T Nation

Bulking + Cardio Advice

Hello and thank you for reading this post.

So i recently just hit 190 with about 14% Bf, Now i haven’t did cardio in years because i was afraid of loosing my gains as an ectomorph. My goal for this bulk is 200 but just recently notice some fat around the waist and chin area.

Now i’m realizing that i have been neglecting the most important muscle in my body and so i have come here to ask about sprinting on my off days.

Currently i’m using a 3 day routine for muscle building, I’m planing on sprinting on my off days but have no idea how to go about it.

Any advice would be amazing, Thank you for your time.

Hill Sprints are superior for non-athletes in my opinion, so try finding a hill.
It’s easier to recover from and doesn’t take very much technical skill to sprint on a hill.

Start at 10 runs, increase this number as far as it can go without it detrimentally affecting your weight training and general recovery.

Remember though, if you’re not a speed-oriented athlete, and you’re just lifting to look good, sprinting is only an accessory movement, don’t ever make it a priority, the weight room is your priority.

Speaking of which, if you really want to drop fat, go to the gym more than 3 times a week.

Don’t over complicate things, imo. I’ve found 10 100s twice per week to be pretty effective.

Sprint yourself tired and give it a few weeks to gauge recovery and efficacy. Make adjustments as needed.

Hello and thank you for your replies, I’m aiming to drop only 2% of bf in this bulk. I made a big mistake before in taking weight gainers and i think that may have caused the fat gain. I changed that up and i was looking into this hiit routine.

Now i’m not looking into cutting just yet i just want to reduce or manage the fat a tiny bit while getting of course the benefits of sprinting. I understand i’d need to adjust my calorie intake as well.

As for working out more then three days, I find Mon/wed/friday has always worked well for me, Now would tuesday and thursday be the best time for the sprinting? Wednesday is legs so not sure if it would be a great idea to do sprinting on the thursday.

No offense, but you are not 14% if that’s you in your profile picture. I’m not trying to stir shit up but let’s be realistic. You are pushing 20%, if not more.

You need to do more cardio than just sprints. Do sprints 1-2x week, intelligently, and do some LISS on other days. 20-30 minutes of smooth stairclimbing/elliptical/incline treadmill should be fine. Don’t go overboard, but don’t be a pussy. Cardio is important man.

I take any advice i can get, Thank you kindly for this.

I happen to get my Bf % from the gym, They had this machine i had to step on with my bare feet. I suppose it wasn’t right then. I’ll get right to doing this. The HIIT sprint thimg is new to me so i figured i would start there first.

So How does this look for my cardio while bulking…

Monday/wed/fri is my muscle building day
Tuesday/Thursday HIIT sprint
Sunday = LISS 30 mins fast walk on treadmill

less than 20

bro

Seriously, you’re fine walking in the mornings 3x/week for starters…add as necessary. Anything more will cut into your recovery on the most important part of your training–the weight room. Not to mention, your number one goal: BULKING! No reason to interfere with that process and force yourself to have to take in more calories because of some ill-informed notion that you HAVE TO be running sprints during the week so your heart doesn’t give out.

Shit dude, I’ve gotten down to 10% bodyfat before without doing any cardio and ask myself just how much if any is necessary while cutting, let alone bulking!

Also, please be weary of any advice that includes the words “don’t be a pussy.”

[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Seriously, you’re fine walking in the mornings 3x/week for starters…add as necessary. Anything more will cut into your recovery on the most important part of your training–the weight room. Not to mention, your number one goal: BULKING! No reason to interfere with that process and force yourself to have to take in more calories because of some ill-informed notion that you HAVE TO be running sprints during the week so your heart doesn’t give out.

Shit dude, I’ve gotten down to 10% bodyfat before without doing any cardio and ask myself just how much if any is necessary while cutting, let alone bulking!

Also, please be weary of any advice that includes the words “don’t be a pussy.” [/quote]

Give me a fucking break, clearly distorting words as if I was calling him a pussy.

OP, your plan sounds fine and reasonable. As I implied, and apparently what some retards can’t infer, don’t go overboard. If you start noticing ill effects then slow it down some. It’s all about finding the sweet spot.

Also, in regards to your BF%, you’re definitely okay. It’s not bad that you’re not a true 14%, but just wanted to let you know that realistically you’re just not that low.

Also, I â?¢wouldâ?¢ be weary indeed about where you get your advice from. I have seen jscabracadabra’s pics on a different website and I’ll keep it at that. Ebomb, one of the more respected posters no longer here, does an asinine amount of cardio and looks fucking terrific. I guess he’s just BULKING right, despite having almost won a pro card already. Cardio will have carry over to all areas of health and fitness, be it a healthier heart, a better physique, better stamina while sexing/lifting or a combination of all three. Plus, it’s just reason to eat more which, uh, who’s complaining about that?

[quote]SSC wrote:

[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Cardio will have carry over to all areas of health and fitness, be it a healthier heart, a better physique, better stamina while sexing/lifting or a combination of all three. Plus, it’s just reason to eat more which, uh, who’s complaining about that? [/quote]

agreed, also goes along the lines of Berardi’s G-Flux concept. Makes sense when you think about it, more exercise equals better insulin sensitivity for one, heavens knows that as you are bulking better IS will be a good thing.

of course, the downside is for those that find eating enough to be a challenge will have to adjust as need be.

[quote]SSC wrote:

[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Seriously, you’re fine walking in the mornings 3x/week for starters…add as necessary. Anything more will cut into your recovery on the most important part of your training–the weight room. Not to mention, your number one goal: BULKING! No reason to interfere with that process and force yourself to have to take in more calories because of some ill-informed notion that you HAVE TO be running sprints during the week so your heart doesn’t give out.

Shit dude, I’ve gotten down to 10% bodyfat before without doing any cardio and ask myself just how much if any is necessary while cutting, let alone bulking!

Also, please be weary of any advice that includes the words “don’t be a pussy.” [/quote]

Give me a fucking break, clearly distorting words as if I was calling him a pussy.

OP, your plan sounds fine and reasonable. As I implied, and apparently what some retards can’t infer, don’t go overboard. If you start noticing ill effects then slow it down some. It’s all about finding the sweet spot.

Also, in regards to your BF%, you’re definitely okay. It’s not bad that you’re not a true 14%, but just wanted to let you know that realistically you’re just not that low.

Also, I â?¢wouldâ?¢ be weary indeed about where you get your advice from. I have seen jscabracadabra’s pics on a different website and I’ll keep it at that. Ebomb, one of the more respected posters no longer here, does an asinine amount of cardio and looks fucking terrific. I guess he’s just BULKING right, despite having almost won a pro card already. Cardio will have carry over to all areas of health and fitness, be it a healthier heart, a better physique, better stamina while sexing/lifting or a combination of all three. Plus, it’s just reason to eat more which, uh, who’s complaining about that? [/quote]

this, if you have extra fat just add nice non impact cardio as was mentioned, you can go hard on an elliptical!!! up that resistance and go at it hardstyle, it wont impede your recovery. If anything when im doing more cardio my recovery is better in and out of the weightroom…less rest btw sets, exercises etc… its great. I love cardio.

Doing as little cardio as you can is optimal, imo :slight_smile:

Im srs

[quote]SSC wrote:

[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Seriously, you’re fine walking in the mornings 3x/week for starters…add as necessary. Anything more will cut into your recovery on the most important part of your training–the weight room. Not to mention, your number one goal: BULKING! No reason to interfere with that process and force yourself to have to take in more calories because of some ill-informed notion that you HAVE TO be running sprints during the week so your heart doesn’t give out.

Shit dude, I’ve gotten down to 10% bodyfat before without doing any cardio and ask myself just how much if any is necessary while cutting, let alone bulking!

Also, please be weary of any advice that includes the words “don’t be a pussy.” [/quote]

Give me a fucking break, clearly distorting words as if I was calling him a pussy.

OP, your plan sounds fine and reasonable. As I implied, and apparently what some retards can’t infer, don’t go overboard. If you start noticing ill effects then slow it down some. It’s all about finding the sweet spot.

Also, in regards to your BF%, you’re definitely okay. It’s not bad that you’re not a true 14%, but just wanted to let you know that realistically you’re just not that low.

Also, I Ã?¢?Ã?¢wouldÃ?¢?Ã?¢ be weary indeed about where you get your advice from. I have seen jscabracadabra’s pics on a different website and I’ll keep it at that. Ebomb, one of the more respected posters no longer here, does an asinine amount of cardio and looks fucking terrific. I guess he’s just BULKING right, despite having almost won a pro card already. Cardio will have carry over to all areas of health and fitness, be it a healthier heart, a better physique, better stamina while sexing/lifting or a combination of all three. Plus, it’s just reason to eat more which, uh, who’s complaining about that? [/quote]

I was referring to the fact that you said “don’t be a pussy” without explaining what that means…it means so many different things to different people. I’ve seen that mentality get people injured. Again I said be weary of the ADVICE without making it personal to you.

But thanks for making yours personal? I guess shelby really failed me. I’m sorry to disappoint you. I’ll email him and tell him to stop lying to me about my progress.

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

[quote]SSC wrote:

[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Seriously, you’re fine walking in the mornings 3x/week for starters…add as necessary. Anything more will cut into your recovery on the most important part of your training–the weight room. Not to mention, your number one goal: BULKING! No reason to interfere with that process and force yourself to have to take in more calories because of some ill-informed notion that you HAVE TO be running sprints during the week so your heart doesn’t give out.

Shit dude, I’ve gotten down to 10% bodyfat before without doing any cardio and ask myself just how much if any is necessary while cutting, let alone bulking!

Also, please be weary of any advice that includes the words “don’t be a pussy.” [/quote]

Give me a fucking break, clearly distorting words as if I was calling him a pussy.

OP, your plan sounds fine and reasonable. As I implied, and apparently what some retards can’t infer, don’t go overboard. If you start noticing ill effects then slow it down some. It’s all about finding the sweet spot.

Also, in regards to your BF%, you’re definitely okay. It’s not bad that you’re not a true 14%, but just wanted to let you know that realistically you’re just not that low.

Also, I Ã??Ã?¢?Ã??Ã?¢wouldÃ??Ã?¢?Ã??Ã?¢ be weary indeed about where you get your advice from. I have seen jscabracadabra’s pics on a different website and I’ll keep it at that. Ebomb, one of the more respected posters no longer here, does an asinine amount of cardio and looks fucking terrific. I guess he’s just BULKING right, despite having almost won a pro card already. Cardio will have carry over to all areas of health and fitness, be it a healthier heart, a better physique, better stamina while sexing/lifting or a combination of all three. Plus, it’s just reason to eat more which, uh, who’s complaining about that? [/quote]

I was referring to the fact that you said “don’t be a pussy” without explaining what that means…it means so many different things to different people. I’ve seen that mentality get people injured. Again I said be weary of the ADVICE without making it personal to you.

But thanks for making yours personal? I guess shelby really failed me. I’m sorry to disappoint you. I’ll email him and tell him to stop lying to me about my progress.
[/quote]

I’ll outright apologize for my post and the stab taken at you. It was out of line and out of character ad I have no excuse. You’ve made great progress so far and should keep going.

That being said, I just feel, in my own personal and no one else’s opinion, that a couple walks a week does not just cut it. I mean, I get it man. I did the whole “do as little cardio as possible” thing, winch mostly revolved around dc principles/fmc, etc. It kept my bodys bf controls in check, yes, but could not find one other benefit from that.

Years later, after continuing to soak up knowledge, learn my body and watch others, I surmised and came to the “a-ha” that that shit is important. I’m doing this to be as big and awesome looking just like anyone else, but as alluded to above there is just so much freaking carry over when cardio is taken more seriously, IMO. I know this is one of those hot button topics that is cliche, and will continue to forever be debated, but I just cant stress enough the incredible changes in almost every facet of my life when I made the switch. I want the same for others, too.

Once again, sincere apologies for the rashness displayed earlier. This site seems to bring out the worst in me and maybe I ought to stop posting again.

That being said… You looked so awesome lean. Wouldn’t you rather look more like that all year long… And make the same amount of progress?!

[quote]SSC wrote:
I’ll outright apologize for my post and the stab taken at you. It was out of line and out of character ad I have no excuse. You’ve made great progress so far and should keep going.

That being said, I just feel, in my own personal and no one else’s opinion, that a couple walks a week does not just cut it. I mean, I get it man. I did the whole “do as little cardio as possible” thing, winch mostly revolved around dc principles/fmc, etc. It kept my bodys bf controls in check, yes, but could not find one other benefit from that.

Years later, after continuing to soak up knowledge, learn my body and watch others, I surmised and came to the “a-ha” that that shit is important. I’m doing this to be as big and awesome looking just like anyone else, but as alluded to above there is just so much freaking carry over when cardio is taken more seriously, IMO. I know this is one of those hot button topics that is cliche, and will continue to forever be debated, but I just cant stress enough the incredible changes in almost every facet of my life when I made the switch. I want the same for others, too.

Once again, sincere apologies for the rashness displayed earlier. This site seems to bring out the worst in me and maybe I ought to stop posting again.

That being said… You looked so awesome lean. Wouldn’t you rather look more like that all year long… And make the same amount of progress?!
[/quote]

Thanks for the apology. I was a little surprised to be honest. I don’t often get offended around this site, but the fact that you referenced something off the site (I believe you’re talking about facebook) I took it personally. Your comment did actually make me look over my photos for a few minutes and think, “hmmm…I’m I really just kidding myself?”

Anyway, I think in the long run it’s a moot point. In a matter of THREE WEEKS with Shelby, I dropped down 9lbs and got my blood pressure back to a near perfect 120/68 just from walking 6 times a week for 30 minutes and weight training…nothing else. I’m not exactly a naturally lean guy either. I think people just overestimate the damage a few months without cardio does. I’m glad I didn’t get held up on cardio and was able to leave it all in the weight room so to speak. I made pretty solid gains in strength that I don’t think would’ve happened if I was running sprints or pushign a prowler a couple times/week…I really don’t.

In reference to your comment about staying lean year round…this was my one time all out bulk…60lbs in about 15 or so months. As much muscle as I could pile on. I’m working with shelby to get myself into fitness modeling and possibly do a men’s physique comp. Believe me, from that point on, I will be staying relatively leanish year round.

You mention me looking better lean. Well I hit that leanness eating around 1800 cals/day, and only about 50g worth of carbs. I would not make half the progress I did if I tried to stay that lean. I should mention that shelby was actually working with me during parts of my bulk too, so I trusted his judgement. I am NOT naturally lean bloak. You can check my hub for pics of me before I started lifting.

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

[quote]SSC wrote:
I’ll outright apologize for my post and the stab taken at you. It was out of line and out of character ad I have no excuse. You’ve made great progress so far and should keep going.

That being said, I just feel, in my own personal and no one else’s opinion, that a couple walks a week does not just cut it. I mean, I get it man. I did the whole “do as little cardio as possible” thing, winch mostly revolved around dc principles/fmc, etc. It kept my bodys bf controls in check, yes, but could not find one other benefit from that.

Years later, after continuing to soak up knowledge, learn my body and watch others, I surmised and came to the “a-ha” that that shit is important. I’m doing this to be as big and awesome looking just like anyone else, but as alluded to above there is just so much freaking carry over when cardio is taken more seriously, IMO. I know this is one of those hot button topics that is cliche, and will continue to forever be debated, but I just cant stress enough the incredible changes in almost every facet of my life when I made the switch. I want the same for others, too.

Once again, sincere apologies for the rashness displayed earlier. This site seems to bring out the worst in me and maybe I ought to stop posting again.

That being said… You looked so awesome lean. Wouldn’t you rather look more like that all year long… And make the same amount of progress?!
[/quote]

Thanks for the apology. I was a little surprised to be honest. I don’t often get offended around this site, but the fact that you referenced something off the site (I believe you’re talking about facebook) I took it personally. Your comment did actually make me look over my photos for a few minutes and think, “hmmm…I’m I really just kidding myself?”

Anyway, I think in the long run it’s a moot point. In a matter of THREE WEEKS with Shelby, I dropped down 9lbs and got my blood pressure back to a near perfect 120/68 just from walking 6 times a week for 30 minutes and weight training…nothing else. I’m not exactly a naturally lean guy either. I think people just overestimate the damage a few months without cardio does. I’m glad I didn’t get held up on cardio and was able to leave it all in the weight room so to speak. I made pretty solid gains in strength that I don’t think would’ve happened if I was running sprints or pushign a prowler a couple times/week…I really don’t.

In reference to your comment about staying lean year round…this was my one time all out bulk…60lbs in about 15 or so months. As much muscle as I could pile on. I’m working with shelby to get myself into fitness modeling and possibly do a men’s physique comp. Believe me, from that point on, I will be staying relatively leanish year round.

You mention me looking better lean. Well I hit that leanness eating around 1800 cals/day, and only about 50g worth of carbs. I would not make half the progress I did if I tried to stay that lean. I should mention that shelby was actually working with me during parts of my bulk too, so I trusted his judgement. I am NOT naturally lean bloak. You can check my hub for pics of me before I started lifting. [/quote]

Shit man, you’re making me eat my words - hard. lol. For the record, and it still does not justify the asshole that I had displayed, but when I took that dig at you it was more of a “This is what someone looks like when not doing cardio,” not ‘This guy looks like shit - Don’t listen to him.’ Again, I still feel bad and it shouldn’t have occurred, period.

And fair enough man, I’m guessing Shelby has a decent grasp on the whole body composition thing, ha. I’m actually not someone who can get away with a bunch of HIIT consistently, so I don’t necessarily agree that someone needs to be sprinting twice a week either, plus LISS and whatever else all at once. I’ve naturally gravitated towards minimizing HIIT and utilizing LISS more frequently. I’ve noticed it doesn’t cut in to my recovery, and while boring, has definitely allowed me to keep things much tighter than ever before. I can’t imagine cutting it out these days, but I’ll be hiring a coach as well soon, and maybe he’ll tell me to fuck off with all the cardio, too. Hope not. :confused:

Anyway, I do still think each person has their own “sweet spot” that they need to find, especially when size is the primary goal, which is going to be different for all. I’m going to avoid leading this thread down the path of “lean gaining vs bulking,” because, we all know where that goes, haha. Regardless, I am excited to see what you’ll look like when lean again dude. Should be pretty nasty.

Personally I view endurance as a basic ability just like strenght. Not training it makes no sense to me. What is the point of having huge pecs and biceps if you cant fucking move? I am speaking from personal experience as well. For years I bought into the “cardio will eat away the calories needed for muscle growth” dogma. But its just complete bullshit.

I realized the error of my ways the day I got invited to go for a run. Within the first 5 minutes of the very first hill I was gassed to the point where I literally felt like I was gonna die or at least having an astmatic attack. Since that day I have been doing cardio 3-4 times per week. I feel better, look better and can actually go for a mountain hike with my friends without bringing a defibrillator.

Hello and thank you everyone for your reply, So i did my first session of hit on Tuesday. 15 second sprints with 60 seconds rest 10 times.

Now it was hard i’m not going to lie but i just noticed one issue i have with my schedule. Leg day is Wednesday and i don’t think doing hiit on the thursday would be a good idea. So when should i add it in? Saturday?

Now for anyone who didn’t see my above post i do a three day weight training routine. Mon(chest/bi)Wed(legs/shoulder)Friday(Back/tri).

Currently i added Hit on Tuesday, Now if i add it on the saturday to would that be enough cardio? Or would it be recommended to do liss on thursday while keeping the hit for Tuesday and Saturday? and taking sunday off?

Thanks for reading.

jskrabac u dropped down 1800 kcals per day? how long for?

[quote]SSC wrote:

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

[quote]SSC wrote:
I’ll outright apologize for my post and the stab taken at you. It was out of line and out of character ad I have no excuse. You’ve made great progress so far and should keep going.

That being said, I just feel, in my own personal and no one else’s opinion, that a couple walks a week does not just cut it. I mean, I get it man. I did the whole “do as little cardio as possible” thing, winch mostly revolved around dc principles/fmc, etc. It kept my bodys bf controls in check, yes, but could not find one other benefit from that.

Years later, after continuing to soak up knowledge, learn my body and watch others, I surmised and came to the “a-ha” that that shit is important. I’m doing this to be as big and awesome looking just like anyone else, but as alluded to above there is just so much freaking carry over when cardio is taken more seriously, IMO. I know this is one of those hot button topics that is cliche, and will continue to forever be debated, but I just cant stress enough the incredible changes in almost every facet of my life when I made the switch. I want the same for others, too.

Once again, sincere apologies for the rashness displayed earlier. This site seems to bring out the worst in me and maybe I ought to stop posting again.

That being said… You looked so awesome lean. Wouldn’t you rather look more like that all year long… And make the same amount of progress?!
[/quote]

Thanks for the apology. I was a little surprised to be honest. I don’t often get offended around this site, but the fact that you referenced something off the site (I believe you’re talking about facebook) I took it personally. Your comment did actually make me look over my photos for a few minutes and think, “hmmm…I’m I really just kidding myself?”

Anyway, I think in the long run it’s a moot point. In a matter of THREE WEEKS with Shelby, I dropped down 9lbs and got my blood pressure back to a near perfect 120/68 just from walking 6 times a week for 30 minutes and weight training…nothing else. I’m not exactly a naturally lean guy either. I think people just overestimate the damage a few months without cardio does. I’m glad I didn’t get held up on cardio and was able to leave it all in the weight room so to speak. I made pretty solid gains in strength that I don’t think would’ve happened if I was running sprints or pushign a prowler a couple times/week…I really don’t.

In reference to your comment about staying lean year round…this was my one time all out bulk…60lbs in about 15 or so months. As much muscle as I could pile on. I’m working with shelby to get myself into fitness modeling and possibly do a men’s physique comp. Believe me, from that point on, I will be staying relatively leanish year round.

You mention me looking better lean. Well I hit that leanness eating around 1800 cals/day, and only about 50g worth of carbs. I would not make half the progress I did if I tried to stay that lean. I should mention that shelby was actually working with me during parts of my bulk too, so I trusted his judgement. I am NOT naturally lean bloak. You can check my hub for pics of me before I started lifting. [/quote]

Shit man, you’re making me eat my words - hard. lol. For the record, and it still does not justify the asshole that I had displayed, but when I took that dig at you it was more of a “This is what someone looks like when not doing cardio,” not ‘This guy looks like shit - Don’t listen to him.’ Again, I still feel bad and it shouldn’t have occurred, period.

And fair enough man, I’m guessing Shelby has a decent grasp on the whole body composition thing, ha. I’m actually not someone who can get away with a bunch of HIIT consistently, so I don’t necessarily agree that someone needs to be sprinting twice a week either, plus LISS and whatever else all at once. I’ve naturally gravitated towards minimizing HIIT and utilizing LISS more frequently. I’ve noticed it doesn’t cut in to my recovery, and while boring, has definitely allowed me to keep things much tighter than ever before. I can’t imagine cutting it out these days, but I’ll be hiring a coach as well soon, and maybe he’ll tell me to fuck off with all the cardio, too. Hope not. :confused:

Anyway, I do still think each person has their own “sweet spot” that they need to find, especially when size is the primary goal, which is going to be different for all. I’m going to avoid leading this thread down the path of “lean gaining vs bulking,” because, we all know where that goes, haha. Regardless, I am excited to see what you’ll look like when lean again dude. Should be pretty nasty.[/quote]

For the record, I was doing zero cardio when I was at 10% as well as the entire time leading up to it. =) I really think people overestimate it.