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Critique My 5/3/1 Routine + Any Tips

Thank you to everyone that replied, I really appreciate it.
How much weight would you recommend I aim to gain a week based on my level on experience etc. I would set my macros accordingly. I use a spreadsheet to track weekly average weigh ins and I would use it for the bulk as well. I am hoping to compete in October bringing an 800lb total.

How does this new setup look?

I do HIIT on the elliptical a few times a week just to keep cardiovascular health.

Squat 5/3/1
Deadlift or RDL 5x10
Bulgarian Squat 3x10
Calves 3x10

Bench 5/3/1
Overhead Press 5x10
DB Bench Variation 3x10
Lateral Raise 3x10
Dips 3x6, Overhead Tricep Extensions3x10

Deadlift 5/3/1
Squat 5x10
Pull-up 3x6
Barbell Row/DB Row/Supported Row 3x10
Ez Bar Curl 3x6, Alternating DB Curl 3x10

Overhead Press 5/3/1
Bench 5x10
Machine Shoulder Press 3x10
DB Bench Variation
Close-Grip Bench or Dips 3x6, Tricep Pushdowns 3x10

Accessory Day
ATK Rack Pull 3x6
Leg Press or Lunge 3x10
Glute-Ham Raise or Single Leg RDL 3x10
Pulldowns 3x10
Face-Pull 3x12
Biceps 3x10
Calves 3x10

Just do this as is for 8-12 weeks and see what happens.

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Your set up is somewhat close to the 531 BBB program, but with different assistance exercises and an extra accessory day. I think it’s too much work in a week, and even though you don’t think so on paper it will hinder your strength gains. I think you should drop the extra “accessory” day, and lose some of the pushing accessory in favor pulling. For example, on the OHP day, after your OHP and 5x10 bench, do 1 pull accessory (rows, chins, curls,etc…), 1 push (dips, pull downs - not more BP), and a core/lower (HLR, goblet squat, roll out, etc…). That’s more the typical template for 531 programs.

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This must be a troll thread.

Anyone who has read at least one 5/3/1 book or even this forum is not so retarded to write a program like this. Extra accessory day! common man sort it out and follow a proper program.

New setup still looks like shit. Run the original for a few cycles and then decide what to do. Don’t write up your own shit at this point in your life. Run it as written

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Bad. As others have said, you should probably just do the program Wendler wrote as he wrote it, no added assistance day, keep the supplemental work (second lift) the same as the main lift, and adjust the assistance work.

Regarding 5x10 work, though Wendler has noted somewhere that you can switch the lift (e.g., 5/3/1 Squat then 5x10 Deadlift), he very clearly usually recommends sticking to the same lift (e.g., 5/3/1 Squat then 5x10 Squat). In fact, here is what Wendler wrote yesterday on a different thread of this forum for someone (and this seems to be his go-to recommendation):

“FSL” is first set last (i.e., using the first work set’s weight). The 3 categories are push (pushups, dips, db press, or tricep pressdowns, etc.), pull (chin-ups, facepulls, curls, etc.), and single leg or core (ab work, lower back work, lunges, etc.). In general, pick one exercise for each category to do 25-50 reps (number of sets for that will vary).

That is a good program and you will get stronger doing it. There is not really reason to go more complicated than that at this point in your training. Since you are new to the program, I would suggest just doing that for the next 3 cycles, then you can try a higher volume variation like Boring But Big, Hardgainer, or whatever (again, just doing it as written).

Hey bro

I second this whole heartedly. Just run it exactly as it is written. Don’t change Jack shit. He gives some freedom for certain things, stay within the given boundaries. I myself am currently at the end of 6 weeks of this. It’s a great program. It’s tough, not boring, and I feel like I am doing quality work whole at the same time not killing myself. Give it a go

Hey man thanks for the reply, what does PRO mean?

Alright after reading beyond 531 and 531, and including some of the feedback this is what I got

5/3/1 Joker Sets + FSL

Squat 5/3/1
Jokers increase of 5-10% each set until set cannot be completed (5 reps on 5 week, 3 reps on 3 week, 1 rep on 1 week)
FSL for 3-5 sets of 5-8
25 to 50 reps light Assistance

Bench 5/3/1
Jokers increase of 5-10% each set until set cannot be completed (5 reps on 5 week, 3 reps on 3 week, 1 rep on 1 week)
FSL for 3-5 sets of 5-8
25-50 reps light Assistance

Deadlift 5/3/1
Jokers increase of 5-10% each set until set cannot be completed (5 reps on 5 week, 3 reps on 3 week, 1 rep on 1 week)
FSL for 3-5 sets of 5-8
25-50 reps light Assistance

OHP 5/3/1
Jokers increase of 5-10% each set until set cannot be completed (5 reps on 5 week, 3 reps on 3 week, 1 rep on 1 week)
FSL for 3-5 sets of 5-8
25-50 reps light Assitance

NO EXTRA DAY! lol

Not sure about the Joker increases.
In Forever, where Jokers are addressed better than Beyond, the recommendation is +5-10% load, max 1-2 sets of max 1-3 reps and you DON’T have to miss - so there is no “until the set cannot be completed”.
The one you posted I think is from Beyond, but Beyond is intended for more advanced lifters, I wouldn’t use that progression until you have a lot more experience, sticking with the Forever recommendations.

It’s 5’s Progression for the main work instead of PR sets - basically, all your sets have 5 reps. 65/75/85% x5 lightest week; 70/80/90% x5 medium week; 75/85/95% x5 heaviest week. No PR sets, focus on technique and keeping a solid bar speed.
This should allow you to do 2 sets of 3 reps on Jokers without missing and without grinding, especially if you pick an 85%-ish TM.

What does PRO mean?

I just read beyond 5/3/1 and this seems to be what he recommends:

Sorry for aggravating everyone here I know to you all these are very dumb questions and responses.

5/3/1 Joker Sets + FSL

Squat 5/3/1
Jokers increase of 5-10% each set until set cannot be completed (5 reps on 5 week, 3 reps on 3 week, 1 rep on 1 week)
FSL for 3-5 sets of 5-8
Assistance

Bench 5/3/1
Jokers increase of 5-10% each set until set cannot be completed (5 reps on 5 week, 3 reps on 3 week, 1 rep on 1 week)
FSL for 3-5 sets of 5-8
Assistance

Deadlift 5/3/1
Jokers increase of 5-10% each set until set cannot be completed (5 reps on 5 week, 3 reps on 3 week, 1 rep on 1 week)
FSL for 3-5 sets of 5-8
Assistance

OHP 5/3/1
Jokers increase of 5-10% each set until set cannot be completed (5 reps on 5 week, 3 reps on 3 week, 1 rep on 1 week)
FSL for 3-5 sets of 5-8
Assistance

NO ACCESORY DAY!

Better?

PRO is short for progression. 5’s PRO means doing all of the work sets for sets of 5, no matter the particular week, and no extra reps. As atlashrugged said: [quote=“atlashrugged, post:17, topic:230060”]
It’s 5’s Progression for the main work instead of PR sets - basically, all your sets have 5 reps. 65/75/85% x5 lightest week; 70/80/90% x5 medium week; 75/85/95% x5 heaviest week. No PR sets, focus on technique and keeping a solid bar speed.
[/quote]

Regarding:

Follow atlashrugged on this.

Yes, it is better, though I still don’t know why you don’t just try the actual program exactly as Wendler usually recommends (no jokers, FSL 5x5, etc.), then with that as a base adjust in the future (e.g., increasing FSL reps, adding jokers). In any case, as Aleister Crowley says, do what thou wilt.

Drop the jokers. You are not ready for them.

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I have a meet in October so I thought the jokers might be handy to get some higher % work in, should I do a cycle or two without them and then put them in for the last cycle?

So far I have

  1. Do BBB
  2. Do Hardgainer
  3. Do 5s PRO

Everyone seems to slightly disagree Lol

Do any of those. All will produce results.

Do HG if you want to add volume and mass, BBB if volume and mass, and 5’s PRO if you want to focus more on assistance/supplemental work and limit the main.

It’s simple really. I’m just happy as fuck you dropped the extras day to be honest

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Also, you really won’t profit much from jokers at this stage. Honestly, most people don’t at all until they have ran 531 for a bit and understand when they should train them. There are some people on different sites that have never faltered from the original programming. They just cycle between Triumvirate, BBB and FSL. Just doing those three programs over the course of the “long run” will produce great results. I would look over at Endurance Athlete Does 531 in the training log section as well. He made OUTSTANDING results just following basic 531 principals as well as staying in great running shape. It all just takes time brother, but if you follow the outline how you should, you will profit.

I like the look of both FSL and BBB so I’ll decide between those two, you would recommend to do the same movement as the 5/3/1 for that day and not do the opposite right? To be clear for BBB and FSL you still do a bit of assistance after your done those sets right? Such as a Pull and a Single-Leg/Core?

Should I run the assistance as if it was an upper lower? Or do 1 push 1 pull 1 leg every single workout?

From what I can gather from reading this forum, it seems the man himself recommends something like this lately:

Cycle 1-2: 5’s PRO + 5x5 x FSL (Leader)
Cycle 3: 5/3/1 + 3x5 x FSL (Anchor)

Deload on week 7 and 11.

A template based on this could look like this:

Day 1:
Press: 5’s PRO or 5/3/1
Press: FSL x 5x5 or 3x5
Lats/Upper back: 50-100 total reps
Biceps/Triceps

Day 2:
Squat: 5’s PRO or 5/3/1
Squat: FSL x 5x5 or 3x5
Back raises: 3x10
Abs.

Day 3:
Bench: 5’s PRO or 5/3/1
Bench: FSL x 5x5 or 3x5
Lats/Upper back: 50-100 total reps
Biceps/Triceps

Day 4:
DL: 5’s PRO or 5/3/1
DL: FSL x 5x5 or 3x5
DB Lunges: 3x10 per leg
Abs.

Mr Wendler is at the moment recommending a different assistance protocoll than what I have put up here, If you would rather follow that protocoll, it is simply:

After main lift do: 25-50 reps of pushing (push ups, dips etc), pulling (chins, rows etc) and single leg/core work (lunges, back raises, leg raises etc).

I may be wrong on some of this, so someone feel free to correct me if I am wrong.