T Nation

Critique My First Cycle!


This is gonna be my first cycle and I've been doing some pretty hardcore research for the last year or so debating on what to run, and how to do it. Deriving different opinions from every book that spans from here to China and back, here's what i came up with:

Weeks 1-10
500 mg Test Enanthate (Monday morning/Thurs night-please give opinions on inj. times and such)

Weeks 1-4
50 mg Dianabol split up evenly throughout the day (quicker Test gains/added mass)

Weeks 1-10 (IF I CAN GET IT)
50 mg Proviron ED (Anti E effects/added fat loss)

Weeks 10-14
Nolvadex (The typical 40 40 20 20)

So, a few things:
-I'm 21, been lifting since i was around 14 (football/dynamic effort type stuff), and more recently moved into a bodybuilding focus. I'm at around 10-12% BF but I'm honestly not 100% sure about that number because i haven't actually calculated it (sorry). You can make you're own judgement off my picture.
-My goal is to drop to around 6-8% BF and still gain some weight which i know shouldn't be TOO difficult. I plan on doing consistent cardio and I've recently adopted the paleo diet thanks to a cousin of mine. I'm actually using "The Paleo Diet For Athlete's" as a basis for my dieting. So, as far as diet and training is concerned, I'd like to say I'm well off.
-My questions:
1. How does the cycle look in general? Any suggestions?
2. The proviron says (IF I CAN GET IT) because I'm not sure if my source can get it or not due to his supplier being out of it at this point. Should i wait? Is it worth taking? Too risky to be taking 2 orals? Dumb to have a mass gaining oral and an oral that (kind of) aids in fat loss? Opinions welcome!
3. Needle size? What's everybody's personal fav? I'm thinking 23G 1"?

Well, although I'm sure I'm forgetting something, I'm gonna post this anyway!
Thanks all,


No AI?

I'm not sure that proviron has all the estrogen lowering effects you are ascribing to it. It is good for freeing up Free T and increasing libido, but I'm not so sure about its use to combat estrogen.

For needle, use a 30 gauge insulin pin if you can (not sure if they make them big enough for 250 mg injections). I use them for my TRT and they are excellent for that purpose.

Your cycle looks pretty simple overall (which is good for a first timer IMO).


The only reason i don't have an AI is because i didnt think it was necessary with such a low (500mg) dose. From what i've read, its a split decision. I'll have the Nolva on hand if things take a turn for the worse.

I've never heard of slin pins being used for anything other than gh and insulin (obviously), but ill look into that. I don't think they make them big enough, especially for oil based comps


1) Maybe it's a typo but start your PCT 2 weeks after your last injection. From your example it's seems you'll start it right away.

2) The proviron will counter the estrogen sides well enough and should you have issues you can use the Nolva. Proviron is not very harsh on the liver since it's not c17-alpha alkylated. I've taken Proviron once during the last 6 weeks of a cycle. It does make you lose some of the water retention.

I always keep Adex on hand though, so water retention is at a minimal.

3) I use 0,8x40mm needles (sorry european) for glutes and quads. For the quads I only inject slightly over an inch. For glutes all the way in.

Good luck!


Thanks for the info on the PCT, that will definitely help out!
And that's basically what i was looking for as far as using the proviron goes.



Are my injection times okay? And what about the proviron? Should i take it throughout the entire cycle?


i just got some 20g 1.5" needles for drawing the oil and 23g 1" for injecting.


Dropping 5% bodyfat while GAINING size is not easy regardless of diet, training and drugs. Especially if you are in decent condition to begin with. The reality here is that your goals are likely not attainable over the time period you have, and the stack you propose. You should take a longer look at what you're proposing and adjust either your cycle, or your expectations.


I guess i shouldn't have said it was that drastic of a drop. I'm not expecting that at all. Like i said, i don't know my exact percentage but i think it's around 8 to be honest because single digits warrant abs, correct? And i appreciate the advice, regardless juice20jd.

And @ patrick4588, that was my plan to begin with! good to know i was on the right track!


Wrong. 29g is plenty big enough. I wont go into the physics and mechanics of how fluids flow through a cylinder, but trust us, they work.


Proviron is a waste of money.

An AI is only a 50/50 choice until you get gyno, water retention, skin problems, mood swings; then you'll wish it was a 100% 'choice'.

50mg of dbol per day is overkill for a first cycle. By a lot. Stick with 30mg. Unless you like the approach of using as much as possible from the outset, then you may as well dump in 2g of test along with it.


This...and I was talking about the barrel being able to hold the volume of liquid...I am 100% positive that whatever amount of oil you put in the barrel can be injected...


An update; My guy wasn't able to get proviron, so Bonez, your opinion has been heard! Haha

And i will definitely try to get my hands on some Letr. or Adex asap just in case.



This...times 2.

Proviron is highly overrated. It might free up some test and give you a small libido boost, but other than that it is a waste. You're better off running masteron in it's place; get the libido boost,and actually get some muscle/strength building benefit from including another compound in your cycle. The "anti-e" properties of proviron don't even really warrant much comment, as it is absolute shit compared to an AI.

25-30 mg dbol is plenty. Hell, I never go over 30 mg. Anything higher isn't worth it as the sides pile up and you don't really get any addional benefit.

An AI is really a smart choice....you're running test and dbol. Controlling estrogen has more benefits than just protecting your tits, both during and after your cycle.


why you running pct when you will still have test active in your blood system?


IF you look a few posts up, you'll see that that was cleared up. Thanks for the feedback though!


So, just a quick update: I ended up not getting proviron or Adex, but my guy did have Letrozole. I'm gonna stick to that for my AI. Is that substantial enough? Should i run it the entire time? Maybe just towards the end to shave off some water? Or, should i only use it ICE?


So I'm not the only one who thinks proviron is useless, eh?


Has anyone ever heard someone or read someone say "man am I glad I added this proviron to my cycle!" lol


Bump for some help on the dosage of my letro. Each tab is 2.5mg, what is a good dosage? I've heard a half E3D? I've even heard less. Any help is welcome