't say it will have the same effect.

There is a bit of 'minutia' in your thinking I think.
Focus should be on training and rehab.
use steroids to get the muscles around your joints stronger.

eq is a collagen booster and seems to have little prolac/progest stimulation. It also is good for your mma endurance.

Mast/Test/eq in equal parts at a low dose. 600mg/week 1 400mg subsequent weeks is a favorite of many atheltes if you're looking to keep strong and maintain or lose weight. Or cut


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Actually I think AR will jump in that Letro does help with progesterone induced gyno. I'm too lazy to dig up the link/references though so I'll leave that to him.



Exactly. Here's the link. forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=199838

Scrappy, my research has show that test does have a noticable negative impact on joint health. I suffered an ACL tear late last june while on 500mg/week of test and did it while doing something I had done 1000 times before with no problem. Is there a chance the test had nothing to do with it? Yeah. But I'm done spinning the wheel on that one. That's another reason the primo is in there as it has a positive effect on joint health.

Also, your alternate suggestions are certainly viable, but basically this cycle is about me wanting to run tren, then building the rest of the cycle around my concerns regarding not wanting to run test, joint health, and tren's potential pit falls.

Bush, if I end up green lighting this one I'll certainly let you know how it goes.


though it causes joint pain i think winny has some collagen building properties... I think A.R. wrote about it here or on some site.


I'm only familiar with a piece on meso from A.R. on the subject.


I read a lot of conflicting shit about winny and collagen. At any rate, while I thought it was one of the best physique drugs I used it hurt my joints and I rarely take it.

Interesting stuff about letrozole and its anti progesterone/prolactin effects.
I didn't know that.


Yeah, I've used winny and had the same problems. I have bad shoulders and on winny they would hurt just from reaching back to hold the bar for squats. I got pretty darn strong though.


Oh yeah, I think winny was a great drug. It pepped me up, some roids make me sleepy, I felt great on it. I notice great physique change while cutting. I thought it was awesome except for the joint thing.

I was actually gonna run some with my next cycle
50mg tabs/day gave me joint issues so I was gonna see if 30mg/day doesn't, or see what I can get away with and use OT probably for a short oral only cycle