T Nation

Bill Roberts prefers Nandrosol?

OK, sorry for the subject heading. I know we all made a point to try and not inundate him with endless waves of questions addressed specifically to him. It just that I noticed that he stated that he now uses Nandrosol instead of Androsol for the class II component. I was wondering why the switch; more results, less side effects…Bill?

While Bill prefers Nandrosol, Brock most
definitely prefers Androsol!!!

Brock

I’ve search the message board for anyone talking about a Fat-Fast diet with Nandrosol but have not found any mention of it. If I may inquire both of your educated minds, how would a Fat-Fast diet with Nandrosol compare to one with Androsol alone or combined? I also was confused if you (Brock) took the Androsol for the entire time on the diet or only the first 2 weeks.

I prefer Nandrosol because, when stacked with TA (the only
way I’ve used it, other than brief early testing) it gave me
more results. While admittedly regains, I actually put on
16-18 lb in 2 weeks, with virtually no or perhaps actually no
fat increase, and I know from previous experience that I
would not have done that well with TA + Dianabol. In
contrast, same type of situation, Androsol performed
definitely less, 12-14 lb, and was about what I would have
expected with Dianabol.

My comparison saying that Androsol at max dosage is
comparable in effect to 50 mg/day Dianabol wasn’t and isn’t
based so much on my results – my results were definitely
not inconsistent with that, and reasonably consistent, but not
enough to prove it – but on results from other people which
were definitely at least equal to that much Dianabol when
used alone, and also cases when looking at stacks.<P

With the Nandrosol though I am completely sure that I got
more results than I would have in the stack with that amount
of Dianabol.

I also am getting much less body acne problems than I ever
have before on a cycle, so I have to conclude that
Nandrosol contributes much less to body acne than does
Androsol Dianabol, or Anadrol. I have no
more than the slight amount on the shoulders
that I usually unfortunately do when “off.”

My one objection to it is that, while I never had any “white
powder” problems with Androsol, it does happen
sometimes with Nandrosol, but only on limited areas, and
then mostly only on bodyhair itself (which doesn’t matter.)
However, since probably 90-95% of the applied area
doesn’t show this, obviously it isn’t affecting results much. I
ought to test to see if rubbing with a towel before spraying
will avoid this. I believe that the body hairs are retaining
crystals of nor-4-AD (unlike when on the skin, the nor-4-AD
has nowhere to go when on the hairs) and this is what is
precipitating (bad pun) this minor problem.

Nandrosol also seems to spray in a tighter pattern, so you
have to move the bottle faster when spraying: this may be
the reason for the “white patch” problem. I could just be
applying somewhat too heavily in a couple of places: it’s
always calves and left side of upper chest that this happens.
Happening the same place does imply user error rather
than a fundamental problem!

Nandrosol also just feels a little better on the skin for some
reason. That’s getting really petty since Androsol has
virtually no feel at all a couple of minutes past application,
but still there is a difference and it’s nice.

The main thing though is the better results and less, much
less, body acne. This could be individual results, but hey,
they’re my individual results so this is what I want to use
personally.

I’m doing a 2 week Fat Fast with Nandrosol (and TA)
right now, after having done 2 weeks at
4000 cal/day and high protein. It’s certainly
been very successful thus far, though I
can’t isolate the component responsible for
the success. I’d expect the diet part would have worked effectively with any reasonable
stack. Strength has stayed up there, no problem. I’ll be interested to see how fast
gains are in the following 2 weeks again
at 4000 cal/day, after the 2 weeks of Fat
Fast.

Thanks for the detailed feedback, you gave more information than I anticipated. I’m glad you addressed the acne issue. Androsol is effective but the acne I get with it is considerable even when using topical treatments. I realize that may be par for course while using prohormones but I’m definitely more anxious to try Nandrosol now because of your comments.

One last note, I know it does'nt neccessarily affect gains, but I find the CNS effects of Androsol positive (as do many who use it, even T-mag staff!), does Nandro provide this same effect?

I can’t answer the CNS question because
of using TA at the same time, and also because
unless I’ve been “off” for some time, at this
point I don’t really notice CNS effects from
anything: my nervous system is used to androgens. When trying Nandrosol alone briefly
during early testing, I hadn’t been “off”
very long so my CNS wasn’t sensitive to
noticing androgens.

I’d said below that I was doing the Fat Fast diet right now. Uh, turns out that I THOUGHT I was, but actually I misremembered Brock’s diet.

What I’m doing is actually only one tablespoon
of flax oil (or rather, Udo’s Choice oil) per
day, only in the morning, and then 1200 calories per day from 3 packets of Grow
mixed with CFM whey. After about a week
I started adding some KCl salt (you can
buy it at the supermarket as “Light Salt”
and NaCl salt (the regular kind) because
this diet was too low in sodium and potassium.

So actually it is not, properly speaking,
a “Fat Fast” diet but is working very well.
It’s higher in protein, higher in carbs,
and lower in fat.

Bill, this isn’t related to this topic, but I was just wondering if you were looking for any new test subjects for the AM only Androsol use. I saw in another post that you said it flamed out with the previous subjects, but I’ll be damned if I could find that post.

(reply to BMJ) The morning-only-then-wash-off-
at-7-PM thing is something I’d like to have
answers on, but I have become disappointed
with salivary testing and don’t plan to use
it anymore. In the initial testing of Androsol
it worked out OK, and though there were a
couple of flaky readings you could spot them
as being “off” because not only were they
nowhere near the reading taking just before
or just after, but also you got a huge jump
in reported estrogen levels too. The reason
for this is that even the tiniest droplet
of blood in the saliva will totally throw
off the results, giving a drastic increase
of many times normal. With our early testing,
we had about 12 samples per subject, and
we were lucky it seems on the blood-in-saliva
issue, so only a couple had to be thrown
out. Since then we’ve been snake-bit, and
basically while it is a measurement method
that can be accurate, it can also foul up.
So I don’t want to use it anymore.

Our future work is going to be done with
blood tests exclusively, and we feel (or
at least I feel) that there are ethical
issues with having blood draws taken from
people out-of-house without there having
been the whole procedure of independent
review board approval of the procedure.
So I don’t see where we can ask readers to participate
in tests requiring blood draws, or accept
their kind offers. We will still hopefully
be getting an answer to this inhibition
question; it’s just taking longer than
expected.

Bill or Brock how does Androsol work in regards to being anticatabolic during calorie restricted diet such as a Fat Fast. Also does Nandrosol have the same abiities to prevent muscle loss as Androsol or it it less effective.

Brock had excellent results using only Androsol during Fat Fast.

I did some extreme dieting for 2 weeks with
excellent results using Nandrosol, but also
used TA, and basically there is no way for
me to isolate out what the effect of the
Nandrosol itself was, or what it would have
done on its own. Maybe someone else can give
a report.