T Nation

Brain Function Boosters 2.0


#1

Looks like we have been delegated to a new thread.

Let the fun begin.

Oh, and here is the old thread - http://tnation.tmuscle.com/free_online_forum/diet_performance_nutrition_supplements/brain_function_boosters

Here is a few words from Bushido Bad Boy

"So I've had a few PMs from folks, struggling to get through this mombassa of a thread, whislt picking out the relevant bits.

So I thought I would backtrack to my first post and write a 'cliff notes' version.

Herbal-and-almost-completely-side-effect-free-and-cheap-and easily-obtainable nootropic stack for first timers:

Vinpocetine 3 x 10mg ED with food.
Huperzine A 3 x 50mcg ED with food.
DMAE 600mg once or twice per day, to replenish chloin levels.

As with all stacks, start with one drug (vinpo), just once per day and build up from there. Once tolerance has been established, add in the next drug, etc.

Next Addition:

A racetam, either piracetam or my fave; aniracetam.

aniracetam@ 600mg 3 x ED would be nice, but a little expensive. Once per day would do I guess but is not optimal.

Piracetam I've never got on with, so I have no dose recommendations. I think up to about 2400mg ED though is standard.

Further Addition

Oxiracetam @ 700-800mg for a 'one time' dose, taken about 30 minutes before an especially intense study session. 2 hours later you will probably feel mentally drained.

Basic Substrates/Supplements

You should already be optimising your brain function with water, food, b complex vitamins, antioxidants, fish oils, etc. Don't ignore this type of stuff; it makes all the difference.

All the best my fellow cognitive enhancement crusaders!"

BBB


#2

Thanks man.

So if I’m not mistaken, Huperzine and Vinpo assist in retention?

And I am not sure what DMAE is supposed to do.


#3

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#4

Can you take huperzine a continuously? I keep hearing mixed things. Some say cycle it, some others say don’t and the label mentions nothing of cycling. The people that say cycle are saying 2 different things too, some say you get used to it and it become less effective with long term use, and some say it builds up too much gaining too much acetylcholine and you need to take a break. Confused!


#5

[quote]Stone101 wrote:
Thanks man.

So if I’m not mistaken, Huperzine and Vinpo assist in retention?

And I am not sure what DMAE is supposed to do. [/quote]

DMAE is a pursecuter to Acetylcholine, huperzine a prevents the breakdown, Vinpocetine assists with blood flow to the brain.


#6

Thanks for starting the new thread and the cliff notes. I’ve been debating trying out a racetam, but I’ve been having a hard time trying to find a source for some of them. Are they getting harder to find these days or do I just suck at Google?


#7

Has anybody here tried synaptine excel? it can be foudn at cerebralhealth.com anyway each cap contains 400mgs of oxiracetam and 300mgs of Alpha GPC and its $60 for the 60 count bottle. Either way I’ll probly experiment with a bottle and let you guys know what i think. thanks


#8

[quote]imagination wrote:
Can you take huperzine a continuously? I keep hearing mixed things. Some say cycle it, some others say don’t and the label mentions nothing of cycling. The people that say cycle are saying 2 different things too, some say you get used to it and it become less effective with long term use, and some say it builds up too much gaining too much acetylcholine and you need to take a break. Confused![/quote]

The Life Extension people say to cycle Huperzine.

They are usually a very scientific, reliable source. I take a majority(but not everything) of what they say as solid, factual info.

Here is what they say

"We have extensively evaluated Huperzine A and do not recommend that healthy people take it every day. Huperzine A functions as an acetylcholinesterase inhibitor. That means that it inhibits an enzyme in your brain that is responsible for degrading the neurotransmitter acetylcholine. Alzheimerâ??s disease patients have elevated levels of acetylcholinesterase and can therefore benefit by taking drugs like Aricept or nutrients like Huperzine A, which inhibit acetylcholinesterase.

Healthy people, on the other hand, need acetylcholinesterase to regulate acetylcholine levels in their brains. If you wanted to impress someone with your short-term memory on any given day you could safely take the recommended dose of Huperzine A, but we would not advise that you do so daily. We have a member who is a world class chess player, and has proven he can improve his scores by taking Huperzine A the day of a chess tournament.

While it is safe to boost acetylcholine levels by inhibiting acetylcholinesterase periodically, chronic use of Huperzine A could cause over-suppression of acetylcholinesterase and subsequent acetylcholine overload with unknown consequences. Remember, you can take huge amounts of acetylcholine precursors such as choline without fear of acetylcholine overload because you have acetylcholinesterase to degrade excess acetylcholine. If you block the bodyâ??s natural regulator of acetylcholine (that regulator being acetylcholinesterease), you may have a problem. We do not recommend that people take Huperzine A more than twice a week, much less promote it for daily use like other companies do.


#9

So far I’ve tried DMAE, Vinpo, Piraceteam and Moda. Love them all.

These types of supplement are really the BEST types b/c they actually WORK.


#10

Is Moda completely safe though? It is very intriguing…


#11

You (typically) need a script for it.

Some sneaky people have ways around that…


#12

Haven’t even gotten through the first thread yet… yes, I’m one of those, the guy that ACTUALLY reads the entire thread before making decisions…

While I’m reading the old thread, I’ll cut and paste some of the informative posts… Here’s one from Tone:

[quote]
The Top Smart Drugs & Nutrients:

The following are the safest and most widely appreciated substances for improving your mental function.

Acetyl-L-Carnitine:
Acetyl-L-Carnitine (ALC) is a naturally occurring amino acid and found in small quantities in milk. Because it is a common factor in many areas of the body it has a wide diversity of effects. These include benefits for depression, stroke, neuronal protection and the enhancement of the action of the mitochondria. Many of the theories of aging center on the reduction in efficiency of the mitochondria; ALC’s ability to support their function and prevent their decline is an obvious “anti-aging” benefit. ALC also increases brain cell metabolism and has been shown to improve memory, reaction time, and other cognitive functions. Dosage: 500 - 2000 mg daily

DHEA:
Dehydroepiandrosterone (pronounced dee-hi-dro-ep-i-an-dro-stair-own) or abbreviated to DHEA, is a steroid hormone produced naturally by the adrenal gland, and is the most abundant steroid found in the human blood stream. Research indicates that DHEA has significant anti obesity, anti cancer, cognitive enhancement and anti aging effects. DHEA levels naturally decline as we get older, and there is strong reason to think that DHEA supplements may extend life span and make us more youthful. Dosage: Women 10 - 25 mg daily, Men 25 - 50 mg daily

Ginkgo Biloba:
A great deal has been said about ginkgo since we introduced it in Smart Drugs & Nutrients. This supplement improves many brain functions including memory, attention, and concentration. It is also particularly good for ringing in the ears, dizziness, and general balance especially in the elderly. Dosage: 60 - 240 mg daily

Phosphatidylserine: (PS)
PS is food for your brain cell membranes. Much of your brain’s cell membranes are made up of PS and, with supplementation, you may see improvements in a wide variety of cognitive functions that tend to decline with age such as: memory, learning, concentration, general mood, and alertness. PS is also particularly effective at reducing the ill effects of stress and helps keep cortisol levels down (important for long term anti-aging purposes.) Dosage: start at 200 - 300 mg for one month, then taper down to 100 mg per day

Pregnenolone:
Pregnenolone may be one of the most effective, broad ranged and yet one of the safest anti-aging therapies at our disposal today. With its decades of safe and efficacious clinical use, the scope of treatments have included, alleviating stress, improving and extending energy levels, reducing arthritic inflammations, enhancing memory and acting as an antidepressant. The reason that pregnenolone can have such different uses is because it is the first sterone derived from cholesterol.

In fact it is the grandmother of all the steroids and neuro-steroids, it forms their basic material (it is a precursor). Without plentiful pregnenolone availability there is likely to be an “imbalance” of other steroids. For example estrogen, testosterone, progesterone and DHEA are all “sourced” from pregnenolone. Dosage: 10 - 100 mg daily

Vinpocetine:
Vinpocetine is a new addition to the latest class of “smart nutrients,” a class which has a specific effects on the chemical reactions that go on inside cells, to invigorate the brain and make it work normally. Vinpocetine, when taken regularly allows the brain to make better use of oxygen and energy. The brain accounts for only 2% of total body weight, however it receives between 15% to 20% of the blood, in order to enable it to receive energy from the sugar glucose. The brain only has small reserves of energy, and they can be expended within 2 to 3 minutes, if they have to be used. This means that proper brain function depends upon good blood flow, oxygen and glucose supply. Dosage: 5mg 2-3x daily

Smart Drugs

Deprenyl:
Deprenyl is currently the most promising therapy in the struggle against aging. Deprenyl is sold in the United States under the trade name of Eldepryl. Recent studies have shown that Deprenyl has a variety of beneficial effects on brain aging, without producing any toxic side effects. There is much evidence to suggest that Deprenyl is an antidepressant, a sexual stimulant, an effective treatment for Parkinson’s disease and a useful treatment for Alzheimer’s disease, as well as an anti-aging therapy.

Hydergine: (Ergoloid Mesylates)
Hydergine is considered to be one of the most important “smart drugs” available today. This is because it acts in a number of different ways to enhance mental capabilities and slows or regresses the aging processes in the brain. Hydergine is the brand name of the group of drugs known as Ergoloid Mesylates, and is widely regarded, as the best form available. Dosage: 3 - 9 mg daily

Modafinil:
Modafinil is an eugeroic drug, (which simply means “good arousal”). This unique class contains only two at present, adrafinil and modafinil, both of which have been developed by Lafon Laboratories of France. Currently, their use and effectiveness is little known outside of Europe. The basis of their uniqueness lies in their ability to only “stimulate when stimulation is required.” As a result the “highs and lows” associated with other stimulants such as amphetamine are absent with eugeroics. Their initial use often produces comments such as “I can’t tell any difference.” But it is only several hours later when one realizes that attention and awakeness are the same as earlier, that one is aware of their benefit. Dosage: 100 - 200 mg daily

Piracetam:
Piracetam is an intelligence booster, and CNS (central nervous system) stimulant with no known toxicity or addictive properties. Piracetam has been described by many people as a drug that “wakes up your brain”. Piracetam’s effect and safety have been so impressive, that it created a new classification of drugs called Nootropics. The term Nootropic is Greek and means “acting on the mind.” Since the creation of Piracetam, many pharmaceutical companies have been very busy developing further Nootropic drugs, such as Oxiracetam. Currently there are no FDA approved Nootropic drugs in the United States. If approval is gained the market for Nootropic drugs in the US alone is expected to be in excess of $1 billion a year (22). In the meantime, Piracetam can be ordered from European and Offshore pharmacies. Dosage: 2400 - 4800 mg daily

Centrophenoxine:
Centrophenoxine is an anti-aging drug widely used in Europe to increase brain energy. Centrophenoxine stimulates chemical activity of the brain, in particular the uptake of the sugar glucose is increased. Glucose is essential for energy production; oxygen consumption and carbon dioxide production also increase significantly when Centrophenoxine is taken regularly. Centrophenoxine has also been found to be very effective in the treatment of various human disorders, such as brain damage due to old age, stroke, brain injury caused by chemicals or drugs including excessive alcohol consumption. Centrophenoxine has the ability to protect against the damage caused by modern toxic environmental chemicals. Dosage: 250 1 or 2x daily

Human Growth Hormone: (HGH)
Human growth hormone (abbreviated to hGH) is a natural hormone, and levels have been shown to decrease as we age. hGH supplements have been described as the ultimate anti-aging therapy, with one scientific report concluding that hGH supplements were “equivalent in magnitude to (reversing) changes incurred during a 10 to 20 year period of aging.” Dosage: blood monitoring required - check with your physician.

Hope you like that. I found an online source for some Moda generic equivalent also.

Prices:
100mg tabs-quantity-30-$40.00
200mg tabs-quantity-30-$48.00
60-$86.40

ciao fellas,
ToneBone [/quote]


#13

My Dad is 85 years old, and complains about short term memory loss/forgetfulness, low energy, trouble concentrating… I’d like to suggest some nooptropics for him, but I hesitate because he’s got heart disease (multiple angioplasties over the years) as well as other health issues (shingles which affected his eye, not sure if that is relevant though). My main point is that if I were to get him on nootropics and he were to (totally coincidentally) have a stroke for example, I would feel guilty whether rightly or wrongly.

Are there any nootropic regimens that are appropriate for the elderly, and considered especially safe?


#14

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#15

Biotest, are you seeing this, as well as the popularity of the other nootropic thread? Could be some serious money to be made on developing a powerful nootropic supplement.

(yes, I know you have Spike, but…)


#16

[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:
Biotest, are you seeing this, as well as the popularity of the other nootropic thread? Could be some serious money to be made on developing a powerful nootropic supplement.

(yes, I know you have Spike, but…)[/quote]

I think both Spike and Powerdrive are sort of a combo of mind and body booster.

Works well. But isn’t exactly brain specific.

Meaning a product could be developed that would work much better, something that was more cerebral and less focused on physical performance.

I think the emphasis those products place on physical performance sort of pulls away from the mental aspect they bring, which is great, but still limited.


#17

[quote]Wise Guy wrote:
PimpBot5000 wrote:
Biotest, are you seeing this, as well as the popularity of the other nootropic thread? Could be some serious money to be made on developing a powerful nootropic supplement.

(yes, I know you have Spike, but…)

I think both Spike and Powerdrive are sort of a combo of mind and body booster.

Works well. But isn’t exactly brain specific.

Meaning a product could be developed that would work much better, something that was more cerebral and less focused on physical performance.

I think the emphasis those products place on physical performance sort of pulls away from the mental aspect they bring, which is great, but still limited. [/quote]

Exactly. Considering how many University students we have on here, to say nothing of people who just want to perform better mentally, it seems to me that there is an untapped market for a Biotest Cognitive enhancer. Spike and Power Drive do provide a mental boost to some extent but something specifically designed and marketed as a nootropic would do well, I think.


#18

Spike and Power Drive are great, and as I understand it, Alpha-GPC is basically a nootropic and a form of choline.


#19

I heard mention in the last thread about how people with ADD may not get the same effects. I was diagnosed with ADHD before it was the popular thing to do and spent most of my life on ritalin, concerta, adderral, or some other drug looking for something that would allow me to focus but still remain a normal human being.

That said (explains a lot, doesn’t it?) does anyone have any specific recommendations for someone with ADD or variants? I’ve got Vinpo and DMAE on the way but I want to look into others as well.


#20

[quote]threewhitelights wrote:
Spike and Power Drive are great, and as I understand it, Alpha-GPC is basically a nootropic and a form of choline.[/quote]

They should have put Alpha-GPC in Power Drive.

Now that would have been cool.