T Nation

Crazy High SHBG - ZMA, Boron, Danozole?

Latest lab results posted below. SHBG is REALLY HIGH. Not even sure what has caused this?? My protocol for the last 3 months has been:

30mcg cytomel (30mcg triiodothyronine)
2grains armour thyroid (76mcg thyroxine/18mcg triiodothyronine)
Daily dose of iodine, selenium, D3, K2, DHEA, fish oil, and Stinging Nettle root.
Did 10 weeks on tesamorelin (similar to ipamorelin/sermorelin)

Doctor said she is really unsure what would cause my SHBG to go up so high. At the beginning of my treatment (labs at very bottom), I was put on a high dose of clomid, which you can see over time improved my total test, estradiol (which has always ran low), but raised my SHBG from already the high range, to incredibly high. The focus now is to simply lower SHBG, and she says by doing that, my free T, and estradiol will improve. She said to initally begin taking *Boron, and ZMA and if I don’t feel improvement, to begin taking Danozole. SHe said I could go ahead and take Danozole immediately though. Would ZMA and Boron be enough to quickly lower the SHBG? Or would Danozole be good to add to the mix right away? Anyon ewith experience of these? Do any of these medications have any negative side effects?

Also, not sure why my IGF-1 got lower? I was taking the tesamorelin to hopefully improve this. However, it went down. Doctor said thyroid can lower IGF-1. Not sure if the peptide treatment prevented it from lowering more, or if it simply didn’t do anything?

My thyroid numbers improved dramatically, which I was pleased with. A big reason I seeked treatment is because I could not stop gaining weight. Weight had not gotten under control. Doctor has removed the armour and said to continue to take 40mg T3.

Overall I am feeling much better than when I began. However, I’ve been on very low calorie intake to get the weight under control. Previously, I stayed this level of leanness on higher calories. Therefore, we’ll see how my body holds up now with increased calories on the improved thyroid.

I definitely wouldn’t say I feel bad, but I’m wondering what benefits I will notice with optimal free t, estradiol, and SHBG?

—CURRENT LABS—
Total Test - 754 (264-916 ng/dL)
Free Test - 7.5 (8.7-25.1pg/mL)
Estadiol sensitive 10.7 (8.0 - 35.0)
SHBG 117.5 (16.5 - 55.9)
LH - 3.8 (1.7-8.6)
Free T3 - 3.9 (2.2-4.4)
Reverse T3 15.6 (9.2 - 24.1)
TSH .006 (.450 - 4.500)
IGF-1 142 (88-246 ng/mL)
Free T4 - 1.05 (0.82 - 1.77)
DHEA 410.8 (138.5-475.2 ug/dL)

—Labs taken 5/15/19—
Testosterone, Serum 933 (264-916 ng/dL)
Free Testosterone(Direct) 18.2 (8.7-25.1pg/mL)
Estradiol, Sensitive 18.7 (8.0-35.0 pg/mL)
SHBG - 73.6 (16.5-55.9)
Luteinizing Hormone(LH) 3.5 (1.7-8.6)
Free T3 - 2.6 (2.2-4.4)
IGF-1 154 (88-246 ng/mL)
DHEA-Sulfate 436.9 (138.5-475.2 ug/dL)

-----Labs from 4/1/19--------
Total test 656 (264-916)
Free test 15.9 (8.7-25.1)
LH – 3.9 (1.7-8.6)
Estradiol Senitive – 12.6 (8-35)
SHBG not tested
Thyroid not tested

Labs from 2/11.19
Total test 579 (264-916)
Free test 10.9 (8.7-25.1)
LH – 2.7 (1.7-8.6)
Estradiol Senitive – 7.4 (8-35)
SHBG 58.6 (16.5 – 55.9)
TSH 2.090 uIU/mL 0.450 - 4.500 01
Thyroxine (T4) 5.4 ug/dL 4.5 - 12.0 01
Triiodothyronine (T3) 81 ng/dL 71 - 180 01
Triiodothyronine (T3), Free 2.4 pg/mL 2.0 - 4.4 01
T4,Free(Direct) 1.23 ng/dL 0.82 - 1.77 01
Reverse T3, Serum A 13.8 ng/dL 9.2 - 24.1 01
Thyroid Peroxidase (TPO) Ab 18 IU/mL 0 - 34 01
Thyroglobulin Antibody <1.0 IU/mL 0.0 -0.9

On Wed, Aug 14, 2019 at 6:22 AM Ben Kirchner benkirchner@gmail.com wrote:

Latest lab results posted below. SHBG is REALLY HIGH. Not even sure what has caused this?? My protocol for the last 3 months has been:

30mcg cytomel (30mcg triiodothyronine)
2grains armour thyroid (76mcg thyroxine/18mcg triiodothyronine)
Daily dose of iodine, selenium, D3, K2, DHEA, fish oil, and Stinging Nettle root.
Did 10 weeks on tesamorelin (similar to ipamorelin/sermorelin)

Doctor said she is really unsure what would cause my SHBG to go up so high. At the beginning of my treatment (labs at very bottom), I was put on a high dose of clomid, which you can see over time improved my total test, estradiol (which has always ran low), but raised my SHBG from already the high range, to incredibly high. The focus now is to simply lower SHBG, and she says by doing that, my free T, and estradiol will improve.

Also, not sure why my IGF-1 got lower? I was taking the tesamorelin to hopefully improve this. However, it went down. Doctor said thyroid can lower IGF-1. Not sure if the peptide treatment prevented it from lowering more, or if it simply didn’t do anything?

My thyroid numbers improved dramatically, which I was pleased with. A big reason I seeked treatment is because I could not stop gaining weight. Weight had not gotten under control. Doctor has removed the armour and said to continue to take 40mg T3.

Overall I am feeling much better than when I began. However, I’ve been on very low calorie intake to get the weight under control. Previously, I stayed this level of leanness on higher calories. Therefore, we’ll see how my body holds up now with increased calories on the improved thyroid.

I definitely wouldn’t say I feel bad, but I’m wondering what benefits I will notice with optimal free t, estradiol, and SHBG?

—CURRENT LABS—
Total Test - 754 (264-916 ng/dL)
Free Test - 7.5 (8.7-25.1pg/mL)
Estadiol sensitive 10.7 (8.0 - 35.0)
SHBG 117.5 (16.5 - 55.9)
LH - 3.8 (1.7-8.6)
Free T3 - 3.9 (2.2-4.4)
Reverse T3 15.6 (9.2 - 24.1)
TSH .006 (.450 - 4.500)
IGF-1 142 (88-246 ng/mL)
Free T4 - 1.05 (0.82 - 1.77)
DHEA 410.8 (138.5-475.2 ug/dL)

—Labs taken 5/15/19—
Testosterone, Serum 933 (264-916 ng/dL)
Free Testosterone(Direct) 18.2 (8.7-25.1pg/mL)
Estradiol, Sensitive 18.7 (8.0-35.0 pg/mL)
SHBG - 73.6 (16.5-55.9)
Luteinizing Hormone(LH) 3.5 (1.7-8.6)
Free T3 - 2.6 (2.2-4.4)
IGF-1 154 (88-246 ng/mL)
DHEA-Sulfate 436.9 (138.5-475.2 ug/dL)

-----Labs from 4/1/19--------
Total test 656 (264-916)
Free test 15.9 (8.7-25.1)
LH – 3.9 (1.7-8.6)
Estradiol Senitive – 12.6 (8-35)
SHBG not tested
Thyroid not tested

Labs from 2/11.19
Total test 579 (264-916)
Free test 10.9 (8.7-25.1)
LH – 2.7 (1.7-8.6)
Estradiol Senitive – 7.4 (8-35)
SHBG 58.6 (16.5 – 55.9)
TSH 2.090 uIU/mL 0.450 - 4.500 01
Thyroxine (T4) 5.4 ug/dL 4.5 - 12.0 01
Triiodothyronine (T3) 81 ng/dL 71 - 180 01
Triiodothyronine (T3), Free 2.4 pg/mL 2.0 - 4.4 01
T4,Free(Direct) 1.23 ng/dL 0.82 - 1.77 01
Reverse T3, Serum A 13.8 ng/dL 9.2 - 24.1 01
Thyroid Peroxidase (TPO) Ab 18 IU/mL 0 - 34 01
Thyroglobulin Antibody <1.0 IU/mL 0.0 -0.9

Are you taking testosterone or no? Danazol will lower shbg but will also lower your natural production. There isn’t a good way to only reduce SHBG.

All the zma type stuff is a waste of time IMO. Go for TRT, add danazol later if still needed.

FYI my shbg is 150+, haha.

The doctor suggests not to go the TRT route. Says my total test is good at this point. Just need to free it up by bringing the SHBG down. Given fertility is important to me, I’d like to stay off the TRT train if I’m able, while hopefully improving the areas in need.

As soon as you get your shbg down TT is going to drop like crazy. TRT is the answer whether she/you like it or not.

HCG and FSH can help keep your fertility. But you’re going to need more T in my opinion with free T that low.

Danazol will shut down your natural production the same way testosterone does, so I don’t really see the difference

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He is right. Unfortunately the only sensible way to lower SHBG without tanking your total T is TRT. Everything else will trigger the negative feedback loop.
I know guys who have struggled a lot with lowering SHBG and one of the best TRT doctors Keith Nichols says never to do that.

Thyroid will increase SHBG, which is why many PCOS patients respond so well when it is optimal.

@highpull I didn’t know thyroid increased SHBG. The nurse at Defy Medical was confused why my SHBG went up. Defy’s plan was to keep me on 40mcg Cytomel moving forward, remove stinging nettle root, and add Boron and ZMA. On this, am I bound to keep my SHBG high? I will say that the cytomel has gotten my weight in order, which was previously unmanageable.

I doubt boron is going make a huge difference in your SHBG. There’s a guy on here taking around 20mg daily so maybe that may have a greater impact but at 3mg daily mine didn’t change at all after 6 months (although I wasn’t trying to change it either).

Maybe, TRT will usually lower it at least some. It is often necessary to run testosterone up there in order to get free testosterone to a decent level.

So at this point, this is my protocol:

  • 40mcg Cytomel daily (30mcg in morning, 10mcg in late afternoon)
  • 10mg Boron at noon daily (along with iodine, selenium, D3, K2, fish oil)
  • ZMA & DHEA before bed.

I want to get the SHBG lower. I am hoping the addition of Boron & ZMA will do this? This is what Defy Medical suggests. From reading, I hear Danazol might lower SHBG, but also shut down natural Testosterone production?

What benefits might I see from lowering my SHBG, and thus raising Test and Estrogen to a better number? My health has improved as far as the thyroid getting my weight in check. Weight is good, energy is pretty good, libido is fine. What improvements might I see from improving these other numbers? Curious to @systemlord has to say?

And if TRT is truly the only course of action to achieve the intended result, how effective is preserving fertility by pairing with other things, like HCG? Family planning within the next 2 years. Are there any other negative side affects, outside of fertility, and hair loss if male patern baldness is in your genes?

Thanks for all input.

TRT+HCG+FSH injections. It seems optimal Free T is just outside your grasp do to high SHBG, TRT will do a good job of lowering SHBG and increasing Free T to the optimal ranges.

It would be a good idea to freeze sperm.

If you have the genes, TRT will accelerate hair loss.