T Nation

Concerned and Need Advice

In my first thread I addressed my concerns about the Test E I was taking. Most people seemed to think it was underdosed- thus I bumped it up from 500mg (250 E3D) to 750mg (375 E3D)

The results of that have been- some break outs on my skin (forearms and legs) and I think NOW I can actually see/feel my testicular atrophy. No strength gains, 1 lb weight gain.

Now, what actually concerns me- last night I was at a concert, standing for hours. I get home and notice a DENT in my shin. It is HUGE. My legs were really really stiff as well, to the point where I couldn’t bend me knees all the way. I’ve got a family history of blood-clots, so I tend to not take matters like this lightly. I called my mom at 4 a.m. (sorry!) to get a quick diagnosis- she figured I was just severely dehydrated- told me to sleep with my legs elevated + drink liquids.

So at some point during the night, the dent went away, but I woke up with two numb toes and a swollen/ possibly water retaining knee (which I still have 12+ hours later) My legs are still really tight too. My injection site(s) (ventroglute) seems to be stiff and somewhat sore when pressed as well. I think that could be just because I’m putting more in there now than before.

Nobody I’ve asked can shed any light on this, and I just want to know if it’s AS related or not (or bad/fake gear related).

Your avatar seems no worse for the wear. I don’t know if it’s just me, but I have difficulty seperating the OP from the avatar as I am very visual like most men. In fact I would even admit that a person’s avatar has a fairly significant effect on how respected the OP will be. Of course intelligent posts can go a long way in correcting that. Case in point, Brooks recent avatar. I liked his old ones much better and struggled to maintain my high level of respect for him during that period. Luckily he has now removed his avatar and I guess will be adding a new one soon. Another example - Bonez - Love his new avatar. Didn’t like the old one very much. End of rant…

I am sorry to hear of your experience with test e. I just went through a similar problem with some bogus dbol. I took it for a week and didn’t feel any of the positives of dbol, but did feel quite a few undesirable effects. I stopped cold turkey and chalked it up to “shit happens”. I will not use that source or brand again although I cannot be sure the brand was at fault or if the old switheroo or counterfeiting was to blame.

That said if you are several weeks into your test e cycle and feel no improved recovery or strength and have not started to put on a few pounds, and in addition experiencing negative sides, then I think you can safely say it is not agreeing with you. With this ester it is a little more difficult than a short ester to determine if the increased strength and recovery will materialize since some people take up to 5 weeks on test e to get up a good head of steam.

I guess you can chalk it up to experience until you know how you respond to good test e. That comes (unfortunately) with trial and error and discering source research.

As for you symptoms, I can’t shed light on the possible cause. Others with more medical experience may chime in.

Good luck…

I can’t speak directly to your AAS issues as contributing, but I think that you highlighted the real cause yourself: standing for hours in one place. I have a lot of experience with doing that and have had similar concerns. The worst in my case was gunning on a 16hr mission…of which 14 hours my feet/lower legs were completely and totally numb. The doc told me it was a good way to get blood clots. I’ve never experienced that from concerts though, thank god.

My advice would be that since you seem to have a history of blood clots and are susceptible to them: limit your standing in one place time, perhaps consider wearing those socks they give people in hospitals to prevent blood clots from inactivity when you do go to shows, and stop connecting every little problem you have with AAS.

When on cycle I understand that any little change can be cause for concern, but really I think you’re taking two unrelated items and connecting them.

Good luck.

Dynamo Hum, enjoyed the rant I know what you mean lol.

Were all the symptoms, other than both legs being somewhat numb etc…, on the same side that you pinned?

Shit, 750mg/wk and only 1lb worth of weight gain. You didn’t mention the use of an AI so your lack of weight gain is even more odd. Bad gear or its time to switch hobby

[quote]whotookmyname wrote:
Were all the symptoms, other than both legs being somewhat numb etc…, on the same side that you pinned?[/quote]

It was only my right knee/foot that was messed up. My right VG was the last one pinned, but it was a day or two before the show.

[quote]Growing_Boy wrote:
Shit, 750mg/wk and only 1lb worth of weight gain. You didn’t mention the use of an AI so your lack of weight gain is even more odd. Bad gear or its time to switch hobby[/quote]

I have adex, but have only been taking .125mg E3D/E4D or so because I wasn’t having any sides. When I had first started around .25 EOD I was experiencing signs of too low estrogen.

The 1lb weight gain is all I’ve experienced since bumping it up a little over a week ago. Overall I’m up 22 lbs from start- I attribute 16-17 lbs of that to Dbol though.

Thanks to everyone else for answering too. I’ll see about getting the avatar changed :wink:

Don’t get me wrong. I actually love that avatar. That is one of the most attractive women I have ever seen. She is tantalizing & mesmorizing. I just have trouble relating to you as a male when I see her.

I need some advice. I have been lifting for a while and cant seem to make any real gains and am real tired all the time. I went to the doc to see what was wrong. H edid bloodwork and it came back that I had low test only 203ng\dl. He didn’t offer any real help at all other than androgel and that stuff really sucks and does not work. I have tried to get my hands on some test through my urologist but all he wants to do is give an injection every two weeks in his office-no good. Even tried the online thing but scarred of being scammed… somebody help me out here

Graydog, you are hijacking Toby Queef’s thread. Check out “The over 35 lifter forum”, thay specialize in this. After browsing around a bit, start your own thread in the appropriate forum.

[quote]graydogg wrote:
I need some advice. I have been lifting for a while and cant seem to make any real gains and am real tired all the time. I went to the doc to see what was wrong. H edid bloodwork and it came back that I had low test only 203ng\dl. He didn’t offer any real help at all other than androgel and that stuff really sucks and does not work. I have tried to get my hands on some test through my urologist but all he wants to do is give an injection every two weeks in his office-no good. Even tried the online thing but scarred of being scammed… somebody help me out here[/quote]

Have you tried the androgel with bad results or are just assuming that it doesn’t work because it is not as effective as injections? Many people are doing fine on androgel.

No one is going to give a source out to someone with 2 posts. Get over that.

you say a total of 22 pounds gained.

thats not at all that bad.
I notice when I am on cycle gains come very fast (first 4 weeks)
then I gain nothing,unless I add more food.

I am thinking that you gained a bunch during your dbol run and now your not gaining anything because you are at your caloric limit.

have to remember,drugs do not make you gain weight, they only help you use your calories in order to gain the weight.

I will wager on the fact that you have not changed your diet since the start of your cycle.
every now and then if your natural or enhanced you need to adjust your diet every few weeks to maintain gains.

the leg thing is just you are not used to standing that long.
I am on my feet all day every day at work, until I was used to it I got the same way.
but I didn’t feel anything until after I woke up the next morning not able to move my legs.
don’t worry about it just walk around and move and get the blood flowing again in your legs.
drink plenty of water to avoid the clotting issue.
your legs have nothing to do with the gear,this I am sure of.

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
graydogg wrote:
I have tried to get my hands on some test through my urologist but all he wants to do is give an injection every two weeks in his office-no good. Even tried the online thing but scarred of being scammed… somebody help me out here

Have you tried the androgel with bad results or are just assuming that it doesn’t work because it is not as effective as injections? Many people are doing fine on androgel.

No one is going to give a source out to someone with 2 posts. Get over that. [/quote]

What a wanker. He wants a source already? Thats cute. Androgel is only good for being rubbed all over my chest while listening to Rihanna’s “Don’t Stop the Music” while grinding on my office chair. Merely because it feels sooooo good. LMAO! Seriously, I don’t like the method of admin. Furthermore I belive that whatever impact it does have on androgen levels its minimal at best.

growing boy wrote
What a wanker. He wants a source already? Thats cute. Androgel is only good for being rubbed all over my chest while listening to Rihanna’s “Don’t Stop the Music” while grinding on my office chair. Merely because it feels sooooo good. LMAO! Seriously, I don’t like the method of admin. Furthermore I belive that whatever impact it does have on androgen levels its minimal at best.

yea maybe I do but its cool I get it. yea androgel is no good

[quote]MaddyD wrote:
you say a total of 22 pounds gained.

thats not at all that bad.
I notice when I am on cycle gains come very fast (first 4 weeks)
then I gain nothing,unless I add more food.

I am thinking that you gained a bunch during your dbol run and now your not gaining anything because you are at your caloric limit.

have to remember,drugs do not make you gain weight, they only help you use your calories in order to gain the weight.

I will wager on the fact that you have not changed your diet since the start of your cycle.
every now and then if your natural or enhanced you need to adjust your diet every few weeks to maintain gains.

the leg thing is just you are not used to standing that long.
I am on my feet all day every day at work, until I was used to it I got the same way.
but I didn’t feel anything until after I woke up the next morning not able to move my legs.
don’t worry about it just walk around and move and get the blood flowing again in your legs.
drink plenty of water to avoid the clotting issue.
your legs have nothing to do with the gear,this I am sure of.

[/quote]

You’re right- I havn’t changed my diet. I’m still on the “eat as much as possible” diet because I have a difficult time trying to pound down 5k cal a day. Usually being on my feet isn’t that big of an issue- I walk, a lot, every day- to and from class, for food, etc. I’d say around 3-4 miles a day. I use to work a manual labor job where I was on my feet 12 1/2 hours a day and never had problems…so I just thought it was odd. Never had anything like a DENT in my leg.
The numbess seems to be going down. I was able to deadlift tonight without any issues…so just gonna keep an eye on it. We’ll see how it ends.

The drugs: I found in the past, when i had ‘underdosed’ gear - if i increased the dose i got a higher incidence of sides than results - this isnt just underdosing… but is common with crap gear.

The leg: Standing or sitting for extended periods (travelling, post surgery, etc.) is the A1 way to get DVT, and it is recommended to regularly exercise the lower limbs when in such a position - ie. dorsi and plantar flex the feet to exercise the flexors and extensors of the lower leg when sitting or take a walk… same when standing, sit for a while, take a walk - you get the point.
DVT can kill.

A manual labour job wont cause the issues of DVt as you have the blood flow stimulating the full use of the veins backflow valves.
(which is where DVT becomes an issue)

Hope you are feeling better.

@ Dynamo - point taken, i will get a pic of Dexter or Lee up ASAP :wink: I was showing my muscle retention (and fat! lol) after an extended break from the lifestyle - but i know what you mean.

Brook

My Medschool 2cents:

Swollen lower limbs/joints + the “dent” in your shin sounds like oedema from the increased blood volume and blood pressure because of the higher-dose test. You might have some genetic predisposition to it etc. Unfortunately I have no idea about what to do about it, sorry :confused:

On a side note I really doubt you need to worry about anything clot related while on test

[quote]Growing_Boy wrote:

Androgel is only good for being rubbed all over my chest while listening to Rihanna’s “Don’t Stop the Music” while grinding on my office chair. Merely because it feels sooooo good. LMAO! Seriously, I don’t like the method of admin. Furthermore I belive that whatever impact it does have on androgen levels its minimal at best. [/quote]

I lol-ed

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
graydogg wrote:
I need some advice. I have been lifting for a while and cant seem to make any real gains and am real tired all the time. I went to the doc to see what was wrong. H edid bloodwork and it came back that I had low test only 203ng\dl. He didn’t offer any real help at all other than androgel and that stuff really sucks and does not work. I have tried to get my hands on some test through my urologist but all he wants to do is give an injection every two weeks in his office-no good. Even tried the online thing but scarred of being scammed… somebody help me out here

Have you tried the androgel with bad results or are just assuming that it doesn’t work because it is not as effective as injections? Many people are doing fine on androgel.

No one is going to give a source out to someone with 2 posts. Get over that. [/quote]

yea your probably right about the source but it was worth a shot. I am new in here but dont be so weary of me although I do understand. But to answer your question Yes I have a prescription for androgel because I have low - t and it does not help much at all cant seem to get my hands on any injectible to save my life f83u#$%%^&^*(!@#$%

[quote]graydogg wrote:

yea your probably right about the source but it was worth a shot. I am new in here but dont be so weary of me although I do understand. But to answer your question Yes I have a prescription for androgel because I have low - t and it does not help much at all cant seem to get my hands on any injectible to save my life f83u#$%%^&^*(!@#$%
[/quote]

If you have a script for androgel, then just talk to your doc.

Tell him that the gel is bothering you, making you skin itchy, burn, whatever. Tell him you still feel tired etc.

Ask him if you can move to injections. Doc will probably want to administer those himself monthly or something, but atleast your off the gel.

Also we already decided collectively that you a cop, because everyone is a cop till proven otherwise, which doesn’t even matter because we don’t even do steroids, we pretend we do so we can act all hard on the internet.

[quote]GGlife wrote:
My Medschool 2cents:

Swollen lower limbs/joints + the “dent” in your shin sounds like oedema from the increased blood volume and blood pressure because of the higher-dose test. You might have some genetic predisposition to it etc. Unfortunately I have no idea about what to do about it, sorry :confused:

On a side note I really doubt you need to worry about anything clot related while on test[/quote]

I looked into some of the symptoms/causes of DVT and edema…and now I’m wondering whether or not I should get my leg checked out. If I was back home, I’d go absolutely- but out here, it takes MONTHS to get in- unless you go to the ER which I really do not want to or think I need to do at this point.

My ankle had been completely swollen for awhile and my shoes were tighter, but I figured it was just water retention. My ankles are actually looking a little better than they were now…The cycle is almost over, so I thought I’d be good to cruise through then have it checked out when I get home in 3 weeks.

And now I feel like I’m high-jacking my own thread- why are people talking about androgel and shit in this thread? GTFO plz.