T Nation

Can One Bulk Up on Cutting Compounds?

A classic bulking cycle, Test Deca and Dbol, the perfect stack for getting massive and a tried and true cutting cycle, Test Tren and Mast, a cycle typically said to bring extreme hardness, vascularity and muscle separations if ones bodyfat is low enough. On these (and other forums) when people talk about Masteron, winstrol, primobolan or proviron it is often stated that if one isn’t at a low bodyfat they won’t notice anything, and that masteron/ winstrol are only useful as hardeners.

While it makes sense that proviron would be useless in the conquest to bulk up as it is deactivated by the 3 hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase enzyme before it reaches muscle tissue rendering it inactive and therefore not effective for gains in LBM, Masteron and Winstrol are not deactivated by this enzyme, therefore they should have anabolic activity. Primobolan is expensive and commonly counterfeited, therefore I can understand someone not wanting to shell out a few grand for a cycle of 800-1000mg PW therefore I will specifically focus on winstrol and masteron.

Winstrol has an anabolic/androgenic ratio of 320/30 compared to testosterone, this (on paper) means that it has 3.2 times the anabolic activity of testosterone mg/mg and masteron has an anabolic to androgenic ratio of 62-130/25-40, Masteron is commonly compared to proviron, however the two aren’t the same, Drostanolones 2-methyl group gives it the ability to not be broken down by the 3 hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase enzyme whereas proviron is, therefore Masteron is active in muscle tissue, an anabolic rating of 62 is very low, however if the anabolic rating of masteron is 130 (depends on which study you look at) then on paper it is 1.3 times more anabolic than testosterone.

Most people say Masteron doesn’t cause any gains in size and is useless for this purpose, however has anyone tried a (lean) or regular bulk on mast. Tren is also a drug usually used for cutting, yet it is five times more anabolic and androgenic on paper than test, so why wouldn’t this be a good bulking drug, especially since it increases feed efficiency so much. When bulking up, shouldn’t the goal be to make clean, quality gains in LBM that can be (relatively) maintained after the usage of anabolic agents has come to an end. On a test, deca and dbol cycle there will likely be lots of water retention, glycogen retention, sodium retention and intracellular water retention, these are not permenant gains, they disappear as fast as they appear but, on a test, tren, mast or test mast winstrol (or tbol) cycle the water retention should be minimal, gains should be hard, dense and lean.

I know if I had to chose between gaining 5 lbs of solid muscle without gaining a significant amount of fat vs gaining 15-20lbs of muscle/water/fat and keeping 7lbs of muscle and 5lbs of fat I’d chose the first option. I’m aware of the drawbacks that using said cycles to bulk up are such as androgenic sides such as hair loss and prostate enlargement, joint problems from winny, potential extreme lipid strain from dry compounds and mental issues from tren, but I don’t understand, is a compound like masteron really COMPLETELY inadequate for giving gains of lean muscle mass, surely someone on a TRT dose of test and 300-400mgs of mast weekly would gain more muscle than someone training completely natural or just on TRT, and surely a drug like primobolan or masteron is safer to long term heart health in comparison to deca or dbol. I started this topic because I’m bored, so enlighten me

Maybe I’m offbase here but please hear me out. I really wish people would stop using the terms ‘cutting’ and ‘bulking’ when referring to AAS; I would much rather prefer ‘dry agents’ or ‘wet agents’ (or something similar). All AAS build muscle, period. Obviuosly some have stronger anabolic properties than others which make them better suited for packing on weight more quickly (Dbol anyone?) but you can absolutley build muscle on Masterone (plus you get benefit of Masterone’s AI properties to boot).
Just my $.02


Yes… the answer is yes! One will not be able to see the correct result of his cutting when using wet agents (as youbs said), but he can cutt on it. The aromatization is another factor, some of this wet agents are not efficient for cutting due to the aromatization. One can control it with the right AI dose, but it will never be a good compound as the drier ones for cutting. There are other factors, not only wet and dry, this factors will affect the fat burning, just because some compounds have better fat burning properties. Ther answer for this topic is yes, but it will not be the best way (considering everything, cost, efford, etc…). It would be more inteligent to make better choices according to the objective.