T Nation

Carb Cycling Question

Supplements and Nutrition
#1

im starting to carb cycle (my body doesnt respond too well to carbs, but i figured everything should be given a fair chance). im keeping a strict watch on the calories i consume and macro nutrient ratios as well. im trying to lose my excess fat, weigh 215lbs currently, and am using the ratios provided in the “carb cycling” article that was posted here recently. here is where i need some help:

from my reading ive discovered that most ppl agree on not eating carbs after a certain hour when you are going to go to bed (7PM usually). if im trying to spread out 430g of carbs over the day, would it be better, instead of spreading it out over 7 meals on “high” days and eating 60g of carbs right up until bed time, should i divide it over 5 or 6 and leave the last meal of the day a serving of casein protein or another lean source?

#2

On high days, have your carbs spread throughout everymeal.

#3

ok cool. thanks

now, ? # 2:

on the “low” days, is it still ok to have Surge pre, peri, or post workout, or would it better not to on those days? should i keep the TOTAL day’s carbs under 100g, or all food carbs at 100g + Surge PWO?

#4

Depends on how many carbs you want to consume on your low day. Surge DOES count as carbs. If you still want to have Surge on your low days (which is fine), you would have to fit it into your carb quota for the day.

#5

The fact that Elusive is the only one responding has less to do with the fact that no one cares about your question, and more to do with the fact that Elusive really knows his stuff when it comes to carb-cycling.

And that people hate your avatar.

Just wanted to point that out.

#6

[quote]Otep wrote:

And that people hate your avatar.

Just wanted to point that out.[/quote]

LOL! I really fucking hate it too. I mean… fuck.

#7

So you think if I changed my picture it would result in a better chance of getting my questions answered?

And just FYI, I’m really not John Stamos from the early 90s…I promise you

#8

[quote]yusef wrote:
Your high carb day seems rather high, what are calories like?
I read something about kicking off your carb cycle with a 7-day low carb period, I don’t know whether that has any scientific basis though. …Elusive? lol [/quote]

Not really needed. I personally don’t. The cycle itself is designed to deplete/replenish and zig zag without having to prepare pre-hand for the diet. If you DID do this, I would start the first day of the cycle with a HIGH day.

#9

[quote]yusef wrote:
Your high carb day seems rather high, what are calories like?
I read something about kicking off your carb cycle with a 7-day low carb period, I don’t know whether that has any scientific basis though. …Elusive? lol [/quote]

430 is not very high at all, I personally used 2.5g of carbs per pound of bodyweight on my high days. Mind you, I was in a maintenance mode at the time.

7-days low carb sounds more like AD to me, carb-cycling generally has 1-3 high days each week – on days that you train your lagging bodyparts.

OP, I liked to have the majority of my carbs around my workout. Generally, 100g before, during, and after – and spread the remaining 250 out evenly throughout my meals. I’d go a bit lower before bed out of necessity – as long as you are hitting your macros that is what counts.

#10

1753 kCal on low days
2520 kCal on high days

currently I’m doing legs on Mondays (high day) and either back or chest on my other high day, Thursdays. I rotate so I can have energy during my workouts, not jus for 1 body part every week. I’m on the verdge of quitting carb cycling and switching just to low carbs for a while. I’ve been following the diet very strictly, added more cardio, and noted scale weight and have taken pictures daily for 2 weeks and I dont see ANY difference at all. I told myself I would do it for at least 1 month just to give it a try, but it’s really bumming me out that I haven’t seen any results at all.

#11

You’ve only been at it for two weeks man! You can’t expect a transformation overnight. The calories are looking very low considering you are 215 lbs – how did you calculate your macro intake? Keep at it for at least six to eight weeks before you decide if it works or not, in my opinion.

#12

Well I’m not at 6% BF Obviously so I was limiting my intake bc my main goal right now is to lose excess fat since I wasn’t very strict with my diet fir a while. But I’m going to stick through with the cycling to see what effect it has on me. Previously I had some success with low carbs but I’ve gained mass since then and really dont want to lose strength or the mass. I’ll post up a pic when I get home on my computer so you guys can judge my diet a little bit better.

Thanks for all your comments

#13

[quote]BARDUKE wrote:
Well I’m not at 6% BF Obviously so I was limiting my intake bc my main goal right now is to lose excess fat since I wasn’t very strict with my diet fir a while. But I’m going to stick through with the cycling to see what effect it has on me. Previously I had some success with low carbs but I’ve gained mass since then and really dont want to lose strength or the mass. I’ll post up a pic when I get home on my computer so you guys can judge my diet a little bit better.

Thanks for all your comments
[/quote]

You didn’t answer my question exactly. Did you calculate your macros using a guideline or did you just take a guess? Because at 215 lbs. you’re maintenance is probably over 3,200, depending on your activity level – it sounds like you are very far under it, even on high days.

#14

I took the calculation on the minimum requirements for each macronutrient for fat loss ( 420g CHO, 210g Pro, as little as possible fat for HIGH days) so that comes out to be 2520 kCal a day for high days. I am wanting to look better and keep my strength, but I think my top priority is to lose fat at this time.

#15

[quote]BARDUKE wrote:
I took the calculation on the minimum requirements for each macronutrient for fat loss ( 420g CHO, 210g Pro, as little as possible fat for HIGH days) so that comes out to be 2520 kCal a day for high days. I am wanting to look better and keep my strength, but I think my top priority is to lose fat at this time. [/quote]

You could probably bump your protein to 1.5g/lb, I believe that’s what CT recommended in his carb cycling codex. When I’m under maintenance I will increase my protein to at least 1.25g/lb.

#16

[quote]yusef wrote:
Chi, for you would be about 180lb x 2.5 = 450g per day in maintenance? Wow I’m going to have to ramp up my carb intake, I’m taking in 4000kcal and not gaining as fast as I should be, I never went over 320g for high day and that was pushing it.

OP your calories do seem quite low, are you training for strength? What kind of cardio?[/quote]

You’re taking in 4kcal and only 320g carbs? Actually, I took in closer to 3g/lb. carb – looking back at my journal I took in 525g on a high day, my fat intake was bt. 30-40g, and protein was about 1.25g/lb.

I’ve been eating a balanced diet since late August, and I still take in more carbs on a daily basis. My body responsds well to high carbs/mod fat/mod protein.

#17

[quote]yusef wrote:
Were you an ecto before you started training? To be honest at the moment I’ve been around 200g carbs for high days, getting most of my calories from fat. I guess it takes a while to find out what your body responds best to, since the changes are so slow lots of experimenting is needed.

OP have a look at the strategies for fat loss article by Thibalibs if you havn’t already - describes three types of weight training for fat loss and weighs up the advantages. [/quote]

I’ve always fallen into the meso category, I was just under 160 lbs. before I started training at 14. It honestly doesn’t sound like you are carb cycling to me, I have not seen one article that included taking the majority of your calories from fat. Have you read CT’s carb cycling codex? They are more or less all low fat diets, I averaged about 65-70g of fat on my moderate/low carb days. Hell, even my low carb days were only 1g/lb. of carbs – almost as much as your high days!

#18

[quote]yusef wrote:
Lol yes something needs sorting out. Obviously the low fat high carb has produced decent results for you. Sorry for the thread hijack btw OP. You inspired me to increase my carbs, maybe that was the missing factor on why I’m not gaining as fast as I would like.

[/quote]

Here it is. CT has a format for gaining and for weight-loss. He goes into great detail about foods that are acceptable and what-not. I can personally say if you follow the instructions to the letter you’ll have great results. The only way I deviated from the diet is including a lot of fruit on my high-carb days, opposed to strictly my pre-workout meal.

Edit: I ate copious amounts of veggies with the diet, generally over a pound of broccoli a day on low/moderate carb days. And lots of tomato/cucumber salads, thought I’d include that.

#19

[quote]Chi-Towns-Finest wrote:
yusef wrote:
Lol yes something needs sorting out. Obviously the low fat high carb has produced decent results for you. Sorry for the thread hijack btw OP. You inspired me to increase my carbs, maybe that was the missing factor on why I’m not gaining as fast as I would like.

Here it is. CT has a format for gaining and for weight-loss. He goes into great detail about foods that are acceptable and what-not. I can personally say if you follow the instructions to the letter you’ll have great results. The only way I deviated from the diet is including a lot of fruit on my high-carb days, opposed to strictly my pre-workout meal.

Edit: I ate copious amounts of veggies with the diet, generally over a pound of broccoli a day on low/moderate carb days. And lots of tomato/cucumber salads, thought I’d include that.[/quote]

Thanks for the great detail you went into on this thread. I’ve gained some weight recently but have eased off due to some fat gain. I’ll check this out and see where I need to add some carbs to get back on the gain horse.

And for the record, broccoli is awesome.

#20

[quote]Bonechiro wrote:
Chi-Towns-Finest wrote:
yusef wrote:
Lol yes something needs sorting out. Obviously the low fat high carb has produced decent results for you. Sorry for the thread hijack btw OP. You inspired me to increase my carbs, maybe that was the missing factor on why I’m not gaining as fast as I would like.

Here it is. CT has a format for gaining and for weight-loss. He goes into great detail about foods that are acceptable and what-not. I can personally say if you follow the instructions to the letter you’ll have great results. The only way I deviated from the diet is including a lot of fruit on my high-carb days, opposed to strictly my pre-workout meal.

Edit: I ate copious amounts of veggies with the diet, generally over a pound of broccoli a day on low/moderate carb days. And lots of tomato/cucumber salads, thought I’d include that.

Thanks for the great detail you went into on this thread. I’ve gained some weight recently but have eased off due to some fat gain. I’ll check this out and see where I need to add some carbs to get back on the gain horse.

And for the record, broccoli is awesome.[/quote]

Glad I could help, broccoli certainly is awesome and naturally anti-estoric.