T Nation

Calling all Canadians!

This question is for Canadian T-Nation members.

In the US our healthcare system gets worse and worse and alot of people think that we should move to a nationalized healthcare system like Canada’s.

Thos apposed to a nationalized healthcare system say that Canada’s healthcare system has problems too. For example; You don’t get second opinions, it’s hard to get into see a doctor, the qiality of care is bad, older people don’t get proper care because they will probably die anyways soon, etc. They say Rich people come to the US for care.

Is this true?

  • Adam

[quote]adamhum wrote:
You don’t get second opinions, it’s hard to get into see a doctor, the qiality of care is bad, older people don’t get proper care because they will probably die anyways soon, etc. They say Rich people come to the US for care.

Is this true?

  • Adam[/quote]

You can get a second opinion by seeing a 2nd doctor for the same problem…

While it’s hard to find a regular family doctor for annual checkups; I can see a doctor within the hour at the local clinic (CLSC). I can then drive down two miles to another clinic and see another doctor. Cost to me: 0$ (Well, direct cost anyway…)

Quality of care is excellent. The delays for some types of treatments are too long, though.

Some older people require treatments for which there are long waiting lists. That is one big problem right now, especially since they’ll “bump” urgent cases to the top so they don’t die. So you might suffer for a long time waiting your turn and get the treatment only when it’s apparent you’ll die if you don’t. This is not generalized, though.

And yes, rich people will pay for better care, here or abroad, just like they do anywhere else. I don’t consider myself “rich” and I’ve opted for local private clinics in a couple of cases to bypass waiting lists or because the equipment provided by the private clinic was more modern than the public one.

You have to be a little confused to think our healthcare system is getting worse and worse.

[quote]doogie wrote:
You have to be a little confused to think our healthcare system is getting worse and worse. [/quote]

Socializing health care in the United States will be a HUGE blow to liberty. If our health care is taxpayer funded then there will be a genuine and worthwhile arguement to outlawing all sorts of things, i.e. smoking, big macs, premarital sex, ect.

If you are but a ward to the state, then you are no longer a sovereign citizen, you are a subject and a slave. Every step closer to socialized health care that we take IS proof that the healthcare system is in fact getting worse.

Mike

Please explain…Of course the technology is getting better. The thing that’s getting bad is going to the doctor and getting diagnosed. They won’t do anything unless you specifically ask for it by doing your own research.

[quote]doogie wrote:
You have to be a little confused to think our healthcare system is getting worse and worse. [/quote]

[quote]adamhum wrote:
Please explain…Of course the technology is getting better. The thing that’s getting bad is going to the doctor and getting diagnosed. They won’t do anything unless you specifically ask for it by doing your own research.

[/quote]

That just sounds like you have a shitty doctor. If anything, doctors do too many unneccessary tests to cover their ass from lawsuits.

I’m glad you have good insurance and good doctors, most of us do not. Why do you think that was such a big issue during the last presidential election. Healthcare is getting worse. I’m glad that you don’t have that problem.

[quote]That just sounds like you have a shitty doctor. If anything, doctors do too many unneccessary tests to cover their ass from lawsuits.
[/quote]

So your saying Canada and the UK are slaves?

[quote]Mikeyali wrote:
doogie wrote:
You have to be a little confused to think our healthcare system is getting worse and worse.

Socializing health care in the United States will be a HUGE blow to liberty. If our health care is taxpayer funded then there will be a genuine and worthwhile arguement to outlawing all sorts of things, i.e. smoking, big macs, premarital sex, ect.

If you are but a ward to the state, then you are no longer a sovereign citizen, you are a subject and a slave. Every step closer to socialized health care that we take IS proof that the healthcare system is in fact getting worse.

Mike[/quote]

Getting worse? I think the quality of care is very high, but so is the cost. Socializing is out of the question for me, but I aggree that there has to be some checks and balances because of cost. People shouldn’t be raped when they go to the doctor.

[quote]adamhum wrote:
I’m glad you have good insurance and good doctors, most of us do not. Why do you think that was such a big issue during the last presidential election. Healthcare is getting worse. I’m glad that you don’t have that problem.

That just sounds like you have a shitty doctor. If anything, doctors do too many unneccessary tests to cover their ass from lawsuits.

[/quote]

Healthcare is NOT getting worse. Socialized medicine will put a lot of people out of work and take away all of our options…therefore our freedoms.

[quote]adamhum wrote:
I’m glad you have good insurance and good doctors, most of us do not. Why do you think that was such a big issue during the last presidential election. Healthcare is getting worse. I’m glad that you don’t have that problem.

[/quote]

It was a total NON-issue during the last presidential election. I gaurantee you can’t find a single poll that ranks healthcare in the top five issues that people based their vote on.

I should have said top 3 issues, but I’ll stand by the top 5.

[quote]doogie wrote:
adamhum wrote:
I’m glad you have good insurance and good doctors, most of us do not. Why do you think that was such a big issue during the last presidential election. Healthcare is getting worse. I’m glad that you don’t have that problem.

It was a total NON-issue during the last presidential election. I gaurantee you can’t find a single poll that ranks healthcare in the top five issues that people based their vote on.[/quote]

It was a top issue with the Democrats - but not with the voters. Yet more proof that the left is completely out of touch.

Dude, you must live in a bubble. The system is corrupt and the people are getting raped in terms of cost. The hospitals purposely try to bill the insurance companies for goods and services not rendered and the insurance companies just past the cost and the problems on to the people. It’s stupid, I once broke my foot and Cigna wouldn’t cover crutches. I had to hop to my car.

Of course the hospitals are getting raped by non paying illegal aliens and doctors are getting sued for ridiculous amounts for malpractice.

  • Adam

[quote] Healthcare is NOT getting worse. Socialized medicine will put a lot of people out of work and take away all of our options…therefore our freedoms.
[/quote]

I’ve received only excellent care. Pay your medical premium and the co-pays on an HMO and PPO are what?..10 bucks? 250 for hospitalization. What are you talking about? You just have a shitty carrier.

Socialization will not offset any costs of illegals either.

Your logic is unsound.

[quote]adamhum wrote:
Dude, you must live in a bubble. The system is corrupt and the people are getting raped in terms of cost. The hospitals purposely try to bill the insurance companies for goods and services not rendered and the insurance companies just past the cost and the problems on to the people. It’s stupid, I once broke my foot and Cigna wouldn’t cover crutches. I had to hop to my car.

Of course the hospitals are getting raped by non paying illegal aliens and doctors are getting sued for ridiculous amounts for malpractice.

  • Adam

Healthcare is NOT getting worse. Socialized medicine will put a lot of people out of work and take away all of our options…therefore our freedoms.

[/quote]

[quote]Mikeyali wrote:
doogie wrote:
You have to be a little confused to think our healthcare system is getting worse and worse.

Socializing health care in the United States will be a HUGE blow to liberty. If our health care is taxpayer funded then there will be a genuine and worthwhile arguement to outlawing all sorts of things, i.e. smoking, big macs, premarital sex, ect.

If you are but a ward to the state, then you are no longer a sovereign citizen, you are a subject and a slave. Every step closer to socialized health care that we take IS proof that the healthcare system is in fact getting worse.

Mike[/quote]

Yeah, here in the UK if you are caught smoking in the street you are highly likely to get taken out by armed hit squads. And since they banned masturbation, (bad for your eyes they say) I’ve been at a loss for things to do…

I wouldn’t suggest doing anything we here in Canada do…

[quote]juninho wrote:
Yeah, here in the UK if you are caught smoking in the street you are highly likely to get taken out by armed hit squads. And since they banned masturbation, (bad for your eyes they say) I’ve been at a loss for things to do…[/quote]

Posting from the UK, I wouldn’t want to brag about civil liberties.

[quote]doogie wrote:
adamhum wrote:
Please explain…Of course the technology is getting better. The thing that’s getting bad is going to the doctor and getting diagnosed. They won’t do anything unless you specifically ask for it by doing your own research.

That just sounds like you have a shitty doctor. If anything, doctors do too many unneccessary tests to cover their ass from lawsuits.
[/quote]Doog,I worked arond a few hospitals and there is to many assembly line operations going on just to make money,at one place they had women scheduled mon-fri. all day historectomies ? also knee operations all day every day.and they had one guy that loved heart decaths. everyday ,morning to mid afternoon,that dude was really raking in the bucks ,he had a real assembly line set up.big dollars everyday! this was in a mid size city with several major hospitals .I know several people that have been screwed up and never sued because lawyers told them they had to pay a big fee up front and the end result wouldnt be that great.Hospitals get away with a lot more than you think.And whats funny is they have you by the balls,when they f’up they still get paid or you get sued.When they kill you its almost impossible to prove.

People get all worked up about various grand concepts, when in reality the situation doesn’t really intersect them very much.

For example, seatbelt laws are already in place, whether or not you have socialized medicine.

There are all kinds of real pros and cons to socializing something, but becoming a slave to your government probably isn’t really one of them.

Maybe people should try to focus on the real issues every now and then? Or is that too difficult?