Better Than the Best

[quote]gregron wrote:
because his nickname was GOAT he was the greatest? LMFAO

Those streetballers PLAY NO FUCKING DEFENSE! There are tons and tons of guys who can shoot the lights out in the gym but cant hold their own on the defensive end and thats why they cant play in the league or cant get off the bench.

Jordan was on the NBA All Defense team tons of times. Just cause he scored the ball at will didnt make him the GOAT, he was also a great defender.

[/quote]

Again, did anyone read the article?

I think to be the best, you have to PROVE it.

Is it possible that there is a person with the POTENTIAL to be a better basketball player than MJ, or the potential to be a better bodybuilder than Arnold, sure.

But they cant claim to be the best until they prove it. So saying some street baller IS or was better than MJ without him actually showing it is nonsense.

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
because his nickname was GOAT he was the greatest? LMFAO

Those streetballers PLAY NO FUCKING DEFENSE! There are tons and tons of guys who can shoot the lights out in the gym but cant hold their own on the defensive end and thats why they cant play in the league or cant get off the bench.

Jordan was on the NBA All Defense team tons of times. Just cause he scored the ball at will didnt make him the GOAT, he was also a great defender.

[/quote]

Again, did anyone read the article?
[/quote]

I did and I remember the documentary years back. He was who I was thinking of when I mentioned MJ in the first place.

Either way, the bottm line is yes, it is POSSIBLE for that to happen…so if people just want to argue just to insult people and act like asses, then let them have the thread.

[quote]kothreat wrote:
You know what, I bet there are recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders. Different paths in life. One got into competitive lifting while another derives joy by doing it alone.
[/quote]

you bet there are “recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders”???

You cant be serious with this.

I bet there are recreational runners out there who would win the Boston Marathon… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational swimmers out there who would out swim Michael Phelps… But they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational sprinters out there who would beat Usain Bolt in the 100m… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

do you see how absolutely dumb that is?

Records are made to be broken and, theoretically, they all will be broken in time… but saying that a “recreational” anything would beat the greatest person at that sport is absolutely ridiculous.

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:
You know what, I bet there are recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders. Different paths in life. One got into competitive lifting while another derives joy by doing it alone.
[/quote]

you bet there are “recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders”???

You cant be serious with this.

I bet there are recreational runners out there who would win the Boston Marathon… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational swimmers out there who would out swim Michael Phelps… But they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational sprinters out there who would beat Usain Bolt in the 100m… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

do you see how absolutely dumb that is?

Records are made to be broken and, theoretically, they all will be broken in time… but saying that a “recreational” anything would beat the greatest person at that sport is absolutely ridiculous.[/quote]

I see how absolutely dumb it is on both sides.

like i said in the other thread, i don’t think ronnie coleman would have ever got as big as he did without the guys in metroflex pushing him…so, are there genetic freaks out there that may have had ronnie genetics? yeah…

But, was there a guy better than ronnie coleman in his prime? No way…

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
because his nickname was GOAT he was the greatest? LMFAO

Those streetballers PLAY NO FUCKING DEFENSE! There are tons and tons of guys who can shoot the lights out in the gym but cant hold their own on the defensive end and thats why they cant play in the league or cant get off the bench.

Jordan was on the NBA All Defense team tons of times. Just cause he scored the ball at will didnt make him the GOAT, he was also a great defender.

[/quote]

Again, did anyone read the article?
[/quote]

yes I have and I know who that player is. if he played with Wilt and Wilt thought he was the best basketball player of all time why wouldnt he be in the NBA? Why wouldnt a team pick him up?

Honestly, Strongholds post in that thread should put an end to the discussion:

“Ok, here’s the thing. You’re not only claiming that you were at one point stronger than a world record holder ON THAT DAY, but rather that you were at one point stronger than EVERY world record holder in the HISTORY OF LIFTING. Every individual that I have ever seen move that weight for ~5 reps has been benching well over 600 lbs. Doing it for 15 means you are likely pushing 700 on bench. There is ONE man in the HISTORY of lifting who has ever been that strong. ONE. You’re claiming to be at that level without the use of anabolics (if IIRC). That actually puts you ahead of him, since Mendelson is a drug boat. So what you are essentially claiming, is that you, on your best day, as an amateur drug free lifter weighing somewhere under 300 lbs possessed more pressing power than the strongest raw presser in the history of lifting to date did on his best day at well north of 330 lbs and sauced to the gills.”

The only people who are agreeing with LWH are the ones who aren’t very strong themselves and have no concept of the weights being lifted here.

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
because his nickname was GOAT he was the greatest? LMFAO

Those streetballers PLAY NO FUCKING DEFENSE! There are tons and tons of guys who can shoot the lights out in the gym but cant hold their own on the defensive end and thats why they cant play in the league or cant get off the bench.

Jordan was on the NBA All Defense team tons of times. Just cause he scored the ball at will didnt make him the GOAT, he was also a great defender.

[/quote]

Again, did anyone read the article?
[/quote]

yes I have and I know who that player is. if he played with Wilt and Wilt thought he was the best basketball player of all time why wouldnt he be in the NBA? Why wouldnt a team pick him up?[/quote]
he just loved the game dude, duh.
hahahahah

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:
Although highly improbable, you can not rule out the possibility these people exist. Definitely nothing to get your panties in a knot about.

As a young kid, talking 7-9, when ever we were getting ready for the annual track and field day, the teacher would always use my long jump form as an example of “air walk”. I was good in a lot of track events, quite good. But, I lived in a small shitty town with no coaching or track programs.

What if I would have grown up in a larger centre with proper coaching, training, etc? I could be a gold medal olympian. But, that support was not available, and it was just a fun thing to us kids.

There are people out there that have incredible natural ability. This ability may not be fostered to it’s ultimate growth potential. So yeah, there are people out there that may be the best in the world at something, but for various reasons have never realized this potential. Or, perhaps have realized this potential, but because they do it for themselves, have no desire to display it. It is also fact that Jordan did not make his high school team. What if this would have deterred him from ever picking up a ball again? We all know it didn’t happen this way. He practices his god damned ass off. It was his hard work and dedication that got him to the level he achieved.

Too many variables to consider. No one can be sure one way or the other. I don’t understand why this is such a touchy topic for some. [/quote]

Another distinction: It’s one thing to say so and so COULD have been the GOAT if they had the coaching, drive, etc. It’s a whole other ball game to say so and so IS BETTER than the GOAT. Which is what some members of this site were saying in the other thread. They were claiming street ball players out there currently are better than MJ. And that there are recreational power lifters out there with better lifts than world record holders.

Big distinction.
[/quote]

You know what, I bet there are recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders. Different paths in life. One got into competitive lifting while another derives joy by doing it alone.

We can never know. So, to say that every GOAT has always been in the public spotlight is unreasonable.

Wasn’t there a baller from back in the day, actually nicknamed Goat? That was considered the best, but never played professional. I’ll check the interwebs and see if I can find him.
[/quote]

Like I said in the other threat, you guys can all play that “you never know” card all day. But excuse me for being extremely, extremely skeptical.

Some baller nicknamed goat doesn’t mean a damn thing except that maybe he was the best street baller. It’s easy to be a big fish in such a little pond.[/quote]

There is a rather large difference between being skeptical and acting like anyone who says it is a POSSIBILITY is retarded and needs to be called out in every thread.

You seem to have trouble distinguishing between the two.[/quote]

On the other end of the spectrum, you were implying that anyone that didn’t believe there were people out there better than the GOAT are retarded. IMO, your opinion is more retarded than mine.

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:
You know what, I bet there are recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders. Different paths in life. One got into competitive lifting while another derives joy by doing it alone.
[/quote]

you bet there are “recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders”???

You cant be serious with this.

I bet there are recreational runners out there who would win the Boston Marathon… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational swimmers out there who would out swim Michael Phelps… But they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational sprinters out there who would beat Usain Bolt in the 100m… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

do you see how absolutely dumb that is?

Records are made to be broken and, theoretically, they all will be broken in time… but saying that a “recreational” anything would beat the greatest person at that sport is absolutely ridiculous.[/quote]

I see how absolutely dumb it is on both sides.
[/quote]

You act like people of this caliber would not be noticed by others, are they hermits living completely apart from society?

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
because his nickname was GOAT he was the greatest? LMFAO

Those streetballers PLAY NO FUCKING DEFENSE! There are tons and tons of guys who can shoot the lights out in the gym but cant hold their own on the defensive end and thats why they cant play in the league or cant get off the bench.

Jordan was on the NBA All Defense team tons of times. Just cause he scored the ball at will didnt make him the GOAT, he was also a great defender.

[/quote]

Again, did anyone read the article?
[/quote]

also, can you please point out the part, in either of those articles, that disputes what I say?

Both those articles talked about how good of a shooter, jumper and dunker he was… NOTHING about defense (which is why I said most guys cant make it in the NBA)

If I had been born in family of comics, I would have been very well liked on this site and would have had more than 6 friends.

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
because his nickname was GOAT he was the greatest? LMFAO

Those streetballers PLAY NO FUCKING DEFENSE! There are tons and tons of guys who can shoot the lights out in the gym but cant hold their own on the defensive end and thats why they cant play in the league or cant get off the bench.

Jordan was on the NBA All Defense team tons of times. Just cause he scored the ball at will didnt make him the GOAT, he was also a great defender.

[/quote]

Again, did anyone read the article?
[/quote]

yes I have and I know who that player is. if he played with Wilt and Wilt thought he was the best basketball player of all time why wouldnt he be in the NBA? Why wouldnt a team pick him up?[/quote]

Are you serious with this question? There were reasons listed in the articles and probably a few more we will never know about.

[quote]HeavyTriple wrote:

[quote]MattyXL wrote:
I will say that the Negro League players is the one caveat, I do believe those players could have been just as great as the more revered and popular white MLB players if allowed to play together. It also could be said that if baseball was fully integrated the landscape of the all time great MLB players may be much different.[/quote]

x1000. I love baseball, but when the snobs start pissing and moaning about the “sanctity of records,” I just point to this.

Also, I don’t really think that professional athletes are the only people who are genetically elite. I believe there are many, many supremely talented bums who never had the proper work ethic to succeed in their particular sport. Now I’m not referring to Lew there, because remarkable strength == professional athlete.[/quote]

Agreed, Ill also say that while the MLB greats would still be great if baseball was integrated, but not AS great.

[quote]waylanderxx wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:
You know what, I bet there are recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders. Different paths in life. One got into competitive lifting while another derives joy by doing it alone.
[/quote]

you bet there are “recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders”???

You cant be serious with this.

I bet there are recreational runners out there who would win the Boston Marathon… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational swimmers out there who would out swim Michael Phelps… But they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational sprinters out there who would beat Usain Bolt in the 100m… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

do you see how absolutely dumb that is?

Records are made to be broken and, theoretically, they all will be broken in time… but saying that a “recreational” anything would beat the greatest person at that sport is absolutely ridiculous.[/quote]

I see how absolutely dumb it is on both sides.
[/quote]

You act like people of this caliber would not be noticed by others, are they hermits living completely apart from society?[/quote]

This is a possibility. I’m pretty much a hermit and distance myself from society. Although, no superpowers how would anyone know?

You act like everybody that is great at something wants to showcase it.

[quote]kothreat wrote:
Are you serious with this question? There were reasons listed in the articles and probably a few more we will never know about.
[/quote]

the part about his two stints in prison? The two prison terms he served when he was almost 40 & 50 (which would have been after his potential NBA career was over)

or the fact that he had disagreements with his coach in college? Thats probably the real reason cause players in the NBA never disagree with their coaches.

or was it the part where he started smoking marijuana? No on in the NBA (especially in the 60’s) ever smoked. That had to be it then?

[quote]D Public wrote:
like i said in the other thread, i don’t think ronnie coleman would have ever got as big as he did without the guys in metroflex pushing him…so, are there genetic freaks out there that may have had ronnie genetics? yeah…

But, was there a guy better than ronnie coleman in his prime? No way…

[/quote]

Actually, the post made in the other thread specifically spoke of there statistically being a possibility of someone being as good as many of the greats IF they received similar motivation and guidance.

Just like you said, Ronnie only got into bodybuilding because someone talked him into it. There would still be a Ronnie Coleman if that didn’t happen even if no one knew about him.

WTF is GOAT? Sorry I stopped watching basketball when Bird retired.

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
because his nickname was GOAT he was the greatest? LMFAO

Those streetballers PLAY NO FUCKING DEFENSE! There are tons and tons of guys who can shoot the lights out in the gym but cant hold their own on the defensive end and thats why they cant play in the league or cant get off the bench.

Jordan was on the NBA All Defense team tons of times. Just cause he scored the ball at will didnt make him the GOAT, he was also a great defender.

[/quote]

Again, did anyone read the article?
[/quote]

also, can you please point out the part, in either of those articles, that disputes what I say?

Both those articles talked about how good of a shooter, jumper and dunker he was… NOTHING about defense (which is why I said most guys cant make it in the NBA)[/quote]

No, and you can’t point out any parts that dispute what I say.