T Nation

Black Lives Matter


#1

Do groups such as this share any responsibility with the recent rash of cop shootings?

And if so, how can rational people combat groups/movements such as this? And I'm not talking about "challenge them on social media" etc.


#2

As an individualist, my answer is a "no, not at all".

Rational people understand the purpose of the movement/group, digest their message and either agree or disagree. Rational people do NOT take said message and execute otherwise innocent people. That is the action of irrational people. And the basic fact of the matter is, irrational people don't need a movement/group in order to perform such heinous acts, nor are such acts limited to people identifying with said group.

So while social agitation may put a certain "conversation" or "perspective" into the forefront, or otherwise effect an environment of an irrational person, I don't think the whole group, which is largely composed of rational people, should have to bear responsibility of the actions of the irrational.

We need to stop blaming society for the actions of an individual. This fits that mold.


#3

It starts at the top. Some may recall when Obama first became President a police officer stopped a black Professor at his own home thinking that he was an invader. Obama, without knowing any facts, said "the police acted stupidly".

Well, it has been all downhill since then. He has encouraged black people to riot by not telling them to stop and obey the law. Eric Holder told the local Police Force to stand down when they tore apart Ferguson. Obama has used the bully pulpit to attack Police Departments across America. Was he not thinking that there might be some unhinged black people who would take the law into their own hands and assassinate a cop?

I think he knew exactly what he was doing. Perhaps it had some unintended consequences like a giant hike in black on black violence because Police are backing off. But the blood is certainly at least partially on Obama's hands. He really has been at the heart of it. If there were no Obama as President there would be no radical group called "Black Lives Matter" either.

When he had a chance to put an end to the violence he poured gasoline on it.

The only thing we can do now is wait for his ungodly term to be over. Once he leaves office I imagine much of this violence will subside regardless of who the next President is.

America has taken a giant leap backwards economically, racially and foreign policy wise by electing and then reelecting this scourge called Obama.


#4

As someone with some liberal beliefs, I could originally understand the movement back during the Michael Brown situation, and even the Eric Garner case as well. However, I can't help but see the movement as existing for the wrong reasons now. They're seriously overlooking the bigger picture, which is that, yes, ALL lives matter. This movement is continuing the segregation barriers, though unintentionally (unless it's intentional on their part).

Police have just as much a need for a "movement" like this, but imagine if there was one equally as large as BLM. BLM folks would get even more enraged because they'd feel overshadowed by their own movement's "importance." As to whether it's causing more harm than good? I'm starting to believe so. I can't help but think that now, as this continues onward.

Should police officers undergo additional "awareness" training? Maybe so. However, if some kid even so much as pulls out a fake gun in front of a cop, that kid's getting shot. No two ways about it. That's the stupidity of the BLM side of this...much of the more recent instances have been legitimate police reaction to a perceived threat. This has been proven time and time again, even in media investigations of those scenarios.


#5

You can combat them by ostracizing anyone who associates themselves with the movement or makes baseless claims about racism being the primary driver of black deaths in America.


#6

Well, now your response makes mine just look asinine. Great.


#7

All I know is that we are going to see what a real police state looks like if people don't stop killing cops. I assume that's the opposite of what the morons in BLM want.


#8

HAHA. No, not at all man. We're not that far away form each other.


#9

They have become nothing more than the unwashed smellies from Occupy Wall St, which is really sad because their original message has merit. Their movement has been hijacked by trouble-making anarchists who just want to fuck shit up.


#10

I'm not talking about gross generalities. I'm talking about marching with refrains like "What do we want? Dead cops!"

And if police find extensive social media contact with BLM of these arrested cop killers, then what?


#11

I understand the black lives matter , it is the result of some wacky laws surrounds the war on drugs

I think body cameras would take care of the problem along with the video of the incident available at least by court order immediately . And if the Cop did not have it on it would be deemed grounds for firing , being black balled and financially liable

As far as a fight between the Cops and the People , I would not rule the people out , I may even bet on the people


#12

Just a side note: I would characterize those cases in the exactly opposite way. The evidence suggests plainly that Wilson was legally authorized to use lethal force. On the other hand, Garner's treatment was ludicrous and inexplicable.

As for the question above, no, BLM the movement is not responsible for cop-killing. Obviously. Deray M. and the other prominent protesters (along with their thronged masses of acolytes), buffoons and idiots though they are, are not calling for violence. It isn't libertarianism's fault when a nut blows up a federal building, and it isn't BLM's fault when a nut shoots a police officer (or when a couple dozen nuts chant a perversion of that the vast majority of the crowd is chanting).

More generally, BLM is what all these kinds of thing are these days: a group finds a worthy (though still reductive/incomplete) cause, builds a narrative, begins granting the narrative preference over fact and reality, veers into fantasyland and idiocy.

"Reductive" is the operate word in this post. BLM's first flaw, from which all the other ones emanate, is in its ludicrously reductive and misleading assessment of anecdote and data.


#13

"All lives matter" is stupid, too. And stupidly obvious. And an illegitimate criticism. To say that infant mortality rates should be mitigated is not to deny that animal cruelty and teen heroin addiction are also things we should shun.

BLM is (primarily) about interactions between police and black people in America. That is the topic, it's a legitimate one, and it's not anybody's responsibility to widen or narrow the scope of his activism. This is not to say that BLM is above criticism -- it very much isn't. But the criticism should be specific and directly related to the movement's rhetoric. E.g., BLM denies reality when it keens about Michael Brown and lies to itself when it willfully ignores the fact that the violent crime rate among young black men will always have a necessary and direct relationship with the nature of interactions between that demographic and law enforcement.


#14

Agreed. It isn't like this issue just popped up out of nowhere. This is (and has been) an issue for a long, long time in America. From both ends of the police spectrum. (Ie: a dead black person shows up on the streets of Chicago in 1950, it isn't like they were going to look to hard into his death.) Shit look up the death of Sam Cooke https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Cooke shit seems pretty shady, and Ali was right if it were Elvis...)

BLM certainly, and without question has a valid argument, and obviously black lives do matter.

That said I'm not about to start burning police at the stake, or thinking they are all alike either.

I don't know the answer, but I do know I'm not blaming the movement for the actions of irrational individuals.


#15

BTW, I am referring to the mantras "What do we want? Dead cops!" And the new one "Pigs in a blanket". Not just general police brutality protest.

I assume no responsibility still... But people are quick to point to Obummer's culpabity. Did president Obummer intend this to happen? Surely not


#16

BLM seems more interested in being militant, getting air time however they can, and acting more like they want segregation than equality.


#17

Agreed on Michael Brown. It's too sad that everyone overreacted and blamed the police officer, and now that due diligence has been done (specifically the overwhelming DNA evidence that Brown attacked Wilson while Wilson was in his vehicle and that Brown also tried to grab his service weapon), it still doesn't matter what the truth is.


#18

Somewhat similar to blaming me or anyone else more apt to lean right for the people chanting "white power" at a Trump rally.

Neither me, nor Trump, whom I particularly NOT of fan of, and would vote for Hilary over, are to blame for those morons.

Some people just aren't hard wired for survival (or thought). Can't let those represent the whole in your perspective.


#19

Obama clearly sided against the police on several occasions while the matters were under investigation. While he may not be responsible for the murders legally, his actions are another example of his abysmal leadership.


#20

  1. It's no worse now than at any other point in our lifetimes: http://www.nleomf.org/facts/officer-fatalities-data/year.html
  2. Those demanding change will, of course, get what they want...in the same way that Brendan Fraser's wishes were granted in Bedazzled. They will get plenty of oversight-oversight that will further cut down on officers' discretion(and probably result in the firing of those few who say, "Fuck it," and use discretion anyway). They will get plenty of cameras-cameras that bring the federal overseers into their homes every time they call police, and footage that can be used to investigate every inch of their homes.

The folks wanting Andy Griffith will succeed in completely eliminating Andy from police work. In his place, there will be some Barney Fifes, and many more that make citizens long for the days that Barney was as bad as it got.