T Nation

CKD and beer

On a cyclical ketogenic diet such as the Anaboic Diet (or “Eat Like A Man”) and Lyle McDonald’s offerings, can you consume beer during the w/e carb-up? It wouldn’t make sense to do so, given the negatives associated with alcohol. However, it has carbs, and in Chirs’ “Eat Like A Man” article, he mentions drinking. Surely the quality of the carbs are important, or is it really irrelevant in terms of the weekly carb-up? A diet whereby you can go out on Saturday night and get pissed on the amber ale, and still lose fat, just doesn’t add up to me…

In the original Anabolic Diet book, Dr. DiPasquale says that if you want pizza and beer on the carb up, fine, have pizza and beer. He did not say to spend the weekend shitfaced. Remember, kiddies, you can drink without getting sloppy drunk.

Stick to quality carbs, but satisfy cravings if you think it’ll keep you on the diet and sane. Just keep things under control. When experimenting with the AD, I had one beer per weekend and lost fat fine. Obviously though, too much alcohol isn’t good on any diet. In fact, I’ve known quite a few young college guys that totally fuck up their bodybuilding efforts and fat loss diets with booze. It’s like they forget that alcohol has calories. Moderation, moderation, moderation.

Thanks for the confirmation, Chris.

James … it seems safe to assume from this post that the fat fast is off. I think I read that alcohol is one of the worst thyroid supressants. It has more or less the opposite effects of all the metabolic stimulants you have been shopping for ie it has the potential to slow metabolism. Plus if you want to lose weight you should limit late night carbs (esp alcohol). Whilst I agree entirely with Chris post, Id wager that he had absolutely top notch nutrition and training when he did this and had very little alcohol - I can remember reading that Chris has as little as 2 drinks per month and questioning my drinking habits. Not drinking during gaining and dieting cycles has had a greater effect on my results than anything and I can keep this up going out on weekends. I also find when dieting I almost go backwards if I have more than one drink without compensating with extra cardio or something. If you want to lose weight in a sensible and efficient manner get on dont diet and stop drinking and I wouldnt be surprised if you were close to where you want to be in 4 weeks. If you are having trouble starting a diet read JMB’s post in Dre Day. I also would recommend some consistent solid thinking to your training that you can relate to eg - the simplest and most common sense solutions to most things, including training and eating, are often the best (esp long term).

Dre, I’ve had a total re-think recently, and re-organised my priorities. My new program consists of a CKD, HIT workouts (2 full-body per week - back to basics), and morning cardio (light intensity, basically a 30 to 40 minute walk). I’m taking in 2000 calories - about 65% fat, 35% protein and whatever trace carbs are floating around in the P/F foods I’m eating. I’ll be having a weekly carb meal and a fortnightly carb-up day (based on Lyle’s CKD offerings for increased fat-loss). The Fat Fast is well and truly a thing of the past. I was being quite immature thinking a quick fix could work, especially without the supplements. Now to the Dre Day thread for John’s post…

Not only that, but alcohol drops your blood sugar, so beer or liquor is not an ideal carb up food. I use alcohol though to get myself into ketosis while on a CKD, and it treats me just fine.

Not a fan of HIT but it has its place and is probably ok here but hit the big lifts. Less of a fan of ketosis and the fact that JMB and successful bodybuilders arent makes me less keen on it so dont forget dont diet if it becomes a drag - other posts show ood results when coupled with cardio. Other than that, all Id really suggest is a good 5-10km run each day inlcuding after workouts, try your best to avoid the alcohol and if you need to drink, red wine will get you happy at about 10% of the calories of beer or bourbon and cokes.

Dre, interestingly I respond brilliantly to ketosis. Carbs mess with me big-time. I feel crap when I eat them. However, I’ve successfully lost weight (I used to be a big, big boy!) on a high carb, low fat diet in the past (when I was 15 or so) but the keto approach seems to be most appropriate now. I feel great on a keto-diet - energised even! Obviously different bodies respond in different ways. Given I’ve managed to build up a fairly large amount of muscle mass and strength (I have a high propensity to bulk up in all ways!) it is a priority of mine to conserve what I’ve got. It seems a CKD is suited to this (from what I’ve read), especially in light of how my body has responded to ketosis so far. As for my workout, I’m hitting the big lifts and really enjoying the HIT style that I’ve never tried before. One problem is working out twice a week. I’d much rather being in the gym 4 or 5 times a week working individual body parts - I can’t get enough of the gym! Maybe that’s why some people are understandably against HIT? Hehehe… :wink: I’m limiting my drinking to special occasions, and have been for some amount of time actually. In terms of taking things to the “next level”, drinking might see itself relegated to never, rather than rarely, in my social priorities. I’m not a fan of running in general (other than sprinting, which can be fun and has its place), so post-workout jogs won’t figure in my plans at this stage.

I think i heard ketosis was the surest way to lose maximum muscle - consider doing a post on it, maybe asking JMB directly. I think HIT has its place while gaining coming off or leading into higher volume, but for dieting you need alot more calorie burning so Id go for german body comp to burn cals (high reps and sets, low rests) or maybe some 5x5 or strength stuff because youll probably make most progress in the gym that way, and Id do 3-4 days weights plus alot of cardio. Whichever way you go, good luck. :slight_smile:

A question: Does anyone know the EXACT mechanism via which alcohol drops one’s blood sugar?

About the alcohol thing - I read somewhere that alcohol helps with ketosis, but only because it used the alcohol itself (not your fat) to turn into ketones. I never did research it to see if it was true since I rarely drink and never when I’m dieting (I only like mixed drinks and they have to much sugar).