T Nation

Case for Vegetarianism


A lifetime commitment to a vegan or lacto-vegetarian diet is a prerequisite for initiation into the Quan Vin Method. Foods from plant sources and dairy products are permitted on this diet, but all other foods from animal sources including eggs should not be eaten. There are many reasons for this, but the most important comes from the First Precept, which tells us to refrain from taking the life of sentient beings, or "Thou shalt not kill."

Not killing or otherwise harming other living creatures is of obvious benefit for them. Less obvious is the fact that refraining from harming others is equally advantageous for ourselves. Why? Because of the law of karma. "As ye sow, so shall ye reap." When you kill, or cause others to kill for you, in order to satisfy your desire for meat, you incur a karmic debt, and this debt must eventually be repaid.

So, in a very real sense, the keeping of a vegetarian diet is a gift which we give to ourselves. We feel better, the quality of our lives improves as the heaviness of our karmic indebtedness diminishes, and we are offered entrance into new subtle and heavenly realms of inner experience. It is well worth the small price you have to pay!

The spiritual arguments against eating meat are convincing for some people, but there are other compelling reasons for being a vegetarian. All of them are rooted in common sense. They have to do with issues of personal health and nutrition, ecology and the environment, ethics and animal suffering, and world hunger.

Health and Nutrition

Studies of human evolution have shown that our ancestors were vegetarian by nature. The structure of the human body is not suited for eating meat. This was demonstrated in an essay on comparative anatomy by Dr. G. S. Huntingen of Columbia University. He pointed out that carnivores have short small and large intestines. Their large intestine is characteristically very straight and smooth. In contrast, vegetarian animals have both a long small intestine and a long large intestine. Because of the low fiber content and high protein density of meat, the intestines do not require a long time to absorb nutrients; thus, the intestines of carnivores are shorter in length than those of vegetarian animals.

Humans, like other naturally vegetarian animals, have both a long small and large intestine. Together, our intestines are approximately twenty-eight feet (eight and a half meters) in length. The small intestine is folded back on itself many times, and its walls are convoluted, not smooth. Because they are longer than those found in carnivores, the meat we eat stays in our intestines for a longer period of time. Consequently, the meat can putrefy and create toxins. These toxins have been implicated as a cause of colon cancer, and they also increase the burden on the liver, which has the function of getting rid of toxins. This can cause cirrhosis and even cancer of the liver.

Meat contains a lot urokinase protein and urea, which add to the burden on the kidneys, and can destroy kidney function. There are fourteen grams of urokinase protein in every pound of steak. It living cells are put into liquid urokinase protein, their metabolic function will degenerate. Furthermore, meat lacks cellulose or fiber, and lack of fiber can easily create constipation. It is known that constipation can cause rectal cancer or piles.

The cholesterol and saturated fats in flesh also create cardiovascular disorders. Cardiovascular disorders are the number one leading cause of death in the United States.

Cancer is the second leading cause of death. Experiments indicate that the burning and roasting of flesh creates a chemical element (Methylcholanthrenel) which is a powerful carcinogen. Mice given this chemical develop cancers, such as bone tumors, cancer of the blood, cancer of the stomach, etc.

Research has shown that infant mice fed by a female mouse having breast cancer will also develop cancer. When human cancer cells were injected into animals, the animals also developed cancer. If the meat which we eat daily comes from animals that originally have such disorders, and we take them into our body, there is a good chance we will also get the diseases.

Most people assume that meat is clean and safe, that there are inspections done at all butcheries. There are far too many cattle, pigs, poultry, etc., killed for sale every day for each one to actually be examined. It's very difficult to check whether a piece of meat has cancer in it, let alone check every single animal. Currently, the meat industry just cuts off the head when it has a problem, or cuts off the leg which is diseased. Only the bad parts are removed and the rest is sold.

The famous vegetarian, Dr. J. H. Kellogg said, "When we eat vegetarian food, we don t have to worry about what kind of disease the food died of. This makes a joyful meal!"

There is yet another concern. Antibiotics as well as other drugs including steroids and growth hormones are either added to animal feed or injected directly into the animals. It has been reported that people eating these animals will absorb these drugs into their bodies. There is a possibility that antibiotics in meat are diminishing the effectiveness of antibiotics for human use.

There are some people who consider the vegetarian diet not sufficiently nourishing. An American surgical expert, Dr. Miller, practiced medicine for forty years in Formosa. He established a hospital there, where all the meals were vegetarian, for staff members as well as the patients. He said, "The mouse is one kind of animal which can support its life with both a vegetarian and non-vegetarian diet. If two mice are segregated, with one eating flesh and the other vegetarian food, we find that their growth and development are the same, but that the vegetarian mouse lives longer and has greater resistance to disease. Furthermore, when the two mice got sick, the vegetarian mouse recovered quicker." He then added, "The medicine given to us by modern science has improved greatly, but it can only treat illnesses. Food, however, can sustain our health." He pointed out that, "Food from plants is a more direct source of nutrition than meat. People eat animals, but the source of nutrition for the animals we eat is plants. The lives of most animals are short, and animals have nearly all the diseases that mankind has. It is very likely that the diseases of mankind come from eating the flesh of diseased animals. So, why don't people get their nutrition directly from plants?" Dr. Miller suggested that we only need cereals, beans and vegetables to gel all the nourishment we need to maintain good health.

Many people have the idea that animal protein is 'superior to plant protein because the former is considered a complete protein, and the latter is incomplete. The truth is that some plant proteins are complete, and that food combining can create complete proteins out of several incomplete protein foods.

In March 1988 the American Dietetic Association announced that: "It is the position of the ADA that vegetarian diets are healthful and nutritionally adequate when appropriately planned."

It is often falsely believed that meat eaters are stronger than vegetarians, but an experiment conducted by Professor Irving Fisher of Yale University on 32 vegetarians and 15 meat-eaters showed that vegetarians had more endurance than meat eaters. He had people hold out their arms for as long as possible. The outcome from the test was very clear. Among the 15 meat-eaters, only two persons could hold out their arms for fifteen to thirty minutes; however, among the 32 vegetarians, 22 persons held out their arms for fifteen to thirty minutes, 15 persons for over thirty minutes, 9 persons for over one hour, 4 persons for over two hours, and one vegetarian held his arms out for over three hours.

Many long distance track athletes keep a vegetarian diet for the time preceding competitions. Dr. Barbara More, an expert in vegetarian therapy, completed a one hundred and ten-mile race in twenty-seven hours and thirty minutes. A woman of fifty-six year s of age, she broke all the records held by young men. ' I want to be an example to show that people who take a whole vegetarian diet will enjoy a strong body, a clear mind, and a purified life.

Does the vegetarian get enough protein in his diet? The World Health Organization recommends that 4.5% of daily calories be derived from protein. Wheat has 17% of its calories as protein, broccoli has 45% and rice has 8%. It is very easy to have a protein rich diet without eating meat. With the additional benefit of avoiding the many diseases caused by high fat diets such as heart disease and many cancers, vegetarianism is clearly the superior choice.

The relationship between over consumption of meat, and other animal source foods containing high levels of saturated fats, and heart disease, breast cancer, colon cancer and strokes has been proven. Other diseases which are often prevented and sometimes cured by a low fat vegetarian diet include: kidney stones, prostate cancer, diabetes, peptic ulcers, gallstones, irritable bowel syndrome, arthritis, gum disease, acne, pancreatic cancer, stomach cancer, hypoglycemia, constipation, diverticulosis, hypertension, osteoporosis, ovarian cancer, hemorrhoids, obesity, and asthma.

Ecology and the Environment

Raising animals for meat has its consequences. It leads to rain forest destruction, global heat rising, water pollution, water scarcity, decertification, misuse of energy resources, and world hunger. The use of land, water, energy, and human effort to produce meat is not an efficient way to use the earth's resources.

Since 1960, some 25% of' Central America's rain forests have been burned and cleared to create pasture for beef cattle. It has been estimated that every four-ounce hamburger made from rain forest beef destroys 55 square feet of tropical rain forest. In addition, raising cattle contributes significantly to the production of three gases which cause global warming, is a leading cause of water pollution, and requires a staggering 2464 gallons of water for the production of each pound of beef. It only takes 29 gallons of water to produce a pound of tomatoes, and 139 gallons to produce a one pound loaf of whole wheat bread. Nearly half of the water consumed in the United States goes to the growing of feed for cattle and other livestock.

Many more people could be fed if the resources used to raise cattle were used to produce grain to feed the world's population. An acre of land growing oats produces 8 times the protein and 25 times the calories, if the oats are fed to humans rather than to cattle. An acre of land used for broccoli produces 10 times the protein, calories and niacin as an acre of land producing beef. Statistics like these are numerous. The world's resources would be more efficiently utilized if the land used for livestock production were converted to raising crops to feed people.

Eating a vegetarian diet allows you to "tread more lightly on the planet." in addition to taking only what you need and reducing excess, it will feel better when you know that a living being doesn?t have to die each time you eat a meal.

Nearly one billion people suffer from hunger and malnutrition on this planet. Over 40 million die each year of starvation, and most of them are children. Despite this, more than one third of the world's grain harvest is diverted from feeding people to feeding livestock. In the United States, livestock consume 70% of all the grain produced. If we fed people instead of livestock, no one would go hungry.

Animal Suffering

Are you aware of the fact that more than 100,000 cows are slaughtered every day in the United States?

Most animals in Western countries are raised on "factory farms." These facilities are designed to produce the maximum number of animals for slaughter at the minimum expense. Animals are crowded together, disfigured and treated like Machines for the conversion of feed into flesh. This is a reality that most of us will never see with our own eyes. It has been said that, "One visit to a slaughterhouse will make you a vegetarian for life."

Leo Tolstoy said, "As long as there are slaughterhouses there will be battlefields. A vegetarian diet is the acid test of humanitarism." Although most of us do not actively condone killing, we have developed the habit, supported by society, of eating meat regularly, without any real awareness of what is being done to the animals we eat.


I'm sorry, but you're dumb. Oh, wait. YOU ARE A TROLL, riiight? You talk about strength and then tell us about how some vegan can hold his arms for three hours. I'm sure this gelps an 800lb dead, 1000lb squat, 600lb bench, etc. Yep, strength=holding out your arms for a couple of hours.

No one cares. btw, talking about "karma" already means any self-respecting Christian will consider you stupid/a heathen. And no one cares about the Quan Vin method. So this bunch of oriental crap is only interesting if YOU ARE NOT christian or muslim. Does this mean a little more than half the world population? Hmmm. Considering that the karma quan whateva adepts are usually practicing yoga, not weight lifting, thus not ever reading this site (which promotes about EVERYTHING you don't seem to consider right)...
Proof that being vegan makes both weak you both weak AND ignorant: it's LEV, not LEO

  1. Swords enhance your credibility and your performance. Be sure to carry one regardless of whether or not you know anything about using one.
  2. Since you can?t get away with grunts, growls, and other troll-like noises, you will have to sing.
  3. To compensate, sing about killing trolls. Preferably with the swords that you carry onstage.
  4. If you see a someone in the woods pretending to be a troll, see rule #9 and rule #63.

Hmm.The rules of power metal. Now, troll, YOU DIE YOU DIE


Lifted without credit from:


I am now going to go enjoy deep-fried kittens.


Wow. Aside from your entire "case" being based on someone's (mostly wrong) opinion, it was an amusing read. Idiot. Troll.


Because the arms of meat eaters are heavier (from the muscle) than the arms of vegetarians?

Who cares about endurance if you have the physical strength of wet Kleenex.


Who gives a shit? Humans are omnivores. We can digest practically any food we eat. The key is in the ratios of what we eat. Have a steak and grow a little.


hitler could lift his arm for hours during military parades! And he was a veget-arian! I don?t know if it helped his karma though.

This thread needed some nazi-references.

I even might find a way to work the Illuminati in, somewhere.


Two words: canine teeth.

They ain't there for ripping up lettuce, so then why oh why do we have them, my deluded troll friend?


Big surprise - first post and 11 minutes after registering.

Tube steak boogie.


Read Fast Food Nation by Eric Schlosser . Its a Great read and even better documentary into the lives of the Meatpacking industry.

I love my steak and chicken wings, but goddamit I will NEVER eat at ANY fast food chain again.

All that crap about cancer is false, the real truth is there's shit in the meat. So don't ban eating meat, just ban the Fast Food restaurants.


Another amusing thing about some of these pro-vegan studies: often they take the fittest, healthiest vegans and pit them against "normal" people who are generally sedentary. No wonder the veggies some out ahead! Studies that pit fit vegans against fit omnivores show that healthy eating does include dead animals.


I love vegetarians. They're delicious.


Oh, here's a quote too:

"Don't eat like prey."
- Me


Lifted from here actually

Anyway, I do eat eggs. I am a wiccan.


Actually Hitler was a demonic vegetarian. He was a demon.


The original posters outlook on karma is quite simple, a little more detail is shown here:

If I only eat veggies can I become a demon too? That sounds cool, especially if it'll help me lift.


Buddha Gautama (supposedly) ate meat so long as the animal was not killed specifically for him. If it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me.


Firstly I don't suppose thats true. He did indulge in all sorts of pleasures till the age of 24 after which he renounced everything to lead a life of austerity. Thats when he attained Nirvana. The commandment "Thou shalt not kill" is being violated by more Christians than ever.


Yes, if you want to become a demon, you can do that by all means. Vegetarian or not, the eating habits will matter little at that stage. All I am trying to say here folks, is that give the animal a chance.