T Nation

BJ vs KenFlo / Anderson Silva vs Forrest Griffin


My first post so hopefully the link come up correctly.

I just got the email, Kenny Florian vs BJ Penn, UFC 101. August 8.

I know it's early to start the post but I couldn't resist.

I've been waiting for this fight for nearly a year.

Make your call gents, I actually like both fighters. But because of certain school biases (Sidyotong). I'm going to root for Ken Flo.

Anyone else?



I wish I could train at Sidyotong... I'm voting for who ever puts up the best fight. I just want to see a battle!


i dunno...kenny by not being a lazy ass and showing up in shape. say what you want, but if this one stretches past the first couple of rounds, i don't think bj can do it unless he has some kind of renaissance/reevaluation


The gsp fight made me wonder if his training is up to par with other top fighters at this point. He seemed completely unprepared for the strength difference in his last fight. It didnt look like he was any stronger at 170 than he was at 155.


i'm going for kenflo, bj just doesn't got the right mindset, he lacks heart.


when i saw him fight gsp i thought man rough times are coming up for bj. fighting kenny will not be much easier and bj will not come back stronger after that fight.

he does not give gsp credit for his win so he might think his training was great and their were just weired circumstances...

... he should train more but i doubt he will.

Kenny will win


The BJ mystique has been shattered by the GSP fight.

Just like when Roger Bannister broke the 4 minute mile and then all of sudden everyone started breaking it... the same shit is gonna happen to BJ now.

Everyone who fights him will believe that they can beat him and they most likely will.


striking- Kenny is good, but i'll take BJ's boxing ... BJ

clinch- Kenny has good knees, but he will not be able to take BJ down. Kenny's td defense isn't that great so going to give it to BJ

bjj ... BJ

conditioning... Kenny by a long shot. The guy never gasses.

5 round fight definitely helps Kenny's chances, but I just see Penn winning the fight wherever it goes. They are both undersized technique guys, and BJ is more skilled.


This is an interesting one. I really cant wait to see how BJ is in this fight, after the beating he got from GSP. He might come back better than ever or, will he start to have doubts.....

I definitely wouldnt write him off though.

In saying that, I would like to see Florian win. I think it would open up the division nicely.


KenFlo, especially if it goes past round 3. He will come into the fight better prepared, physically and mentally.


Bj did look really bad against GSP.
and Kenny is always improving- but he is no GSP



Oddly when Bj was training for Sherk he had Faber train with him and he wsa sprinting and flipping tires etc... and he came to that fight in the best shape of his career. Then the biggest fight of his career comes and he hires a coach making him do bodybuilding work and running long distance. Thats weird to me


Just to add a little to the discussion.

Normally I would take BJ's striking over KenFlo. Yes, even with him being Sidyotong.

But . . .

Word is BJ suffered a concussion during the GSP match. He doesn't even remember parts of the fight. Once a guy gets rocked like that you know he's susceptible again.

I honestly feel KenFlo will take him in 3.

Love BJ, but he's taken some damage. And that sticks with you


I think this has the makings of a passing of the torch fight.

I've always been a BJ fan, but I think the GSP fight is something you can't erase. I never question a fighter's heart, but I do question his desire for fighting. Kenny has been working his ass off for this moment and I think he has a great chance to take the title.


His striking is one dimensional, yes BJ's boxing is sick, i think the stat was he lands like 67% of his jabs which is unreal but...when has he ever thrown a leg kick?

That's part of why I think KenFlo has a good chance. You know those fighters who keep "evolving" or improving every time we see them? BJ is not one of them.

BJ is static. His strengths (while awesome) are the same he's had for years and his weaknesses (a few) are also the same.

his boxing is sick, his bjj is sick, his take down defense due to flexibility is unreal.
He's not going to throw a leg kick, his take downs are ok, he is going to start gassing by beginning of R3.


SO why do people always ride off one dimensional fighters. Rampage is having success, Aoki, Maia.


I think allot of that is editing -
no one knows what he does or does'nt do
we know he has to train allot to make 155, Its too hard to count bj penn out. hopefully he trains hard, takes kenny seriously and we see a great fight.

I imagine Penn if he gives a shit can take most if not all of the 55 division any way he wants. kind of too many variables from him and his camp for that.


I don't think BJ is one dimensional, he has multiple strengths but it makes it easier to game plan for. I expect a tough/even fight. I don't expect to see the one sided domination we saw at UFC 94


In his stand up he is, but who cares it's effective. In the first GSP fight his ability to avoid kicks and strikes was amazing.


You guys have to realize that BJ has been doing this for awhile. He has always been up and up with the latest and greatest things out there - he and his brothers knew about the de la riva and x-guard before anybody else did here in hawaii, he is constantly working on different aspects of his game... even if you don't think that he is evolving his approach, he is, but it is a little more subtle than a complete revamp of his fighting style where all of a sudden he's going to be doing thai boxing instead of american (though he has studied thai boxin extensively)

It is easy to see him as lazy because he has lacked cardio a few times, but the one aspect of his preparation where he is not (and obsessively so) is in his approach to evolving his techniques.

He doesn't like to utilize leg kicks because he doesn't want to expose himself to easy takedowns. He feels that boxing is the best way for him to set up the rest of his offense (takedowns, etc) and he utilizes that very effectively.

Basically he fights the way he does because he feels that leaves him the least exposed and that there is continuity between his striking and grappling. It is not because he is unfamiliar with the other aspects of the game.

He did have obvious problems with GSP, but Kenny cannot count on the same strength and size advantages that GSP had...BJ will probably be the stronger of the two.

My fear in this fight for BJ is that Florian is a tough fighter, and while BJ will probably start off strong, if he is unable to finish K-flo in the first couple of rounds (which may be hard given Kenny's durability,) Kenny will still be ready to fight in the last three.