Can You Take Winstrol Without Test?

It does seem to be a growing market. I think the guys in FL are making a boat load of money currently. One downside I could see is that the government could decide to crack down on the industry. Some athlete on TRT wins in the Olympics or something and ruins it for the rest of us.

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Either that or people start getting hurt and running into serious health issues from these cookie cutter protocols these doctors are handing out like flyers. Some of the protocols iv seen are dangerous as far as AI dosages and such. A lot of the doctors switching to “men’s health clinics” have absolutely no background in endochrinolgy they are just re-branding themselves to chase the money.

And Florida is known for thier shady doctors as is. I feel more confident and comfortable with my trt in my hands then any doctors.

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This has happened numerous times, watch screwball

They were turning a blind eye until it came to light that

  • high star athletes were using the service
  • the clinic was prescribing gear to kids in middle/high school who were absent of endocrine pathology
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I am self administering now. Have a local source. I have a good understanding of what to look for in blood work, and did work with a clinic for a while. However, the urge to blast can’t be contained now that I am not on a leash (I am mild blasting 325 test/wk, 50 mg var for last six weeks).

I just figured, they never do much with my protocol, and I can get the test for less than 1/3 the price, can have more than 10 mL at a time (and they won’t fill until you have like 1 mL left, so you have about a week window to order), and don’t have to jump through all the hoops involved with official TRT (biggest one is having to go to my normal doctor and having him sign off on it). I didn’t really have a difficult time getting dialed in. Felt better, and kept feeling better (was hoping for ADHD symptoms to go down, but that did not happen).

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I’m probably also going to take TRT into my own hands if my next bloods come out alright. Can’t be bothered to keep lowering my dosage down to 150, meticulisly planning out when I can/can’t expeiment… spending 85$ for 3ml of test at a place I have to drive almost an hour and a half to pick up… and having to do it every 5wks… or when primoteston is back paying 35$ for 3ml

If the black market runs out of stock when China stops exporting (doubtful, supply/demand and exportation will switch to India who also produces raws) I can always go back if stock does fully run out

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Just skimmed this thread. I think “straightnasty” might be a woman. Way too emotional and irrational. I mean that in the nicest way possible about women, generally

To be fair, his/her moniker is a warning sign things could go sideways.

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Anecdotal view based on the studies suggesting a relationship between stanozolol induced connective tissue synthesis and a hypothesised suggestion it would lead to brittleness IIRC.

There may (iirc) have been studies relating ‘winny’ to a ligaments/tendons reduction in tensile strength, but I’m not sure how viable it was.

There are several alternative methods to raise testosterone (or more accurately suitable androgen) levels without injecting T.

What about a microdose regime of HCG with proviron? What about HCG alone? What about tamoxifen/clomiphene/HCG utilisation? What about HCG and drostanolone?

In actuality HCG would produce the androgenic pro/prehormones also involved in endocrine messenger related libido, mood, etc.

The issue with this (I’m also not a proponent of the T base necessity ideology) however is that stanozolol is a relatively weak androgen compared to the testosterone your system is accustomed/designed to bind with.

So you can find symptoms of hypo-androgenicity (a made up term!) which may include reduced libido, decreased energy, lowered well being.

I personally would add Masteron/drostanolone or Proviron/mesterolone

What about them? HCG use is just a different way of ensuring a base level of test, and microdosing it is less than useful in most men. Using Tomixifen or Clomiphene in conjunction with HCG is kind of pointlss, the HCG interferes with the signalling you are trying to generate by using Tamoxifen or Clomiphene. You just made several suggestions to try and accomplish the same thing as injecting some test as a base - but they are more complicate, more expensive and depending on what else is being run probably pointless. You need testosterone for several things, and if you are treating yourself for low testosterone why would you use something else? If you induce shutdown because you are using exogynous androgens, why try to avoid making sure that you have enough of the basic one?
I understand wanting to minimize the test dose because you have undesirable sides, test plus proviron or mast would make sense, but Winstrol on it’s own is asking for trouble.

[quote=“hardartery, post:65, topic:263478, full:true”]

“HCG use is just a different way of ensuring a base level of test”

A low endogenous level of testosterone synthesized by the testes, creating all the hormones Inbetween, which are also beneficial.

“microdosing it is less than useful in most men.”

References?

“Using Tomixifen or Clomiphene in conjunction with HCG is kind of pointlss, the HCG interferes with the signalling you are trying to generate by using Tamoxifen or Clomiphene.”

This is a biggie. HCG acts as a LH analog, acting from below the pituitary level of the HPTA. Clomiphene acts (as an E antagonist) at the pituitary and tamoxifen at the hypothalamus, the trio compliment each other in fact. Furthermore they have beneficial effects on the prostate.
Injecting T WILL increase base T. My suggestion will minimize side effects whilst providing the test based androgenicity.

“You just made several suggestions to try and accomplish the same thing as injecting some test as a base - but they are more complicate, more expensive and depending on what else is being run probably pointless.”

More complex yes, but safe AAS use IS complex. More expensive, mildly but the benefits are there to be had. What else being run is stanozolol, and it is (as I’ve described) quite the opposite of pointless.

“You need testosterone for several things, and if you are treating yourself for low testosterone why would you use something else?”

To still increase testosterone but in a more natural manner. It was merely an example of how to not have to inject T to run winstrol whilst still getting the benefits of the hormone.

“If you induce shutdown because you are using exogynous (exogenous) androgens, why try to avoid making sure that you have enough of the basic one?”

There are degrees of inhibition, and maintaining the function of the hypothalamus, the pituitary and the testes periodically throughout a course will make recovery all the more easy.

“I understand wanting to minimize the test dose because you have undesirable sides, test plus proviron or mast would make sense”

Test plus Proviron? What doses of each?

Using multiple drugs to induce an effect is not more natural. HCG runs around $50 for 5000 iu here, other places it is similar. I don’t know what guys are paying for Clomid or Tamox, but test C is dirt cheap. I can buy 1 gram for under $20. Clomid (Clomiphene Citrate) has some very ugly sides for some people, including permanent vision damage. Test is safer and cheaper. I am thinking 25 mg with 130 to 160 mg of Test would be a good jumping off point to dial in from.

Natural in the sense of endogenous as opposed to exogenously produced T.

I get 5000iu HCG for $10, 1g TE for $1.45 iirc. But hey, we all have different sources.

I would be interested to know where you get the HCG that cheap (my email is in my bio). I buy OTC in Central America, it is the same almost everywhere here. Sustanon is more. Nebido is ridiculous.

Are you buying raws? I have seen cheaper in raw form, but not even close to that cheap if prepared.

Ya that’s raw bud. But it works out at around $7 or so prepared (2.5g vial) all in.