T Nation

Carb Backloading and Plazma or Mag-10


Hi fellas,

I'm a 36 year old guy, roughly 18% body fat and I weight train on average 5 times per week.

I've been utilizing Kiefer's Carb backloading approach and I am making regular strength gains on a 5/3/1 triumvirate program. I'm very curious if using Plazma for my pre and peri-workout nutrition is making it difficult for my body to shed that last 8% or so of body fat? Might switching to Mag-10 only help me with this fat loss phase?

I'm about to start holding off on Plazma until about 15 mins into my workout to see what happens. I'd like to give the CBL program a real shot but would rather not miss out on the enhanced recovery and workout capacity that Plazma provides.

I've searched as much as possible but can't seem to find a definitive answer (not that there necessarily is one). Any and all opinions appreciated.



I stumble across your post searching for ‘MAG-10 carb backloading’.

Curious if you have read the supplements recommended by Kiefer for Carb Backloading? The Plazma is pretty much straight carbs so probably not the best for intra workout. Kiefer recommend Leucine with Whey and Casein Hydrolysate. MAG-10 is much closer to what is recommended. Plazma has more carbs (via the HBC Dextrin) and no aminos. Adding some leucine would probably be a good idea.

I previously took a supplement (similar to Surge https://Biotest.T-Nation.com/products/surge-workout-fuel ). My recovery times were amazing and I continued to lose fat (although I was also doing fasted cardio in the morning).

I would suggest reading stuff the John Meadows has written

And you can find article that Kiefer has wrote on protein and lucien as well if you search for them.

I am thinking of trying out the MAG-10. I have not been able to find many other Casein Hydrolysate supplements.

Note: Hopefully my edits are OK for this forum.


Plazma and CBL are not complementary.

You are better off using Surge Recovery to stay in line with the CBL protocol.

MAG-10 can be used anytime before your work out or before bed. you just have to figure out if the carbs stay within what you can handle (30-100 grams, depends on the person).


What kind of Conditioning are you doing with your 5/3/1 triumvirate training ?
IF you are Prowler pushing/pulling, or farmer walking or et al.
Maybe you just need to increase that a bit more ?

As far as the supplement intake, just go with what was mentioned above.


Thanks for the replies fellas. As I suspected Plazma doesn’t really fit in with the CBL approach. I’m somewhat addicted to it’s benefits at this point but I think I’ll drop it out of my peri workout nutrition for a month or 2 and see how my body responds to Mag10 and Surge.

To answer the question about conditioning I do mostly HIIT sprints, rowing, and KB swings as I don’t currently have access to a prowler. I’ve been thinking about getting into some farmer carries for some time. What is the optimal “time of carry before exhaustion, for conditioning”? My biggest dumbbells are 70lbs and I feel like I can walk around for some time with those. Might have to anti up for a bigger set!

I very much appreciate the help as I’ve not actually purchased the book yet…(ridiculous I know but with the CAN$ in the crapper it’s about $100). Just trying to accumulate as much info on the subject as possible.