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Big Routine Dip/Pull-Up Variation Question

Dr. Darden.
I’ve been rereading the new bodybuilding old school results. Excellent book btw. I was examining the big routine and noticed that you had dip/pull-up negative dip/ negative pull-up back to back. Got me thinking. What would you say the advantages or disadvantages to the following scenarios.

  1. Skipping the full range and just doing Negative dip and negative pull-up presumably with more resistance

  2. Doing the dip to failure followed by negative dip to failure and same with pull-up.

  3. Alternating them as listed on the routine.

You’ve listed other ways to do similar exercises. I see no problem with what you are suggesting.

Would one be more effective than the other for putting on size. Or should I just periodically vary between them?

Your #1 listing would be the best size builder.

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I just finished today’s workout with both negative only dips and chins (the 60 second application of it) , and both mentally and physically it is a true test for anybody

I’ve been doing the 30-10-30 but can’t do that for chins. For chins I’ll do negative only but only can do them currently for ~ 70 seconds total doing about 8 reps. Mark - when you state you did 60 seconds - did you do one slow 60 seconds or was that multiple negative reps.
I’ve tried only negatives before but seemed to only slide backwards. Maybe too much for me but I believe using repetitions and doing more of the full movement is better than just one slow movement.
I like the idea of the 30-10-30 due to the fact you do also get in the 10 positives also…
Regards-

It is just one slow 60 second negative.
I tried them before as the second exercise in a pre exhaust cycle, but doing them “immediately” after another movement (done 30-10-30) i found very tough mentally as well as physically .
So I am currently doing them along with dips at the end of the workout after curls and pressdowns (It goes in this order … pressdowns, curls , dip, chin) . This allows me to add extra weight and also apply complete focus instead of breathing like a steam train and trying to fight lactic build up whilst controlling a 60 second negative.

You’re one STRONG guy Mark. If you can do (pressdowns (30-10-30), curls (30-10-30), Neg Dip, Neg Chin - that’s an amazing amount of fatigue, work, and TUL. That negative chin would be about 2 seconds for me…

Thank you & great job!
Ron

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Thanks Ron,
but if you look at the order. I perform the pressdowns and curls first, followed by the dip and chin , with appropriate rest periods in between them.
So the triceps and biceps are fatigued. But nowhere near as much if did them with pre- exhaust.
If I was do them pre -exhaust then I would probably change the protocols to 20-10-20 for extensions/curls and do 45 second dips/chins to make the TUL more manageable and productive for me.

Mark

Understood Mark. When I take an exercise to complete failure on that last 30 second negative - I am done! Even with a breather (working an opposing muscle) I would drop like a rock!
I don’t know if everyone is like this but I typically can’t get half the reps if I were to do a second set (even with an apposing muscle worked in-between - ex: DB bench/DB Row). Full positive failure usually gets me to 1/2 the reps if I were to do another set with the same weight. The 30-10-30 - haven’t tried but assume 20% of the reps…
thank you!