Biggest Mistake a Beginner Can Make

Bigger Stronger Leaner
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[quote]alexus wrote:
I think what you are saying probably applies to bodybuilding more than other things (e.g., like in the soccer case - there are examples of people who basically suck in a sport but go on to coach it really well). Totally hear what you are saying, though, with respect to their experience speaking to their knowledgeability - they certainly aren’t beginners!
[/quote]

This is very true too. I know a fellow who had one of the best deadlifts in the world. To him, it was simple: deadlift heavy every week. Voila! Stronger. Well, that doesn’t really work for most people. However, he had struggled mightly with the bench to get it to a somewhat respectable number. He knows every single thing there is to know about getting the bench up.

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Very rarely will you run across someone who really knows how to get huge who has no muscle on themselves and never did.

Agreed.

Most of the guys like you claim train people who want to “tone”.

Oh no no no! I certainly didn’t mean to advocate that! I surely do know that there are numerous people out there claiming they know how to get people stronger and / or bigger etc and all their stupid certificates and experience don’t mean shit! I totally agree.

Bodybuilding at its core is a lifestyle…so unless the guy teaching it has lived it at some point, beware of their advice in terms of ultimate results.

Yes.

Still not clear. This thread is about beginners coaching other beginners. If your hairstylist isn’t a beginner, what does that have to do with this thread?

Ah… I thought the thread was about beginners coaching other beginners on internet forums. In other words, the utility of having a beginners forum here where beginners often do chime on in with advice. I was thinking of that.

I really do see the sense in wanting to see something in practice before trusting someone. When people go on about what worked for them (e.g., on the bodybuilding forum) I totally see the sense in firstly establishing whether in fact anything has worked for them (whether they actually have results).

I do think that personal results aren’t the be all and end all, though. That was what I wanted to go on to add.

I know a fellow who had one of the best deadlifts in the world. To him, it was simple: deadlift heavy every week. Voila! Stronger. Well, that doesn’t really work for most people. However, he had struggled mightly with the bench to get it to a somewhat respectable number. He knows every single thing there is to know about getting the bench up.

I’m dubious about him knowing ‘every single thing there is to know’ - but yeah, that is what I’m talking about. I’m mostly an Oly Lifter… I’ve found the people who are most helpful for me have long limbs (like me) so need to figure out a whole heap more re technique than those who are shorter limbed and find themselves progressing more naturally.

That is one thing that I find so very wonderful and inspiring about progress pics. Especially when you see a skinny guy who turned into a beast. That is a pretty good thing to be able to show the noobs who have ‘fast metabolisms’ etc…

23

So : beginners on beginners.

I agree with rambodian that there is a world of difference between offerring advice and forwarding an opinion .

I also agree that there have been a lot of threads started by other beginners where they just havn’t done any reading and research and that must be maddening to the more experienced guys. Equally there have been quite e few who clearly have read lots of stuff and got completely bogged down in different and somewhat esoteric ideas and just need a bit of steering back to the basics.

Personally i try to be careful when posting to say that 1. i am a beginner (but may have some very relevant specialist knowledge) 2. That if it is something that i am actually doing and what the xperience of doing that actually is (as a beginner). 3 And crucially to encourage other beginners.

There is another aspect here which is my ha’penny’ worth, as a beginner you know what it is like to have the perspective of a beginner, ie it’s all new, all strange and some of the very advanced people will have lost that perspective years ago .

A couple of times i have asked a question and got very good replies from some of the site editors (Chris Shugart , TC Luoma and Chris Thibs come to mind) who have been great but have also added a major ‘filter’ ie that a lot of what the very senior/experienced people are talking about is in a very specialist league and isn’t that relevant to a beginner.

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Point is, people don’t get big by accident…steroids or not. Although, if on drugs I’d expect them to look the part, not like some average lifter.

There’s some moronic culture around gyms these days to not ask the biggest guy in the gym, as if they just woke up big one day.

Only an inexperienced fool believes that “paper-work” is more important than anything else. What looks good in a book/scientific literature doesn’t always pan out in the real world

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Receiving information from one source should be a vehicle to provoke thought and guide one to seek further information on the matter, with the goal to form an educated opinion.

Some people get this, some don’t. As a beginner your judgement, I guess, gets clouded with a desire to be higher up on the food chain than you actually are. So beginners will tend to give advice on matters they really don’t know a hell of a lot about with the hope that they ‘fit in’ with the upper echelon.

I mean yeah, some guys are big and stupid as shit. However seeing a guy that has gotten big, and looks in good shape, will most likely mean they know wtf they are talking about 99% of the time because they have been in the trenches.

It is sort of like coming out of university … you think you know enough to succeed but when they place you in that seat you quickly realise that you really don’t know shit until you get your feet wet.

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I think the best thing to do is consider oneself a beginner forever. Avoid getting caught up in comparisons to others, and letting the ego take over.

I’ve been training since 2007, I still read everything I can get my hands on.

Also, as others have alluded to, nothing beats trial and error for learning. Reading / other peoples’ ideas only gives some context.

27

[quote]its_just_me wrote:

There’s some moronic culture around gyms these days to not ask the biggest guy in the gym, as if they just woke up big one day.
[/quote]

Oh, it’s all over this site too. I can’t even count the number of times people have acted like some big guy was born that way so his advice doesn’t mean anything.

I don’t know very many people who are truly huge who got that way by accident.

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[quote]esskay wrote:
“The biggest mistake a beginner can make is taking advice from other beginners online”
-Jim Wendler

What do you guys think?[/quote]

No brainer!

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[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]johnnytang24 wrote:

No one is claiming success means a person knows what they are talking about. But not even trying guarantees they DON’T know.[/quote]

Bingo.

You have a much better chance learning something going up to the people in the gym who got huge than running up to everyone who looks like a newb.

Anyone denying this isn’t living in reality.[/quote]

Yeah this helped me a lot, there are quite a few large guys in my gym that have helped me get in the right mindset over time, a few in particular. What they told me would be the best things are also echoed by the biggest guys on here, go figure.

I think beginners a lot of time read articles that do not apply to them and get so overwhelmed and lost in minuta and cripples their progress. I think that was a huge mistake I made as a beginner, worrying about supplements and timing of them rather then getting in adequate food or learning how to figure out how much i should be eating in order to get bigger without becoming a fat slob

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I do think listening to bad advice has sent a lot of beginners in the wrong direction, but by far the biggest beginner mistake is lack of consistency… and a close second would be lack of intensity/attitude of competing with oneself and conquering and progressing measurably.

Without consistency you have nothing as far as bodybuilding is concerned. You will see no results even if you know the perfect program for you, and the best foods to eat, even if you have a super intense attitude when you are in the gym… if you are skipping workouts or skipping meals you will utterly lose to the guy with the mediocre program and fast food+protein shakes diet who never misses his protein count or calories, and never misses a single workout for 6 months straight.

I’ve said this before but it bears repeating: consistency is the only thing that works 100% of the time for 100% of people.

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Listening to worried parents, i have been training for about 8 months my bench press max is at 275 my dad told me the other day stop there or i would “injure myself”. He also told me that smith machines “force you into the correct posture”.

Now i know with the bench press I could injure my shoulders if all i ever do is press but i have been doing weighted pullups and rows along with deads and sqauts soooooo i think im pretty balanced. And the smith machine comment was complete crap…idk some of my other freinds have heard comments like this. Its like when your parents hear that your lifting anything over 200 they think your going to get injured automatically.

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[quote]Professor X wrote:
That is why we keep asking for pictures of all of these members handing out advice. It helps to see where the advice is coming from.[/quote]
A long while back, in a similar thread about visible accountability of those offering advice, I suggested a thread be started encouraging everyone to post a recent/within 72 hours pic (or video for those with non-physique goals). There were no takers.

I definitely agree that the more member photos/videos there are, the quicker the overall quality of the site can improve.

As to beginners advising beginners, I’ll agree that there’s a difference between stating an opinion and offering advice. There’s also a difference between speaking entirely out of one’s ass and a newb repeating or recommending a qualified coach’s advice (preferably while crediting the coach).

But it’s a blurry line and, as I spend most of my time in the Beginners forum, I’ve seen plenty of legit newbs speaking as though they’ve had success working with dozens of personal training clients. That’s what leads to confusion.

33

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]its_just_me wrote:

There’s some moronic culture around gyms these days to not ask the biggest guy in the gym, as if they just woke up big one day.
[/quote]

Oh, it’s all over this site too. I can’t even count the number of times people have acted like some big guy was born that way so his advice doesn’t mean anything.

I don’t know very many people who are truly huge who got that way by accident.[/quote]

not sure if I really have a point here… but the gym I go to (LA Fitness Wayne NJ) has a reputation for some of the big guys using steroids. couple that with the lack of heavy true ATC squatting and proper deadlifting here and I’m not sure how good the advice would be.

granted, 40mg of D-Bol a day doesn’t make you big by itself but then I’m not really sure who’s juicing and whose advice is good in the first place. so I get my advice from here because at least there is some consensus on whose advice is good and whose isn’t.

for instance one of the gym staff is this huge black guy who I’ve seen pulling 4 plates a side for reps… but he was jackhammering them. otoh the other day I saw a younger guy probably early 20’s built like a beer keg, also pulled 4 plates a side for 3 or 4 reps but he re-set after every rep.

so in this case is the first guy’s advice valid because he’s bigger (could be genetics) or the second guy because his form seems better?

that aside, thanks to mr. popular and everyone else who has given me good advice and showed me that reading all the articles in the world does not mean you know anything.

34

[quote]fr0IVIan wrote:
not sure if I really have a point here… but the gym I go to (LA Fitness Wayne NJ) has a reputation for some of the big guys using steroids. couple that with the lack of heavy true ATC squatting and proper deadlifting here and I’m not sure how good the advice would be.[/quote]
What?

Donnie Thompson doesn’t squat “ATC”, Dorian Yates used steroids. Clearly none of them know a thing about lifting weights. Ask the 160 pound natty instead. At least he squats ATG RRRRAAAAAWWWW!!!

[quote]
for instance one of the gym staff is this huge black guy who I’ve seen pulling 4 plates a side for reps… but he was jackhammering them. otoh the other day I saw a younger guy probably early 20’s built like a beer keg, also pulled 4 plates a side for 3 or 4 reps but he re-set after every rep.

so in this case is the first guy’s advice valid because he’s bigger (could be genetics) or the second guy because his form seems better? [/quote]
So just because he uses questionable form he doesn’t know shit about lifting weights? There’s nothing you could learn from him?

“Absorb what is useful, reject what is not.” As simple as that.

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[quote]fr0IVIan wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]its_just_me wrote:

There’s some moronic culture around gyms these days to not ask the biggest guy in the gym, as if they just woke up big one day.
[/quote]

Oh, it’s all over this site too. I can’t even count the number of times people have acted like some big guy was born that way so his advice doesn’t mean anything.

I don’t know very many people who are truly huge who got that way by accident.[/quote]

not sure if I really have a point here… but the gym I go to (LA Fitness Wayne NJ) has a reputation for some of the big guys using steroids. couple that with the lack of heavy true ATC squatting and proper deadlifting here and I’m not sure how good the advice would be.

granted, 40mg of D-Bol a day doesn’t make you big by itself but then I’m not really sure who’s juicing and whose advice is good in the first place. so I get my advice from here because at least there is some consensus on whose advice is good and whose isn’t.

for instance one of the gym staff is this huge black guy who I’ve seen pulling 4 plates a side for reps… but he was jackhammering them. otoh the other day I saw a younger guy probably early 20’s built like a beer keg, also pulled 4 plates a side for 3 or 4 reps but he re-set after every rep.

so in this case is the first guy’s advice valid because he’s bigger (could be genetics) or the second guy because his form seems better?

that aside, thanks to mr. popular and everyone else who has given me good advice and showed me that reading all the articles in the world does not mean you know anything. [/quote]

Why would someone using steroids devalue the advice?

Progress is progress…and there are tons of people on steroids who look like newbs and won’t ever look much better. That means steroids don’t equal “gigantic muscles”. The work, genetics and food has to be there no matter what.

Steroids change the rate of anabolism, they don’t change the game so much that the basic rules no longer apply.

36

alright, i just wasn’t sure if their advice would be valid.

point is for a typical newb i/we do not have very good bs/usefulness filters. so huge black guy who jackhammers his deadlifts might just say “nah bro fuck form i just keep my back tight and fucking pull ya know”… and that’s how i pulled my back a month ago, jackhammering deadlifts and didn’t keep my chest out on the last few.

37

haha and I would never ask a “160 pound natty” for advice unless he was clearly putting up a ridiculous amount of weight

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Biggest newbie tragedies:

  1. Not listening to a guy because you assumed he takes steroids

  2. Thinking that advice from every person becomes invalid when steroids are involved

  3. Thinking that every big guy must be on steroids, so follow step 1

  4. Seeing someone doing one of those “nasty” bodybuilding splits(!) thus they must be on steroids, so follow step 1 (as advised by people like Chad Waterbury and every article writer talking about natty training)

:slight_smile:

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[quote]Professor X wrote:
…and there are tons of people on steroids who look like newbs and won’t ever look much better. That means steroids don’t equal “gigantic muscles”. The work, genetics and food has to be there no matter what.

Steroids change the rate of anabolism, they don’t change the game so much that the basic rules no longer apply.[/quote]

I was pretty naive about steroid usage until I started training at public gyms (trained at home mostly)…and it wasn’t the usage that amazed me, it’s the fact that so many didn’t even look above average lol

40

[quote]Painsama wrote:
Listening to worried parents, i have been training for about 8 months my bench press max is at 275 my dad told me the other day stop there or i would “injure myself”. He also told me that smith machines “force you into the correct posture”.

Now i know with the bench press I could injure my shoulders if all i ever do is press but i have been doing weighted pullups and rows along with deads and sqauts soooooo i think im pretty balanced. And the smith machine comment was complete crap…idk some of my other freinds have heard comments like this. Its like when your parents hear that your lifting anything over 200 they think your going to get injured automatically.[/quote]

My parents were the same for a bit. Until I just started ignoring their advice. Some day you have to man up and think for yourself. But first you need to develop some life experience. Parents will always ‘know’ what is best for you even if they really don’t. I showed a vid to mine where I’m deadlifting 517 for a single. Instead of saying something encouraging, they state … “that’s not good for your back!” like they actually think they know something.

What I am basically getting at is to think for yourself, make mistakes and learn from them. Yes, you will get injured from time to time, but shit it will teach you not to get injured next time around. These days I get injured a lot less than I did 3 - 5 years ago despite using a lot more weight.

Listening to parents who aren’t passionate about lifting is like going to an accountant for legal advice. Makes little sense.