T Nation

Can you be honest?


#1

Can some of the AAS users on this board be honest for a moment. How many years did you train naturally ( what was the increase in size, weight from when you started), before you started using steroids. I know it is important to start only after you have pushed your body to its fullest potential, but this isnt always realistic. I just thought it would be a good topic to discuss.

J


#2

No, you're just upset that I made fun of you in another thread for 1) using steroids with only two years of training under your belt and 2) asking if a Coke would be good post-workout nutrition - when this site has about dozen articles on the topic, including at the time, one in the current issue and 3) choosing to use steroids when you don't even know what to eat.

Now you come on this section of the forum hoping someone will tell you it's okay to use juice when you're inexperienced in the gym and ignorant about basic nutrition.


#3

Bump Davo2


#4

haha bump


#5

Sorry JBone, but he's right.


#6

I lifted for 15 years naturally and put on 50lbs naturally. One time I put on about 30lbs in less than a year naturally when I figured out how to periodize and eat enough food.


#7

Davo is correct in his assessment of JB but it is still an interesting question. I worked out for 44 years without any "assistance", including creatine, and put on about 100 pounds. The last 20 pounds coincides with the birth of T-Mag. During the last year I have used MAG10 twice and creatine and 10 of the aforementioned 20 pounds came in that year. However, my personal definition of steroids, in the context of bodybuilding, does, and has always, referred to the illegal sourcing and using of steroids. Therefore, I still consider myself "natural." Others can argue differently but not when using my personal definition of the drugs. I have reached a state of physical fitness that, in my mind, makes it unnecessary for me to resort to illegal methods to gain more mass. I have to much to lose if caught. However, If certain steroids were obtainable legally, I would undoubtedly utilize them. However, if I were a professional athlete whose source of income came from my chosen sport, I would use whatever means were available to be at the top, if I could get away with it.


#8

Bone,

Look, put down the magazines and get to the library and learn about nutrition. get certified as a trainer. you can't get to your body's genetic peak unless you have some knowledge or you will break.

If you choose otherwise, you lose much more after a cycle. if you don't build a foundation for a house it's not gonna last long.

stop trying to take the easy way out and look at gear as icing on the cake and nothing else


#9

slight change of direction...how would you all feel about someone using juice to further athletic potential even if they're not at their genetic peak?

for example, i play d1 hockey as a goalie but don't start. the starter is slightly better/more consistent than me and if all else is held constant, we'll continue to improve at the same rate, meaning he'll always start unless he gets hurt. assuming my diet and training are good, what would your opinion of me using steroids be?


#10

tito, good constructive ctiticism. Thanks. Davo2 still cute as a button.

As much as it kills me to defend myself against this guy. I have trained for 3 years hard core. Eating about 300-350 grams protein per day and taking in a lot of carbs. specifically from Brown rice, yams, whole grain breads and sometimes whole grain cereals. Egg whites for breakfast, cans of tuna for lunch, lean ass ground beef. EAT,EAT, and EAT. I pay close attention to what I am putting in my body, sometimes I cheat a little. But usually pretty good.

I worked out for 4 years (94'-98')before taking a break from 98'-00' ( focussing on my Kung-Fu). So dont act like this is my first month in the gym. I have put on about 50 pounds since 94'. Not all muscle, but mostly. Up to 230 pounds, from 180.


#11

Lumbarjack, is that how your earn your daily bread?


#12

Lumberjack, that sounds like a moral decision on your part. Do you think the roids will help your hand-eye coordination? Cuz, they won't. Do it, who the f*ck cares. If I have learned anything from davo2, its that your going to have to work harder and more efficient when on. I don't see that as cheating, if that's what you mean.

Also, you say you will both progress at the same rate, assuming your diets/training are in order, unless he gets hurt. Maybe this guy gets hurt then. Ya know, maybe two dudes beat the shit out of him somewhere outside of a bar. Who knows.

No, Just kidding, that would be cheating.

I also think its besides the point if this is how you make your money. Sure, its important to be the best, if its how you feed yourself. I also think it can be equally important, if its something you love/believe in as well.


#13

LumbarJack: In your case the extra strength would do nothing for you. For sports that require quick thinking, handeye coordination, and mental toughness,steroids will do nothing for you. I could see if you were a track and field athlete, or a lineman in football how steroids could help, but for such skilled sports like being a goalie in hockey or say a tennis player, or squash player, steroids isn't going to do much.


#14

no, infact i have no desire to play hockey once i'm done with school so the window of steroid use would be within the next 2 years.


#15

true, the extra strength would do nothing for me, but i think it could potentially help with reaction time, since some steroids, tren for example, give a CNS 'kick' and recovery would increase too, which would help since we're on the ice 4+ days a week.

i would be more interested in using test or dbol, not by itself of course. the reason: they're both said to improve mood/confidence, and confidence is the root of my inconsistency on the ice. i get worked up and shaken easily, like if i let in a shitty goal i'm pretty much done for the game because i take myself out of it.

its a stupid and weak reason, but a reason nonetheless.


#16

Well, if you aren't earning your living from it, I wouldn't possibly risk either my health or my freedom just to be the best is some amateur sport. To get a $23 million contract, I would. However, I realize that everybody is different and if ego is someone's prime motivator, then steroids are a viable option, I guess. I don't have the knowledge, or the desire either, to get into the whole psych thing.

As an aside, I used to be a goalie and a right wing in college in Michigan in the early and mid 60's. Strength,in my opinion, is important in keeping the bums out of your box, clearing a puck one handed while fending off a forward with the other arm or when recovering from a double wide split in time to block the next shot. However, flexibility is probably more important and that doesn't come in a bottle, yet!

BTW, have you ever been in any of the lumberman comps? They look grueling, except for falling off the log which I can do as well as any pro! :slight_smile:


#17

Steroids and hockey aren't too useful together. While i'm sure there are some juiced up hockey players out there, i doubt theres too many. A buddy of mine that used to live with me (very good player, hes in the states right now) did some juice with me once and said he wished he didnt. The mass he put on really only slowed him down. He pretty much dieted it off after he came off gear, and he hasnt been on since then (this was like 2 years ago almost). Size is good in my line of work, hence the steroids, but not for hockey or anything like that in my experience.


#18

McEnroe took steroids and he was one of the most talented players ever.

Even though, he was thin as a rail, he could still crank the first serve and hit more spin than anyone. They must have helped him.


#19

Pats, do you know what McEnroe was on? I would also imagine the Williams sister are on? If they are in fact "On", it doesnt seem to be hurting them at all. Those guys are huge..uh, I mean girls.

Or maybe they just eat right and train hard, just like Ronnie.


#20

thanks for all the replies, its been made apparent the risks vs rewards are pretty out of balance in this case...sorry for the thread hijack.

AR, i've never competed in a real lumberman event but me and my bro used to roll logs in the pond in our back yard, painful shit, especially during a drought :slight_smile: