T Nation

Big Bench = Bad Shoulders

Who really cares how much you bench? For all the macho bodybuilders out there that think that pressing a lot of weight from a flat bench is the be-all and end-all of manhood, think again.

Paul Chek states that “because the bench press is performed on a flat weight lifting bench, normal movement of the shoulder blades (scapulae) is disrupted. This demands that more movement must occur in the shoulder joint itself”

And just how much functional carryover will it have to your real-life anyhow? Just how much pectoralis involment is there in typing on a keyboard or pushing a pencil?

And if you’re one of the knuckleheads on this site that’d rather trade pain free shoulders for a nice set of pecs, try pressing whilst lying on a swiss-ball. (see attached image) Your shoulders will thank you for it.

I honestly believe that you are a great big troll that only comes here to stir up trouble with posts like that.

I have no problem with you doing that, I just hate that you claim to be from Australia, and that makes all us Aussies look bad.

Keep up the troll posts as they give me something to laugh at, but can you please change your country. Thanks.

[quote]CHEKonIT wrote:
Who really cares how much you bench?
[/quote]
NFL Draft Combine, Power lifting comps, and the fact that just about every pro team uses it as a test and has done for 20 odd years.

Even if some people do see it as outdated, it is still a means of testing yourself against the rest.

I will leave this one to the hordes of T-Nationl faithful that will school you on ‘Functional’ training.

[quote]
And if you’re one of the knuckleheads on this site that’d rather trade pain free shoulders for a nice set of pecs, try pressing whilst lying on a swiss-ball. (see attached image) Your shoulders will thank you for it. [/quote]

Okay, way to rip the parts out of Cheks article. You forgot this from Strength and Conditionings greatest marketer.

"When I go to a party and meet people, you can be as sure as the presence of beer that someone will ask, “What can you bench?” It is always great fun to see their reaction when I tell them “Not much, but I can run 30 meters flat out with Malu Mainu?u on my back!” (CHEK, 2000)

[quote]helga wrote:
I honestly believe that you are a great big troll that only comes here to stir up trouble with posts like that.

I have no problem with you doing that, I just hate that you claim to be from Australia, and that makes all us Aussies look bad.
[/quote]

I am sorry to say that Paul Chek has infected the strength and conditioning world with stupidity. As long as there is a trainer who can’t bench press 2 wet socks and has a lack of size to match, Paul Chek will have a disciple.

Even here in Australia Helga I hear skinny bastards talking about Chek and functional training.

Have a look at his site. It is filled with useless crap like this article.

[quote]helga wrote:
I have no problem with you doing that, I just hate that you claim to be from Australia, and that makes all us Aussies look bad.
[/quote]

Aussies look bad already without troll status.

This guy actually made you convicts look somewhat intelligent (smart).

I hate you.

[quote]helga wrote:
I honestly believe that you are a great big troll that only comes here to stir up trouble with posts like that.

I have no problem with you doing that, I just hate that you claim to be from Australia, and that makes all us Aussies look bad.

Keep up the troll posts as they give me something to laugh at, but can you please change your country. Thanks.[/quote]

I am Australian and would not claim to be from anywhere else.

Just because the thread challenges popular thought, does not mean that it’s here only to stir up trouble.

Bottom line = Add something worthwhile, or keep your mouth shut.

[quote]G.O.A.T wrote:
NFL Draft Combine, Power lifting comps, and the fact that just about every pro team uses it as a test and has done for 20 odd years.

So what? Just because it’s popular doesn’t mean that it’s the best thing to do. If you prefer to be a lemming, that’s your choice

Even if some people do see it as outdated, it is still a means of testing yourself against the rest.

Sure, fair point, though it definitely shouldn’t carry the importance that some place upon it.

[/quote]

[quote]G.O.A.T wrote:

Have a look at his site. It is filled with useless crap like this article.

[/quote]

Just because you don’t understand it, doesn’t make it crap.

[quote]De sleeplijn wrote:
helga wrote:
I have no problem with you doing that, I just hate that you claim to be from Australia, and that makes all us Aussies look bad.

Aussies look bad already without troll status.

This guy actually made you convicts look somewhat intelligent (smart).[/quote]

Hey dickhead, learn to find Australia on the map before you start bagging it.

[quote]De sleeplijn wrote:
helga wrote:
I have no problem with you doing that, I just hate that you claim to be from Australia, and that makes all us Aussies look bad.

Aussies look bad already without troll status.

This guy actually made you convicts look somewhat intelligent (smart).[/quote]

That was a good call, but for it to have been perfect you really needed to make a dingo reference…narf

I can’t decide if this guy actually has some sort of disagreement with Australia or if he was attempting to be witty? Care to elaborate on your dislike of the down under?

okay so how is benching on a swiss ball still not using your joint? you can get full range of motion on a flat bench with a proper form. and as for functional strength pencil pushers dont need any, so why are they lifitng at all? all you need to dois be able to walk,sit in a chair and move your hands sligtly so why are they doing any weight lifting? its all non functional! bicep curling? why they dont use that in every day life, triceps, shoulders,chest,back all not used so… your point is kind of moot dont ya think?
and the only good part of aussie land is your hot women and maslin beach

Adding the SWIS ball provides many benefits, I am sure. However, as all things, it has its limitations.

I’ve never DB benched from a swiss ball. From the people that have tried this, how effective is it?

[quote]CHEKonIT wrote:

Hey dickhead, learn to find Australia on the map before you start bagging it.

[/quote]

You make me laugh. So, if I am reading this correctly, I can ‘bag’ on anything that I can find on a map? Can it be a tea bag? Can you be on my map?

[quote]Mwschwab wrote:
CHEKonIT wrote:

Hey dickhead, learn to find Australia on the map before you start bagging it.

You make me laugh. So, if I am reading this correctly, I can ‘bag’ on anything that I can find on a map? Can it be a tea bag? Can you be on my map?
[/quote]

How about a DOUCHEBAG? =P

Oh no! You’re right! One trainer said it’s bad for my shoulders so I think I’d better stop doing it before my shoulders explode and I grow a vagina on my forehead!!!

On a more serious note, if you are worried about shoulder health whilst benching or do feel shoulder pain whilst benching, then read Eric Cressey’s article on how to bench without killing your shoulders:

Shoulder Savers Part I:
http://www.T-Nation.com/findArticle.do;jsessionid=DD414F15BA7573188883B4E6039F8FA3.hydra?article=06-074-training

Please ignore the rubbish posted by the OP.

[quote]CHEKonIT wrote:
I am Australian and would not claim to be from anywhere else.

Just because the thread challenges popular thought, does not mean that it’s here only to stir up trouble.

Bottom line = Add something worthwhile, or keep your mouth shut.
[/quote]

Edit: I did write some other stuff, but I promised myself that I was not going to get into any of these internet pissing matches so I have edited this post to remove my previous comments.

Apologies from a convict!

[quote]CHEKonIT wrote:
Who really cares how much you bench?

Not me though if i lift a heavier weight it means i’m stronger which is a goal of mine - but powerlifters and guys in the NFL do care i would think.

For all the macho bodybuilders out there that think that pressing a lot of weight from a flat bench is the be-all and end-all of manhood, think again.

I don’t believe anyone really thinks that. In some societys killing a lion is a test of manhood - bench pressing - not so much.

Paul Chek states that “because the bench press is performed on a flat weight lifting bench, normal movement of the shoulder blades (scapulae) is disrupted. This demands that more movement must occur in the shoulder joint itself”

Ok - if thats what happens when we bench press thats fine - just be sensible when training. If its contra-indicated for an individual don’t do it or else strengthen rotator cuff etc in order to make it a safe movement if you have problems with it.

And just how much functional carryover will it have to your real-life anyhow?

“functionally” it’ll help me ?press things?, give me stronger pecs,delts and triceps?

Just how much pectoralis involment is there in typing on a keyboard or pushing a pencil?

Errr not much?

And if you’re one of the knuckleheads on this site that’d rather trade pain free shoulders for a nice set of pecs,

I would’nt - i had really sore shoulders then i stopped stretching them and now they’re great - i can bench press pain free now that they’ve tightened up.

try pressing whilst lying on a swiss-ball. (see attached image) Your shoulders will thank you for it.

no thanks - that sounds dangerous with any appreciable weight - if you want to train your balance go wrestle or partake in a sport which
requires lots of different movement patterns.
If you want to work in a circus balance on the ball - i’ve seen some really great acts! While ball work is challenging and has a place (big part in rehab of TABs) i’m just not called to balance on one in “real life” so “functionally” its a waste of my time doing it - besides it has no real carry over to typing on a keyboard or pushing a pencil :slight_smile:
[/quote]

[quote]CHEKonIT wrote:

Paul Chek states that “because the bench press is performed on a flat weight lifting bench, normal movement of the shoulder blades (scapulae) is disrupted. This demands that more movement must occur in the shoulder joint itself”
[/quote]

Can you please explain what kind of movement exactly are you talking about when you say “bench press”. Are you aware there are some very different forms of benching to start with?

I fail to see your point here. Are you saying that pectorals are useless muscle group in general? And, how much is the quads or hams involment in typing on a keyboard. Please explain furhter what you mean.

[quote]
And if you’re one of the knuckleheads on this site that’d rather trade pain free shoulders for a nice set of pecs, try pressing whilst lying on a swiss-ball. (see attached image) Your shoulders will thank you for it. [/quote]

Are you implyling that benching will inevitably lead to shoulder problems? Regardless of form used? Regardless of other program variables and exercise choices?

I have never used a swiss ball. How much weight can safely be handled on it, and how would you go about doing, say, a 5RM on it.

I look forward to your responses. Still, it seems to me this is a typical case of little knowledge being a dangerous thing.