Hmm. Well, best as I can tell, DOMS come out after a lot of negative or eccentric work. I did some moderate high rep flies and tri stuff. Didn’t think it was that tough, but then again I have a tendency to push my body in the ground if I’m not careful. After all that 5 x 5 stuff, didn’t feel light weights and hi reps would be a problem.
Bear in mind the DOMS wasn’t much, barely noticed it.
What is the “something physiologic” that can cause it?
like you said, DOMS are greater from slow negatives, and higher reps (but still at least moderately heavy)
thats been my experience, and i read it somewhere too hah.
Generally whatever i’ve not been doing lately though will give me DOMS. to be honest i kind of like it as long as its not too intense.
There isn’t a good consensus on the mechanism behind DOM’s. Many believe its micro-tears in the muscle fiber which is repaired in short order. Lactic Acid, which may contribute to the symptoms is probably not the cause. From what I’ve read, Lactic Acid actually helps in the repair process. There also is some consensus that the eccentric portion of the lift has a greater contribution, but still the mechanism is not clear.
I’m so use to DOM’s and minor injuries that living without it doesn’t feel normal. So how twisted is that?
Well well looky what came out of the woodwork.
[quote]Crushed_Idiot wrote:
Take a gallon jug of water to class. You’ll look bad ass and you get to do strip sets of biceps curls as you empty the jug. Bad ass.[/quote]
Actually I think I hip flask would be way cooler, impress the students.
[quote]minimaltechno wrote:
Well well looky what came out of the woodwork.
[quote]Crushed_Idiot wrote:
Take a gallon jug of water to class. You’ll look bad ass and you get to do strip sets of biceps curls as you empty the jug. Bad ass.[/quote]
Actually I think I hip flask would be way cooler, impress the students.[/quote]
Yeah MT, just getting back to it slowly. Nothing of import to report.
Hip flask would be very cool, but the ultimate for business casual stealth would be multiple catheter bags tied all the way up both legs plumbed to a straw that peaks up behind the collar.
I attribute a increase in the duration of the DOMS to poor intact of fluids before and during workout (mild/mod dehydration). And poor food choices set you up physiologically for a higher incidence of DOMS. As old man stated the mechanism s at work are poorly understood. The guys that I used to do strongman with would say never show up to a workout dehydrated and always bring a gallon of water. During long workouts we would eat a bagel or two. One time I did neither and had the worst DOMS ever.
Oh, dear god. They’d call campus security.
Hmm. I keep drinking all through the workout, even to the point of taking a piss halfway through sometimes. And I’m touchy to gluten, so no bagels.
Bottom line: I don’t get DOMS from the 5 x5. I did get some from the deload, but did hi reps with a good amount of negative, so I’ll attribute the DOMS to that. Once I get used to an exercise and keep doing it, no more DOMS.
OK, good news. The mystery meeting with the boss did not lead to a pink slip. (I’m paranoid.) It was a standard meeting, and he even said lots of nice things about me.
Bad news: car is back in the shop, and the estimate nearly had me hyperventilating. It will damn near pulp my bank account to where I’ll have to be careful not to get checks bouncing, and no, that’s not hyperbole. Third time in the garage, and each time a financial choker. And because this threw off my schedule, no workout tonight. Couldn’t work it in. Hope I can get Friday’s. Very upset.
Well, I made it back. Couldn’t work out Wednesday cuz had to take car to shop and get the last of its problems fixed. Stressful. Cost a fortune and a half. Loaner car acted like it was about to die any minute. Super busy grading and lesson plans at 2 schools. A student screamed at me last week . Mystery meeting at work - would they hand out pink slips?
OK.
Loaner car turned out fine. Boss agreed weird student is weird. Meeting was very pleasant, boss had very good things to say about me. Spring Break starts at one school. Picked up car, running better than ever, could barely hold it under the speed limit. Big, big relief all around. Which may be why work out went so well.
Squat
85 x 5
105 x 5
135 x 5
135 x 5
just bouncing up and down, not even pausing
OH press will cut back weight a bit
45 x 5
65 x 5
75 x 5
85 x 5 pretty good control, will try a bit more
90 x 5 went very well
At Ludus Magnus, trainer told me to start OH press as if doing front squat - elbows up, wrists back. but just doesn’t feel strong. So tried keeping wrists straight all the way through. Seems to work.
Deadlift will cut back a little, because last time hit failure at 245
105 x 5
135 x 5
195 x 5
225 x 5
felt good. disappointed using such low weight, but good workout
Cybex ab
115 x 12
115 x 12
hmm, last time 115 practically killed me, now just zip up and down. sure wish main lifts could grow like that.
Your body strength is very symmetrical and balanced. That core strength is impressive.
Solid work, Cav, keep it up!
Sucks about the car. My sister’s Tahoe just fried an engine with < 80k on it and just out of the 5 year power train warranty. The dealer got Chevy to kick in about 70% because of a known defect in the lifters and good service records, but it sill cost her $3800. If Chevy didn’t kick in it would have been a total disaster. The good news is she got a brand new 2013 engine out of the deal and a brand new power train warranty.
You know GV, even though my body seems somewhat misshapen, long legs, long arms, etc, my lifts are following almost perfectly the standard ratio - bench squat deads are at 3:4:5. Also, I did tons of core strengthening years ago to deal with my scoliosis.
At Ludus Magnus, I watched one guy do crunches on a decline bench while holding a 100 lb stone ball. That’s my goal.
Jack, sorry about your sister’s car. I know it’s a bummer. Which reminds me - need to check if insurance will cover it. They paid for the towing, which was a relief.
[quote]cavalier wrote:
Which reminds me - need to check if insurance will cover it. They paid for the towing, which was a relief.[/quote]
You will need to tie it to an “occurrence” unrelated to mere mechanical failure caused by wear and tear or a defective part, assuming you are not talking about extended warranty coverage. For insurance, things like hitting a curb, a jarring bump, pot hole, or some sort of accidental or jarring contact with something else that caused the failure is required to trigger coverage. Generally contact that causes a warn part to fail is enough, even if the part was otherwise about to fail, but the insurance company may fight over whether the warn part independently failed.
Jack, they reimbursed me for the towing, even though it wasn’t occurence related. I don’t expect much else to be covered, but will check.
Had a pretty sleepless night last night. Doing lots of soul searching. Yesterday’s workout was dismal. Doing the 5 x 5 for the past few months, I started out well below my maxes. Hence I could make progress almost every week. Was hoping to blast through my former barriers. No go - I hit the wall hard. Had to take down deads and OH presses. Now squats and bench were a problem. Had eaten like a maniac Saturday and slept like a baby, you’d think I’d be a bear the next day, right?
Squat
85 x 5
105 x 5
135 x 5
155 x 5 getting tough
190 x 3 barely made it
several years ago, did 185 x 5, now can barely do 190 x 3 or 5. A glimmer of hope, but quickly snuffed out by bench:
Bench
55 x 5
75 x 5
95 x 5
125 x 5 rough
145 x 3
All three were grinders. Straining, shoving, I even screamed on the last one. My god - I’m just not going up in bench at all
Bar row
65 x 5
75 x 5
95 x 5
115 x 5
135 x 3 could barely get this one
Dips
x 4 wow, hard
x 0 - FAILURE
x 0 - FAILURE
got a little too low, and just stopped dead - straining, grunting, shaking, simply would not go up.
Walked out of the gym in total disgust.
Thinking about just quitting lifting altogether. Have been tempted many times in the past forty years, but this really was the last straw. I mean quit completely.
Mulling it over, thinking about how the 5x5 might just not be enough work for my body. Last year, got some shoulder growth from reps for time. What’s the buzzword, time under tension? Working on a new program. Stay tuned.
i don’t think you should change programs. personally.
TUT TUT TUT Um what do you mean by quitting lifting?
Too bad its so expensive to get your T levels checked. Not that I know much about that only from here, but could be an issue for you. Maybe we can start a Tnation fund for Cav’s T Test?
Stick with the 5x5 Cav, I have ran it at least 4 times. If you want to hit more volume I suggest you SS every main exercise in antagonist fashion. When you bench, in between sets do a pulling movement. When you dead hit your triceps. When you squat hit your abs. I did that to get my inner BBer satisfied, always got bigger and stronger. Stick with it, it is not a cookie cutter program.
Thanks, everyone. Techno, I just signed up health insurance, policy is supposed to offer free checkups, so possibly T testing is covered. Just haven’t had time yet to take advantage of it. (however if you still want to send money, I won’t say no.)
Matty, interesting suggestion about SS exercises. We did a fair amount of that at the last place. However, seemed like the one thing that really made a difference was band pulls for time. Shoulders really grew.
Another site where I blog another guy at my strength level is doing 20 rep squats only, and all his lifts are growing.
So I’m thinking of continuing the general 5 x 5 program, but kicking up time under tension.
One more thing. If you’ve read my blog, you know I’ve had a lot of bad experiences in my life with athletics. Ran across a web site by a sports psychologist who outlines basic treatment for trauma victims. Yes, a bad experience in sports is traumatic. So I tried some of the exercises he describes. Wow! Big difference. Will let you know how it works out.
OK. Wanted to do squats today, but schedule put me at the branch of the gym that has the round plates. So did deads instead.
OH press
45 x 20
65 x 12
65 x 7
whew, tougher than I expected, but got something of a pump in shoulders
Deadlifts
95 x 15
145 x 20
paused a couple of times to fix grip and catch breath, but not as hard as I expected. Just a little winded, no more. Promising.
Cybex Ab
115 x 16
will see how this works out.
20 rep deadlifts is always tough.