T Nation

Big Challenge (I Think) for the Group

oh

my

god

[quote]Stronghold wrote:
speakman wrote:
As mentioned before, we’ll be adding Arimadex this time… Still waiting for the group to give me a little feedback on Arimadex. Not much on the forums that I’ve found so far…

:)[/quote]

Stronghold! Long time no type… LOL

Just read through the whole thread… Thanks! For some reason, I didn’t come across that when I searched for Arimadex on the site. Looks like this is a decent choice for keeping the estrogen at bay.

Why isn’t Finasteride mentioned in the list? That’s what my doctor tried with me a couple of years ago (I was on T cream, which never worked anywhere near as well as the shots). That was the last time I was on an estrogen inhibitor. I only used the Finasteride for a few weeks, as it turned me into a paranoid psycho. (Hope Adex doesn’t do this!!!)

Just found this thread on Finasteride: http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/finasteride_and_gains

Could this be true of Adex, too? Last thing I need to do is inhibit my gains!

[quote]ZeusNathan wrote:
oh

my

god

[/quote]

Haven’t heard from you in awhile either, ZeusNathan! Typically helpful comment… LOL

This thread is epic. I approve. HAHAHAHA ~ I actually was skimming and after the stronghold vs zeusnathan war I went back to skimming.

Things I noticed ~ an absence of pictures - overtime. Also caliper tests to go with those pictures.

Really good stuff either way I think the fact you look better and are plenty stronger is the most important thing. It means you are further then you were before and what lies ahead is new territory!

[quote]kinein wrote:
This thread is epic. I approve. HAHAHAHA ~ I actually was skimming and after the stronghold vs zeusnathan war I went back to skimming.

Things I noticed ~ an absence of pictures - overtime. Also caliper tests to go with those pictures.

Really good stuff either way I think the fact you look better and are plenty stronger is the most important thing. It means you are further then you were before and what lies ahead is new territory!
[/quote]

Thanks for the encouraging words! And glad you like what by now must be one of the longer threads on T-Nation, and all about just one guy’s struggle to “get a clue” about this bodybuilding thing… LOL… Seriously, by the time this gets to some kind of conclusion, I hope to be living proof that NO ONE has an excuse not to be in really, really good shape!

As for posting some update pics, very good point, and I think you’re the first one to ask (if I remember correctly). In a way, I’ve been dreading this, since I’m worried that everyone will see what I look like now and say, “What the heck have you been doing for the last year!!!” LOL… Maybe I’m just being paranoid. Either way, I need to take my medicine and expose myself to the feedback of the group…

So, sure, I’ll plan to post an update photo soon…

What is the worst that could happen? I bet your arms won’t detach from your shoulders. Motivation can come through many ways including having some e-tard throw stix and stones at you.

My only tidbits to toss into the pot are ~ mind muscle control + insane contractions + making each rep worth its weight in gold + focus + determination and ~ as you progress you seek to find your limits and break them. Then redefine your goals and limits and break them again ~ all followed by good old fashion eating and burpin.

some inspiration and thought ~

Stay strong!

lol speakman

so you gave up on the starting strength and started taking steroids?

oh speakman. oh, friggin, speakman.

i wish you’d update with progress, not these empty promises of your success.

3 x 12 is still there for you. always will be.
haha :smiley:

[quote]ZeusNathan wrote:
lol speakman

so you gave up on the starting strength and started taking steroids?

oh speakman. oh, friggin, speakman.

i wish you’d update with progress, not these empty promises of your success.

3 x 12 is still there for you. always will be.
haha :smiley: [/quote]

Hey, if all else fails, juice up!!!

If you want a serious answer, read back through the thread to see why I’m getting Testosterone shots. If you still don’t understand, you need to study up on hormone therapy for guys with low natural T levels… Could help you with your own clients if you ever get any who are over 40 and happen to be stalling for no apparent reason…

As for my program, I’m past the Starting Strength thing. That program’s exercises still make up the core of my routine, but lately I’ve been alternating between high-weight, low-rep sets and lower-weight, high-rep sets. So, in the course of a week, I’m actually doing some 3 x 12’s… But doesn’t make a difference if I have the T levels of a nine-year-old girl… Go figure…

Good point about my progress. I’ll post my chart today or tomorrow…

I promised to post a chart of my recent progress, so here it is…

Notice the two weeks with all blanks – I had that crappy flu that’s been floating around, and at my age it just doesn’t seem possible to recover from something like that without just strict bed rest. So, no lifting during those two weeks, which was the longest I’ve gone without hitting the gym in years.

That was hard! Not to mention this was also during my break from the Testosterone shots, so let’s just say that when I finally did hit the gym, it was a bit sad…

In any event, back at the gym full-time, back on the HRT, and having a great time… But am I making progress? I don’t know, how do my numbers look to everybody?

I’ll also plan to post a photo or two soon, as promised… That may be the real test of whether the last year has been a waste of time or not…

whatever program you are on, it has my vote for the worst program ever.

your numbers suck my balls

47 weeks… and your deads are at 135lbs…
AND you are taking test.

wtf r u doing

this is what u get for listening to stronghold

[quote]ZeusNathan wrote:
whatever program you are on, it has my vote for the worst program ever.

your numbers suck my balls

47 weeks… and your deads are at 135lbs…
AND you are taking test.

wtf r u doing

this is what u get for listening to stronghold[/quote]

Stronghold essentially just told me to listen to Mark Rippetoe, which a lot of other people told me to listen to, too. In fact, many thousands of people seem to listen to, and trust, Rippetoe. So, if there is a problem, maybe it’s with me, not the program. Maybe I’m just not super genetically-gifted when it comes to bodybuilding (let me end the suspense: I’m not!!!). Go back and read my very first post in this thread for a reminder of my various frustrations…

That said, I’m still a lot stronger and in better shape now than I was; in fact, better than ever in my whole life. Still one of the smaller and weaker guys in the gym (if not the smallest and weakest) among those who lift on a regular basis. Does seem crazy now that I’m on test regularly; also on HGH for the last month or so; and getting close to 3,000 calories a day now…

On the other hand, I’m now doing five sets of each exercise instead of just three (just started this a month or so ago). And now my deadlift is up to 165. So, I’ll just keep going…

You still seem hesitant to offer any real advice or any semblance of a program. All you’ve ever done is preach that 3 x 12 is the holy grail of weightlifting. Is that the whole program? Nothing else to it?

I also haven’t received any new lifting advice from anyone else lately, which is fine. But if anyone would like to suggest a new program at this point (or to just recommend that I stick with what I’m doing), I’m all ears… I hope everyone has at least noticed that I haven’t quit, not by a long shot!!!

[quote]ZeusNathan wrote:
whatever program you are on, it has my vote for the worst program ever.

your numbers suck my balls

47 weeks… and your deads are at 135lbs…
AND you are taking test.

wtf r u doing

this is what u get for listening to stronghold[/quote]

I agree with the number sucks balls. But I think Stronghold gave him some pretty solid advice.

The problem is not genetics, or hormones, or diet, or improper training. You’ve done everything to get those in the right direction and we can see that. What I think is the problem is the level of intensity you’re putting into, well everything. Even the guy, with the worst of genetics, if they went balls to the walls, every session would make more significant gains.

You have to be honest with yourself. Are you giving it 100% in every factor to attain your goal? Are you focused on specific goals, or are you in some hazy zone where your goals are broadly defined? Are you laying it on the line every workout, or are you just going through the motions? Are you striving to be great, or are you settling for mediocre?

I might be wrong, but reading through your log, it seems you have everything lined up for success, you’re just missing the final, and most important, piece of the puzzle: Passion, a burning desire to succeed.

I don’t know man, I just don’t buy into that table at the beginning of the page, seems really improbable.

[quote]ZeusNathan wrote:
whatever program you are on, it has my vote for the worst program ever.

your numbers suck my balls

47 weeks… and your deads are at 135lbs…
AND you are taking test.

wtf r u doing

this is what u get for listening to stronghold[/quote]

Who are you again?

You are on Test and HGH and you dead 140? I’m speechless.

For those of you who either don’t read or have trouble comprehending what you do read, he is on replacement test (for only a few months) and has only been on replacement hgh for the past month.

GH has a cumulative effect that requires longer term usage, even at the higher levels that bodybuilders use.

He is on TRT, that means he is probably get getting around 100mg of test a week, MAYBE 200mg if he is sweet talking his nurse.

This guy isn’t running bodybuilder style cycles, hes on therapeutic dosages.

Another thing to remember, these maxes are most likely his working weights for the program he is doing so what he does for 5 reps this week is not truly representative of what he can do for an actual max set of 5.

I’m not there to see him train, but the advice that he has been given works extremely well when the proper effort and nutrition are applied in tandem.

Speakman, I high recommend Jim Wendler’s 5/3/1 e book. That program has been getting rave reviews lately and has a planned system of progression that I’m sure would benefit you.

First of all: Stronghold, great to see a post from you! Kind of bummed it took a typically thoughtful comment from ZeusNathan to bring you out of the woodwork… LOL… In any event, how have you been? Would love some feedback from you at this point…

As for the other comments, thanks for the feedback, guys! You’ve helped to confirm my nagging suspicion that after all this time and effort (and hormone replacement therapy), my results really kind of suck.

Regarding the deads, I guess I should mention that I seriously pulled a lower back muscle doing deads a few months ago, which had me laid up for a week. And I took a month off from deads. I’m making progress on them again (going for 175 tomorrow), but last week I ALMOST pulled the same back muscle again. Kind of scary…

Invictica, this gets me to your point… I don’t think I can reasonably deny what you’re saying. Of course, I FEEL like I’m working out intensely: I always seem to go to “failure” on every exercise (maybe even every set); short of sickness or injury, I never miss a workout; and by the end of every workout I’m panting and sweating like I just ran a marathon. That said, I am 41 years old, have had enough little injuries to make me at least subconsciously cautious while I’m lifting, and have also had two major inguinal hernia operations (one at 17 years old, the other just a few years ago). So, maybe I haven’t been giving it 100% in the gym…

Also, I should mention that my doctor put me on 200mg test late last year, then had me get off it for six weeks early this year (because we suspected gynomastia might be kicking in). Just about five weeks ago, he put me back on the test, this time at 300mg; and also on Arimadex to avoid the breakdown to estrogen and all the nastiness that goes with that. Five weeks ago is also when I started the HGH, and he started me at VERY low dosages.

I would say it’s only been in about the last two weeks that I’ve really been “feeling” the testosterone (which really probably just has me at “normal” levels for someone maybe 25 years old) and the HGH (which is finally up to a decent dosage, I think). Along with this, I’ve now stepped up my workout to include at least 5 sets of each exercise (as opposed to just 3, what I was doing before). And, again, my deadlift is up about 40 pounds in just a month or so…

So, maybe I’m limping in the right direction now… I don’t know… Any thoughts or comments on these latest revelations?

[quote]Stronghold wrote:
For those of you who either don’t read or have trouble comprehending what you do read, he is on replacement test (for only a few months) and has only been on replacement hgh for the past month.

GH has a cumulative effect that requires longer term usage, even at the higher levels that bodybuilders use.

He is on TRT, that means he is probably get getting around 100mg of test a week, MAYBE 200mg if he is sweet talking his nurse.

This guy isn’t running bodybuilder style cycles, hes on therapeutic dosages.

Another thing to remember, these maxes are most likely his working weights for the program he is doing so what he does for 5 reps this week is not truly representative of what he can do for an actual max set of 5.

I’m not there to see him train, but the advice that he has been given works extremely well when the proper effort and nutrition are applied in tandem.

Speakman, I high recommend Jim Wendler’s 5/3/1 e book. That program has been getting rave reviews lately and has a planned system of progression that I’m sure would benefit you.[/quote]

Oops! I sent my last post before I saw this one… There’s the feedback I was hoping for from Stronghold!! LOL… Reading through this now…

[quote]Stronghold wrote:
For those of you who either don’t read or have trouble comprehending what you do read, he is on replacement test (for only a few months) and has only been on replacement hgh for the past month.[/quote]

Thanks for sticking up for me!! LOL… Seriously, I thought no one was paying attention…

According to the head nurse at my doctor’s office, it usually takes about one year to even begin to see an effect from HGH, at least at my age and at the “normal” dosages. However, my doctor seems to be trying something somewhat “experimental” with me. I didn’t press for the precise details, but the plan only has me on HGH for two months, beginning with extremely low dosages, and, presumably working up to much higher dosages. Again, just beginning to maybe see some effects from the higher dosages I’m now getting (about half way through whatever we’re doing)…

My starting T was so low that my doctor started me off at 200mg. But good guess: I flirted the cute young nurse (hey, I may be weak, but I’ve still “got it”… LOL) into increasing me to 300mg a few weeks before the doctor had me take a break. And after looking at my blood test results, he’s now put me on 300mg himself. I kind of hinted at the nurse to add a little on top of this, but not pushing for this just yet…

This I’m not too sure about. At least on some of my exercises (the bench press and the military press in particular), I swear I wouldn’t be able to lift any more weight than I’m showing on my chart. I know, because every workout I try. So, on some stuff (like deads and squats) I’m making progress at the moment, but on other things I still seem to be kind of stalled…

That said, my strength has undeniably gone substantially up on everything from where I was last year… So, maybe from the strength of a nine-year-old girl to that of a seventeen-year-old girl… LOL

When I Google this, all I seem to be able to find is reviews and discussions about the e-book, not the book itself. Where can I actually purchase the e-book?

The 3 days a week e-book is great and has several good programs in it, including 5/3/1:
http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=370&pid=2795

or, if you just want info on the 5/3/1 program itself:
http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&pid=2976