[quote]Cortes wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]Cortes wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:<<< Big brouhahas aren’t really effective. Christians are won a person at a time. It’s when that person opens their heart to God, that’s when a Christian is made. [/quote]Despite the wooden Catholic phrasing this not too bad at all Pat. Ya scare me sometimes.
[quote]pat wrote:<<< There is a faction of Christianity under the banner of Calvinism that believes in predetermination (see tirib), >>>[/quote] See Tirib and the majority of the delegates to the first constitutional convention at the founding of this once great nation. Faction LOL!!! [quote]pat wrote:<<< most do not. >>[/quote]And look how much better off we are now!!! [quote]pat wrote:<<< The idea behind in a nut shell goes to “who are you to question God”, except God doesn’t say that. >>>[/quote] Romans 9:18-21 18-So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills.
19-You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will”? 20-But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this” 21Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use?
Hmmm. It looks like God actually does say that Pat. [quote]pat wrote:<<< It’s not really scriptural >>>[/quote]But it like really is though. [quote]pat wrote:<<< It’s fatalistic and hopeless. >>>[/quote]There are a few people here who know what is going on in my life right now. Pat, my dear old friend. My unshakable faith in the all governing decree and providence of an uncontingent almighty God in whose hand and by whose will my every breath is drawn is the ONLY thing that opens my eyes every morning. If I had to believe like you that MY faithfulness is what will see me through? I’d blow my brains out right now. Fatalistic and hopeless he says. Your God is a pathetic simpering weakling, wringing his hands in the hope that somebody will believe in Him.
Mine knew my name and gave me to His Son before He created the universe. All this time, dozens and dozens of posts and you have still have utterly ZEEROH comprehension of what I believe. Anybody who wants to know what I think should ask anybody other than my old pal Pat. [quote]pat wrote:<<< Now Cotes is right in the general argument Freewill vs. Determinism is a complicated one from a philosophical stand point. >>>[/quote] It’s an ultimately incomprehensible one from any standopint not grounded in faith in the one true and living God. [quote]pat wrote:<<< You cannot really ‘prove’ determinism and you cannot disprove freewill. >>>[/quote] I can and have. By the commonly accepted definitions of those two seemingly irreconcilable concepts. [quote]pat wrote:<<< Ironically, outside of Calvinism the greatest proponents for determinism are atheists. >>>[/quote] Actually that would be muslims. Who have a truly pagan fatalistic concept of determinism. With all due affection and respect to my buddy squating_bear. [quote]pat wrote:<<< Short answer is: no God does not force, determine or compel people to do evil.[/quote] Bless the Lord Pat you are absolutely correct. I have spelled this out to you in excruciating biblically philosophical terms more times than I can count. Even Cortes will not charge me with the belief that God coerces the will of man. I will find my quotes if I must. I have cited the confession of 1646 at least 25 times where the Westminster assembly denies that “violence” is done to the human will.
BTW. Email me would ya please. I want to talk to you about something that has nothing to do with any of this. Somebody please quote this so he can see it. He has me on ignore. It won’t take long to figure out why.
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By request, that Pat read this^^^
I am curious, why? What should I get out of it?[/quote]
No clue. Just offering to deliver a message as was requested. It’s the only time I intend to do this.
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Oh I see. Well nothing new here. No email contact will be established, there are few people I trust, and certainly don’t give my private email out will-nilly.
I gave tirib plenty of chances to act right and be right, he could not do it so he is on the outs, permanently. Sorry he used you as a messenger. I got the message a long time ago.
Don’t worry, you I trust.