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cant move forward


I dont know what the problem is.... I have weigh around 235 depending on how much I dropped in the toilet that day. Anyways I just cant seem to grow any heavier than that period.... I am not taking any prohormones etc. only the basic shit. I eat like a goddamn horse just nothing seems to help me out. BTW I have not gained a pound in a month and a half.

normally taking about 1.5 grams of protein per pound. About 15 grams of creatine a day... 10 grams of L-glut.
I also eat until I am about to puke every 3 hours. Once during the night I will wake up and eat a sandwich or take a protein shake. Some advice for a dumbass plz


Hey, there, CH!!! Welcome to the board.

I can't think of anything any more frustrating than to be eating until you feel sick to your stomach and not seeing results for your efforts.

A few things I need to know and that will help us help you.

  • What's your age?
  • What's your BF%?
  • How active are you at work and outside of work?
  • Do you keep a food log?
  • How many calories do you take in precisely, not a guess? (Not possible to answer if you don't keep a food log.)
  • Do you take EFAs like fish oil, flaxseed oil?
  • What do you eat? Give me a list in the protein, carb and fat categories.
  • What do you do for PWO nutrition?
    How many meals do you eat a day?
  • How much cardio or aerobic activity do you do?
  • What type of workout program are you doing/following, and what's the last time you changed up/out your program?

Look forward to hearing from you. In the meantime, be sure to take full advantage of the nutrition articles in the Previous Issues section of the forum. Take full use of the search engine to the left of the screen to search the forum and/or the archived articles for items/topics of interest. And finally, be sure to read everything ever written by John Berardi. He's written a number of articles on bulking for hard gainers.


age: 21

BF%: not sure but I assume low I am very lean everywhere... not sure if my veins being visible means anything but I am vascular even when I havent worked out

Work: I watch people workout and make sure old people dont fall off the treadmill and die...which isnt that rare

Food Log: dont keep one and yes I need to get my ass in gear on that...but I do eat full meals every 2 and a half to 3 hours

EFA's: dont take them because not idea what they do I will have to search the ol database on that..

What I eat: 1.5 grams of protein a day. I do at least keep up with my protein intake. I consume tons of tuna, chicken, and red meat. Only drink water. Plenty of carbohydrates I assume only with a log...
Cardio program is non existant basicly... except I do bike on a very high level for about 15 mins after my leg workout(this has caused me to puke not sure if it helps but TP did it) other than that I walk on a incline now and then.

As for my workout routine it goes like this.
Day 1 Legs 2hrs 30 mins
Day 2 Chest & Calves 2hrs to 2hrs 30 mins
Day 3 Back & abdominals 3hrs
Day 4 Repeat Day 1
Day 5 Repeat Day 2
Day 6 Repeat Day 3
Day 7 off
Day 8 Squats,Leg press, Deadlifts, Cleans, Lunges, & Good Mornings only..
Day 9 Shoulders
Day 10 Arms
Day 11 off
Day 12 off

I try to do around 60% of my workout using pressing movements

I change my workout every month or so..

Give you an idea how hard it is for me to gain weight a few weeks ago I decided for one week I will eat a triple with cheese and bacon from Wendy's along with a large bowl of chili and a stuffed baked potato
for 2 of my 6 meals a day. I didnt even put on fat from that.....

I think I covered everything


I'm no body composition genius, but I think you are in the gym about 10 hours too long a week.


yea I do spend alot of time in the gym not sure why I guess ever since I have been outta the army I am a glutton for pain.

Anyways it really takes alot to fatigue my muscle and you cant tell me that I might not be using the right about of weight/or tempo etc. cause I go balls to the wall in the dungeon I workout in. Yes I do push myself to the point I puke but it seems after I complete a exercise of like 6 working sets 2 mins later my muscles are ready to go again.

Like I this must be due to my mental state that I have since I spent a year in a US army Ranger Batt. and moved forward into other special operating units. Glutton for pain.


I agree that you are overtraining. By working out for so long you aren't inducing further muscle growth, but you are increasing the time needed for recovery.


It appears to me that you are training about 8 hours per 7 day week.

A couple of comments regarding this.
1) Just because you CAN train for 3 hours at a time doesn't mean you should. The more you beat up the body the greater the time needed for recovery.
2) Intensity has an inverse relationship with time. In other words, if you're training that long chances are that the exercises at the end of your workout aren't as intense as the first. Try shorter (i.e., 1 hour) workouts and see how you feel.
3) Long workouts will lead to increases in calorie expenditure. If you're trying to gain mass you should consider decreasing time in the gym. Short intense workouts are best.
4) Keep a food log!!!

As a side note, 235LBS and LEAN??? We'd all love to see pics.


Okay. Good information, Cold Hearted. And I can see that you have a great work ethic, and actually, your diet's got a lot of things going for it. There are some areas of opportunity, however. (grin) Let me see how persuasive I am.

The trick is to do all of what is necessary to achieve a goal, but no more. Let's use working out as an example. Up to a certain point, you are creating an anabolic environment and a stimulus for growth. Beyond that point, the negatives start to outweigh the positives. Cortisol is rising because blood sugar is dropping. The muscle you have is being chewed up/broken down to provide amino acids that can be converted to glucose to feed the brain. That's why I asked about what you were doing for PWO nutrition.

So, here's your first homework assignment. Read the article, "Solving the PostWorkout Puzzle" by John Berardi. It's a two-parter, I think, but well worth the read. Life altering, even.

Additionally, and this is going to be an act of faith, I want you to try one of the bulking programs here on T-Mag that focus on compound multi-joint exercises. There isn't a more efficient exercise than squats. It works something like 200 muscles in the body, and if you do it at a challenging enough weight (3-5x10 @ 60% of your 1RM or 10x3-5 @ 80% of your 1RM), it will give your CNS a kick in the butt that you'll never forget! (grin) I know of what I speak. Check out Chad Waterbury's ABBH (Anti-BodyBuilding Hypertrophy) program.

Don't get me wrong. You're definitely hardcore, obviously a serious lifter. I like your choice of exercises. Just trust me on this one. Do the research.

Back to ABBH, the best thing about the program is that you will experience strength gains as well as hypertrophy. See my response to roc in another post. Plenty of time for recovery and only 3.5 days a week in the gym (i.e., every other day). If you give it a go (three weeks), I promise you won't be complaining about the weight being too light or the reps/sets too low.

Now, with all that extra time you have on your hands, (grin), you have time to start and keep a food log, right? You know you gotta do it if you're young, a hard gainer and/or trying to push past your genetic potential. People who are serious about achieving their goals track their progress in all areas.

Meal timing is perfect. Are you getting a meal/shake in the middle of the night when you wake up to hit the restroom? That would be the perfect place to add some of the EFAs you need.

Okay. Since I brought it up, let's talk about EFAs (Essential Fatty Acids). This is another subject that bears research on your part, as it is a HUGE area of opportunity. There are health benefits, cognitive/mental benefits, anti-inflammatory benefits, not to mention performance (stamina and endurance) benefits.

Read the chapter in Barry Sears' book, "The Omega Zone" on athletes. It is the single-most important supp I take. Besides, at 135 calories per tablespoon, it will help you jack up your calories. You should be taking in about 5 tablespoons per day of Udo's Choice, flaxseed oil or fish oil. If you're not into the "oil thing," you can also get some of these good fats from raw nuts like walnuts and almonds.

Even though the general consensus is to limit (or not do any) cardio when bulking, I'd still recommend two High Intensity Interval Training (HIIT) sessions per week to increase the capillary network of your cardiovascular system. Better delivery of nutrients when you're working out and better removal of waste products like lactic acid. HIIT is also a searchable topic on T-Mag and T-Forums. It has been discussed extensively.

What you're doing currently on leg day is excellent. Great for recovery. Just read up on HIIT for me.

As far as carbs go, I'm going to start by recommending that you get in an equal number of grams of carbs per day. But you won't be able to stuff 350-360 grams of green veggies down your gullet. And the fiber needs to be subtracted from total carbs, which makes hitting your total even harder.

So you need to start drawing upon your starchier carbs; white rice, sweet potatoes, oatmeal, pasta. Don't neglect your green veggies, but the starchier carbs are going to be necessary to eat the volume of carbs required to put on size.

Okay. Those are my initial thoughts. It's going to involve some homework initially and some follow-through eventually, but it will yield results if applied consistently.

Questions? (grin)

Anyone else want to make a recommandation re their favorite bulking program?


i had the same problem when i was trying to make my goal of 195 (i was weighing low 180's). my knowledge of training was , i thought, decent and i was sure i was eating plenty of food (pretty much what you are doing). i was very surprised to find out i was eating about 1500kcal/day LESS than what i would have guessed.


i had also been doing hi-volume, long duration,5-6 times a week, and what i thought was "hi-intensity" training.

you need to take a close look at your program.

i had a buddy that spent some time in prison. he went in looking like joe avg and came out (2 years later) with 50-60 more pounds of pure muscle on his lean frame. he gave me a great piece of advice which i quickly worked into my routine. it made all the difference in the world. it went something like
"train like you only have 1/2 an hour to train. thats all i had. you need to summon all of your intensity as many times as you can in that 1/2 hour".

i know this might not directly apply. its sort of just something to think about. but i will agree with some of the other guys posts that if you were using more intensity (as it relates to a percentage of your one rep max, not puking after riding yourbike for 15minutes) then you might see some different results.
your volume seems good. but its probably as high as its going to get so without some other form of stimulation i dont think its going to happen for you.
you might look into some sort of serious strength training (westside template for example)program and see how things go. this is what i would recommend.


START A NUTRITION LOG(so you can see,first hand, that you arent eating enough)





What he said! (grin)

Good post, Ryan!