T Nation



I am cherry picking a post in this thread on FA



She now has a better option from where to get info. I am not discounting your research, and if you have a PhD I apologize for assuming you don't, but Bill Roberts does have a PhD and has spent years researching.

I am not advocating for steroids but neither am I condemning them.

I am suggesting a great resource that is available to answer her questions.



No, you are right to do so - ignorance breeds ignorance.

At least if she had current, non-biased and up-to date information on whatever drug or supp she wants to use, she can make the best decision for herself.

That is the important part i think, 'for herself' - if someone tells her to do something/not do something - it isn't ever going to be as personal a decision to her, than what she decides for herself based on the information she has aquired.



which is why I am hoping she will at least look over here. That toy_amazon has pretty much shut down her thread where all she did was ask a question.


Hey! Clenbuterol holds a very special place in my heart.

Who the F wrote that? Who, what, where exactly happened here?


It's obvious the toy_amazon person has, in fact, NOT done any research on clen. If the use of the words "meatheads" and "bro science" in the context of the exchange didn't tip her hand enough, the silly little quoted conversation containing her "advice" above seems to be a microcosm of what happens in the real world all the time regarding steroids (clenbuterol is not a steroid, btw, as that seems to be unclear above): A conversation begins in which person A mentions thinking about researching or perhaps even eventually trying a certain drug. Person B, adopting a haughty, knowledgeable, overtly judgmental demeanor, proceeds to attack the person with a melodramatic, emotional diatribe, usually attacking person A's character because person B is not actually informed enough to elucidate exactly why the drug in question is wrong. From this point, persons C through Z, being equally ignorant and sensing the status of an Alpha Male or female in their midst, jump to the aid of person B, effectively drowning out any rational argument or facts to the counter. These conversations are then passed on as "knowledge" by persons C through Z, person B walks away no more knowledgeable, but feeling superior, and person A has learned to not to ask questions, but will probably still experiment with said drugs, only now she will do so from an uninformed position, and is actually in MORE danger than she was before the initial conversation ever took place.

Are you reading this, toy_amazon? You are part of the problem!

Now, I happen to think taking clen IS stupid, but my reasoning has to do with the fact that, after having used it, I absolutely despise the feelings of jitters and anxiety that use of this drug entails. However, this alone will keep most users from using too much, and receptor down-regulation happens so quickly with clen that the drug is rendered pretty well ineffective after a couple of weeks. Also I have never found its fat-burning effects to be anything astounding, and personally opt for an ephedrine/caffeine/aspirin stack or, yes, good old HOT-ROX instead.

Second, just buying an "OTC fat burner!" has ACTUALLY led to irreparable damage to health and even death:


So, as a matter of fact, toy_amazon, your advice here is actually MORE DANGEROUS to this girl than if you had just kept your mouth shut about subjects upon which you are obviously ill-informed.

Finally, while I agree with the idea that getting your training and diet in order should be a top priority, in this case, suggesting an OTC fat burner but NOT clen seems just silly and a little ironic. They're both stimulants. I see no problem with getting your training and diet in order AND using a stimulant to accelerate the process of fat loss, and obviously toy_amazon does too. Only she has this emotional hang-up about clen and has decided, much like so many of the ill-informed masses, to go off on a high-and-mighty diatribe, railing against some girl who has a genuine curiosity to know the truth, and to shut down all further conversation on the matter.

What a shame.


thank you so much to all who posted!

I will be pasting this over for the ladies on FA to read.

you guys are the best.

thanks again.



Just wanted to give you an update that your post was well received. I received some PMs and one lady was brave enough to post in favor of you, and another offered her own experience.

Thanks again



I always recommend the shorter acting Albuterol instead of Clen - with this change, all the crappy negative sides of Clenbuterol can be avoided - but fat loss will still be accellerated.


I was actually curious to go and read the responses but I get an error message every time I try and access any area of the figure athlete forums. Wonder what that's all about...


It is actually shaping up pretty good. Some of the ladies have used Clen or had some other suggestions. But pretty much everyone said to get a lot of info before making any decisions

and they agreed the term "meathead" was a poor choice of words



Clen is nasty, but its a nuke in a gun fight. Nothing comes close to it. Nothing. The main concern is keeping the mass on but to a superior athlete or someone with a properly manipulated diet this issue can be minimized.


They are wary of your manly wiles... :wink:


it's true


Actually, DNP, can do more.

I'm not suggesting DNP for any of you ladies, just making a point that there are more powerful things out there, which can be just as, if not more dangerous.

Actually quite a few things will fall in that category. Albuterol, Clenbuterol, T3/T4, Anavar, Tren, etc. In the wrong, uneducated hands, anything is dangerous.

So if a guy passes on bad info it's called 'Bro Science', what is it called if a girl passes it on, 'H* science'?


Lol! I'm slow so I had to work it out for a few seconds before getting it :wink:


amphetamines, T3/T4, DNP

Theres stronger shit than clen, most users dont and shouldn't go higher than clen or albuterol however.

I dont use anything but albuterol anymore and I consider myself an advanced user.


Oh yeah, I picked up DNP a while back merely out of compulsion. I wouldn't consider running the stuff. I know there is stronger stuff but for my tastes, clen is my choice.