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bulking diet opinions

hey guys just need opinions on my bulking diet…stats are 31 yrs old 5’10 152lbs 10% b.f. right now…here goes breakfast: 5 egg whites & 1 whole egg, 1/2 cup oats with 1 scoop optimum nutrition pro complex. 500mg ala…meal# 2-- 2 scoops pro powder with water…meal# 3–2 cans tuna with 3/4 cup brown rice…500mg ala…eca stack and one apple before work out,post work out 2 scoops pro powder with water and 4 tbsp of dextrose powder…meal# 5—2 chicken breasts with 1 can brown beans or 1 cup brown rice ,meal # 6—2 scoops pro powder with water…and thats it for the day…hopefully this sounds good give me some opinions bros…thanks

Just do what I did and scrap whatever you were doing before reading John Berardi’s massive eating(check archeives). Work out your daily caloric maitenence level and increase it accordingly and stick within the P+C, P+F guidlines. It’s working for me and if your serious enough it will work for you.

oh by the way i forgot to mention i am taking 500 mg ala on every carb meal plus i am going to start taking mag 10 ,tribex ,and “m” next week…thanks for the help

alw, I agree with Alexander. Before you begin anything, read Berardi’s articles. It will make all the difference in the world; especially if you’re going to try the Mag-10 cycle.

Eating enough will be the main determinant when it comes to gaining while on androgens. Give the articles a read.

Hi, alw. Along with the great advice you’ve received thus far, I would recommend you start keeping a food log, with a breakdown of calories, carb grams, protein grams and fat grams. It doesn’t look to me that you’re taking in enough calories. And even if you do a cycle of Mag 10, if you’re hypocaloric (not enough calories, in this case) you’re not going to put on any weight or size; you’re just likely to drop some BF (and gain a little muscle).



So take advantage of the resources here on T-Mag, educate yourself about nutrition, read everything ever written by John Berardi in the article archives, read the forum regularly, try different workout programs. And then, with your house in order, go for it. People here do exactly that all the time with great results.



Good luck to you.

Ingredients are certainly worthy. I didn’t take the time to count calories; if it’s appropriate, you’ll figure out soon enough. Consider throwing in vitamin C and V8 juice, if for nothing more than an attempt to stay healthy.

-DI

 Really did your homework there. However, ditch the apple. Fructose before a workout has been associated with impaired performance in the gym. How many carbs are packed in the pro supplement? If not more than 30, then I would add some whole grain bread, oatmeal, or brown rice to your second meal. However, it sounds like you know what you're doing.

Not only does the fructose predispose you to higher levels of perceived exertion and GI upset, eating carbs in such a small amount–and not consuming carbs (with protein) during your workout–will likely lead to rebound hypoglycemia. Blood flow and elevated insulin levels will lead to a greater rate of glucose disposal than can be supplied. [br]

Other thoughts: Meal 1. More carbs; 2. Throw in some healthy fats; your protein supplement will not be utilized properly (i.e. it will be oxidized for energy needs) in the absence of fat or carbs; 3. okie dokey; 4. we talked about the apple; Pre/During Training…nothing here…we need something! Post-Training 4 tbsp of dextrose = how many carbs? Doesn’t sound like enough to me. You should be taking in about 50g of carbs. 5. good-to-go; 6. again, baby, we need some healthy fats to go with that protein!

Timbo’s right. You’re trying to bulk right??


Well you’re gonna come up short on calories unless you boost the fat intake. You can try fatty fish/fish oil caps; flax oil; peanut butter (natural); some red meat; and also for brekky keep in a few more egg yolks. They’re really NOT the demon a lot of people seem to think they are.


Anyway, do some more reading, calculate your NEEDS, then work out the diet to meet these needs. Obviously as Tampa says, this will require a food log. By the sounds of it you are organised enough that this shouldn’t be a problem.

BTW, I am interested (and possibly others here are too),what training routine(s) are you going to be using, and how long are you going to bulk for?


Best of luck, SRS.

hey bros thanks for the replies first of all…i was looking at my caloric intake and im thinking it is around 3100 to 3200 cals ,350 g pro ,330 g carbs not sure of the fat yet…im going to set down tonight and add everything back up and i will get back with yall on the specific amounts but im sure im pretty close on it…by j.b’s mass calculator i only need around 3200 cals to bulk if i did it right but im not sure…about my training i really dont have a specifc plan as in 5x5 or something like that…i worked with a trainer for a while when i first started lifting and i am on my on now with a pretty good routine i think…i dont leave any body parts out thats for sure …oh and i do implement 20 rep squats…those are hell by the way…hahahah…anyway let me know if yall need my workout and i will post it as well…thanks again guys…ps… the carbs in the dextrose is 53 g per 2 tbsp…good stuff i think…

One thing that no one has pointed out yet is the fact that you will be wasting your money if you take Mag 10 Tribex and M at the same time. From your post it sounds like this is what you were planning on doing. The recommendation is for you to take mag 10 for 2 weeks followed by 4 weeks of Tribex and M to help counter any T suppresion and to boost natural levels to high normal.
I f this is what you were planning then I guess I misread your post but if not just wanted to give you a heads up.
:slight_smile: Groove

alw,


Pleased you feel we’re helping out, and I (and I think others here) look forward to seeing your complete plan.


Post the workout too, can. Just remember, if you’re on a bulking program you need a routine that’s gonna:

  1. Give/allow for visible progression over the cycle.
  2. Give adequate recuperation time for muscle growth.


    SRS

ok guys here goes with the plan…and yes i will be following the mag 10 dosing as prescribed …sorry if i wasnt clear on that in my earlier posts…haha…my workout plan looks like this…i workout 3 days a week right now mondays ,wed,and fridays…mon is chest ,shoulders,and tris…the routine is incline decline and flat db presses,flat and incline db flyes,barbell presses,db lat raises and bentover db lat raises,db overhead ext.,cable pressdowns and weighted dips to finish…all these are for 3 sets and 8-10 reps each set…wed… is leg day…the routine is squats of course,leg ext,leg curls,stationary lunges,stiff leg deads and then standing calf raises…same amount of sets and reps as above…friday is back and bi’s…routine is …lat pulldowns,db bentover rows ,seated cable rows,db shrugs…ez bar curls,preacher curls and then hammer curls…and thats it for my complete workout routine if yall have any suggestions please let me know…sorry for the long post too…just didnt want to leave anything out…

hey guys just wanted to let yall know my caloric totals for this diet as i said i would …i was a little shy so i figured i would add another shake at the end of the night for added cals…also i have way too much protein in one meal so i took out one of the chicken breasts at that meal…anyway the totals are 2943 calories,360g prot,312g carbs and 24.5g fat…i hope this looks ok…anyway i have been on this diet for a short time and i have went from 146lbs to my current 152 so maybe it is working…let me know some opinions bro’s…

Fat’s less than Ten Percent I see. That jumps out right away, my friend. That won’t fly on these boards. 360g of protein at a Bodyweight of 150? That’s a little high in my opinion. I wouldn’t see a need for more than about 225-250g. That would open up about 540 more calories and 60g more of fat.

If you're eating enough then any combination of nutrients is going to work. That is, if your goal is simply to see numbers on the scale go up. But, I would like to see you bump up the fat to at least 15-20% of total calories (i.e. at least 50g). Those should come primarily from omega-3s, specifically fish oils.

well i find it hard to get 3800 calories(for myself) eating clean, and you look like your eating clean. ok guys what do you think about my routine and eating. todays meal
7am 2 egg mcmuffin, i know i know, but look at their website.
9am 1 cup oatmeal plain with 10 dried aprcoits
11am 1/3lb roastbeef lil mayo,low fat, lettuce, and 7 grain wheat bread.looks like bird food on it. i make everything myself
1:30pm i can of tuna with same amount of bread and mayo
3pm mrp
5pm work out half serving if surge w/ creatine and l-glutamine
6pm finish workout rest of surge
7:30 chiken brest whole(or tri tip, 1/3 lb) with mashed potatoes and bread.sometimes fish.
thats typical daily eating, sometime i have a mrp in the middle of the night. work out schedule is
mon- back and chest, pull ups, bent rows, standing row(grab one end of olympic bar and row away) then flat bench, followed by dips.
tuesday- squats, dead lifts,then lunges.
wednesday- mill press,dumbell press, then barbell curls, then standing dumbells curls, start off like a hammer curl then twist at the top, skull crushers, then close grip bench.
thrusday off.
friday- start routine over. stats are 5-11 @162lbs. bf around 15%. ok let me have it! i do all reps at 4-2 pace and usually 3 sets 8-10 reps. trying to bulk up here and so far kinda working but i think i’m still lacking in calories.want to put on 30lbs. thanks

OK.
I’ll tackle the diet first:


Did you read what myself and Timbo were saying above?. Did you take it in? From experience I can tell you that unless you can eat like a horse day in and day out, you are just not going to be able to keep up that level of food calorie intake without more fat in the diet.


Please don’t fall into that old-found theory that fat is bad. Noooo, it’s the TYPE of fat, and the COMBINATION of nutrients that is to blame for our nation of fatties (and not working out too of course!).


Think about the fat sources I listed above. Combine them into several (2-3) Fat and Protein meals only during the day (a la J Berardi). Fat is 1) dense, at 9cal/g, 2) It doesn’t fill you up as much as protein, so it’s easier to take in more calories, and 3) It’s CHEAP vs quality protein sources.

Why not give us a meal by meal breakdown, with the incorporation of more fat into the diet. (For the calories you’re shooting for, I would go for at least 25% calories from fat, vs your current less than 10%).


I understand that you’ve been gaining with the current diet. But did you also realise, that as your body weight increases, you will need to keep upping the calories again and again to feed your new lean body mass. It will soon become imposible without increasing fat.


Don’t worry, you won’t lose out on enough protein for gaining by taking a bit less. Currently you’re taking in more than 5g/kg! That’s overkill.


Let’s say you change things around to get 25% fat calories (the minumum I would recommend here). For a 3100cal diet, this would equate to 193g Fat. EASILY done with those healthy fat sources menioned.


This leaves 2325 calories. If you took in 35% as protein (271g), this would still give you around 4g/kg, or 1.8g/lb. PLENTY in my opinion for muscle growth and recovery.


That leaves 1240cals (40%) carbohydrates, or 310g. Easily done with good carb sources- wheat pasta and brown rice are my favourites.


What d’ya think of my reasoning? Let us know.


SRS

OK, here are my thoughts as to the training part of your plan: (Just my opinions)

Training frequency- fine.


Training split- fine

Volume and chosen exercises:-


(1) Chest/Tri’s day: 33 sets is probably a little high on the chest/tri’s day. Why not use only 1 chest press variation (flat, incl, decline) and rotate it in subsequent workouts, for say 5 sets total?


How big are your triceps? How much do they contribute to your total body mass? Do you realise that you’re hitting them very hard in the chest exercises that come before? So do you really need to devote 3 exercises to them? Why not drop it to 1-2 exercises for 4 or 3 sets respectively? Similarly you can do 2 shoulder exercises and gain just fine with enough intensity.


So how about:
DB pressing mvmt (1 variation of): 5 sets.


Flyes (1 variation) 3 sets.


Shoulder presses (standing or seated) 5sets.


Lateral raises, 3 sets.


Overhead extension- 3 sets


Cable pushdowns- 3 sets.

  • A total of 23 sets, and you are hitting the major muscle bulk first, before doing one isolation movement. (Remember you’re BULKING!)

(2) Legs- You said you had incorporated 20 rep squats in the past. Then you know the quality of squatting for mass gains on the WHOLE body. So why only 3 sets?! I think you should throw the leg extensions and curls (“girly” exercises!) in the garbage can, and concentrate on 5 quality sets of squats. Follow this with 3 sets of lunges and 3-4 sets of SL DL’s. Then calf raises.


Total: 15 sets, but it will still be tough if done properly.

(3) Back/biceps: DUDE! how can you post a back routine on a T-Mag forum without a CHINNING exercise! Let me torch you more painlessly than some others might on the forum :-).


Time and again chins have been shown to do the business that lpd’s simply don’t. If you don’t believe me, just ask around or do a search. And no, it’s NOT the same exercise!If you can’t do several reps, then work up to it with hangs/negatives. Or even better get an experienced spotter who can get you past the sticking point.


How about:


Chins (slightly wider than shoulder width apart, pronated grip)- 5 sets 8-10r


Bent over rows- 3 sets


Cable seated rows- 3 sets


(Take or leave the DB shrugs- not really needed IMO unless you feel your traps are letting you down in other exercises).


EZ bar curls- 3-4 sets


Hammer curls- 3 sets


Why spend more time on the bi’s? The same reason as given for the tri’s above, goes here. You’re working them in all your other compound exercises.


So, a total of 17-20 sets. A good intense workout.


Then, get out the gym, (hopefully workout in 1hr or less), and eat and sleep!


Others may give you different opinions, and you don’t have to listen to me if you don’t want to. Just trying to think logically here, apply sound principles, and telling you what has worked for me, and others I know, in the past.


Good luck again. SRS:-)

Workout routine looks solid, however I think the frequency may be overtraining (Squats, bench and D’L’s TWICE a week??).


Why don’t you switch to a 1d on, 1d off schedule? Training the major body parts 1x weekly would give you more time to recover, and REBUILD- (1)muscles can recuperate; (2) As J Berardi suggests, the days “off” allow for a hypercaloric day, due to the missing workout. THIS is what gives you the extra calories that adds up at the end of the week to a mass gain.


If you want to add more calories, why not throw in another P/F meal pre-bed. e.g. cottage cheese and flax oil, or similar?

So, in summary:
a) Train less frequently allowing more time to grow.


b) Bump up the calories slightly by adding 1 more meal. This, along with the extra calories available to the body through training less should be enough to tip the balance in your favour for gaining. -I’d be surprised, as long as you kept to the calorie intake guidelines, if you didn’t gain well off this regime.


Good luck too. SRS

MDOG TO SRS


well my intent was trying to get conditioned for the growth surge II. going to try a mag10 cycle soon. you think my routine is too much? what if i kept it same routine but went 1 on 1 off like you sugest and still do the mag10?