T Nation

Better Results from PH Than Test


#1

Just finished up my first cycle of Test E 250 and wow I am disappointed.

A little background - I am a competitive bodybuilder that, up until this point, havent ran any "real" cycles before. I have previously ran PH's before and have had very satisfying results... more than once. Been able to keep all my gains after being off and have had zero sides. Now that I have actually ran the real deal, I am unsure why everyone always bashes PH's. Now I know that you can potentially take more drugs and/or higher doses, but I would rather take a pill and get decent results, no sides, and keep my gains.

The cycle looked like this:

-Week 1-4 Dbol and 30mg per day
-Week 1-8 Test E 250 at 500mg per week
-Week 1-6 Adex at .5mg EOD (stopped taking after week 6 as I wasnt noticing any sides)

Typical PCT of Nolvadex post cycle as well beginning two weeks after my last pin.

Anyhow, results were pretty disappointing. I gained about 10lbs while on, but all that water weight disappeared two weeks after I was off.

My diet is on point, I work with a reputable prep coach and I plow weights day in and day out. I was really expecting a lot from this cycle, but came up very disappointed. My workouts were never that great while I was on and my appetite actually slowed down quite a bit. All in all, I never felt good like I was expecting. Strength didnt increase, weight was meh, appetite was meh, and my damn energy sucked.

I guess my expectations were too high? Since bodybuilders in "real life" all seems to beat around the bush when trying to discuss these things in real life, I figured I would post on here.

Any thoughts? Comments? What the hell guys?


#2

Which PH do you use ?


#3

Three things, #1, I've had some really strong PH before, but that was over ten years ago, since been outlawed in Canada, like to know what you used ? #2 Civilized steroid cycles don't produce the huge results people seem to dream about, just give you an edge, and help fill the holes in diet-training, and nutrition. People that have this in order already, will gain less of an edge. #3 There's alot of fake shit going around, and even when it's real it's watered down, even from reputable sources. This parts depressing, been around long enough to remember one anavar, or Dbol a day giving results, now I see guys taking 10-20 a day with no results, depressing.

Another thing to consider is just being unresponsive, I like to start guys off on test only cycles @ 500 a week, and I've seen both ends of the spectrum at this level. Guys that blew up, and guys that got nothing at all. There's lots of reasons for this, but in your case you also had Dbol, so you should have had some results from that at the very least. Lots to ponder, it was a short cycle, might want to try 12 weeks of test next time. Anyway couple things to think about. Latter


#4

I notice alot of guys say this because PH's are usually done by the smaller guys ( I did it when I was 150lbs), they gain 5-15lbs on the PH that they could have gained naturally and it'll stay if they PCT right.

Then these guys get on gear soon after because "the real thing is gona blow me up", which it doesn't because 9 times out of 10 if you had to take a PH to push past 140-150lbs then you have no idea how to eat, train, recover, plus the majority have no idea what a pct is.
( now remember Im just throwing examples.)

Now my last reason you may have not seen results is because you ran a long estered compound which generally takes 2-5 weeks to start seeing weight gain ( varies from person to person), Ran a low dose, and then only ran it for 8 weeks.

However the Dbol didn't help at all either so you may have under dosed gear, Not so great receptors, Theres a huge list really.


#5

Thanks for the responses guys, good stuff here.

The PH that I used were all from Alpha Male Formulations.

"Morph", which was:
Halodrol 25MG
4-chloro-17a-methyl-androst-1,4-diene-3b,17b-diol

Methylstenbolone 5MG
2,17a-dimethyl-5a-androsta-1-en-17b-ol-3-one

and

Slice. which was:
Trenavar 7.5mg Estra-4,9,11-triene-3,17-dione

Epistane 10MG 2a,3a-epithio-17a-methyl-5a-androstan-17b-ol
This product requires on cycle support and pct afterward.


#6

And to the few responses above, I have been training for about 8 years, 26 years old, and have competed for the past two years. My typical offseason weight is 205-210 and contest weight is 176 (middleweight).

Honestly, I understand that these drugs dont do it all. It isnt magic, but the work I put into it, I feel i should've seen far better results. I live and breath this stuff.

I pretty much felt like crap as far as energy and appetite goes and I never felt like I had that "edge". I figured I would gain anywhere from 5-15 lbs, that I would keep, and would have been happy. Unfortunately, I am back to the exact same weight, with no noticeable gains. Honestly, I didnt gain anywhere. I may have even decreased my strength in certain lifts because I was always feeling drained.


#7

I think the gear is suspect, but, and this is a big but, because I'm going into territory I don't have a scientific back ground for, mabey because it was a long ester (takes longer to do it's job) and you took a low dose. Possibly it was just enough to shut down your natural testosteone, but not enough or not a long enough cycle to produce any results. I could be way off on this, but it's a thought. You might want to bump it to 650-750 and go 12 weeks this time, or try test P for the same cycle. This is the reason I start guys off on a test only cycle the first time, to see how they react, and then adjust the dose accordingly on the next cycle, as well as add another compound if desired. Its a big learning curve, everyone is different, but I would rather take my time over a couple cycles to learn my own body, one compound at a time. rather than take the cyber gurus advice and load up on a big cycle the first time. You seem intelligent enough to make subtle adjustments over the next cycle or two, and find what works for you. I feel this is the safe way to do steroids, and understand how they work with your body. Most people are just to impaitant.

If I were you, I'd first check on the quality of the gear and the source. Then on the next cycle, I'd try the same dose with test P. There are some draw backs to test P like having to pin ED or EOD, and some people get some pain at point of injection, but I get better results from it, it's clean, and you know by the end of the first week if it's working. This way you can make adjustments on the fly, well you figure out your body. So maney guys rush in and do a huge cycle at first, with multiple compounds, and then have no way of knowing what did what, at the end. Anyway this is my 2 cents, goodluck


#8

Run a gram of test for 12 weeks and report again.


#9

Yeah run higher test and see how that works out. 250 isn't enough IMO