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Best Supps From Biotest


Hey, I've been lifting for about a year. I started with just leg work for jumping, but about 4 months ago starting doing everything. My goal is to pack on a solid 15-20 pounds in a nice time frame (ideally 3 months, but I'd be happy with anything up to about 6 months). Now I'm ~180 now, a tad under 6 feet. Of course I'm doing my basic lifts plus a bunch of others and I have a great workout program.

What I'm curious about is what the best supplements from here are. I use creatine (on off cycles of 1 month), a multivitamin (megaman sport GNC), and a protein shake. The ones that caught my eye from here were:

Surge Workout Fuel
Surge Recovery
Obviously their protein

I'm thinking 11-T might be overkill. Now I'd love some more knowledgeable opinions. Ideally if someone could outline exactly what would be ideal I'd be really appreciative. Now money isn't a huge issue at the moment, Christmas was good to me =D

(PS I'm good on nutrition, 5 solid meals, I never eat junk food, sodas, even red meats... a lot of chicken though. Usually shoot for 4-5k calories a day when looking to gain, all healthy)

Thanks in advance


Since when is red meat 'junk food'?

You should read the reviews of the products in the SAN forum.

I brought some BCAA & Metabolic Drive from their Australian store, IMO its the same as most brands.


I was listing what I don't eat, sorry. I don't eat junk food (ie candy, potato chips, any empty calories), I don't drink soda, and I don't eat red meat (I prefer chicken/turkey, feels as though its healthier).

Thanks for the advice, I'll look at the reviews. There are just so many different things to pick from I'm pretty overwhelmed. Don't want to miss something that I shouldn't have.


This should cover what you are looking for...

Supplementation for Newbies

The 13 Super Stacks

Since there is only so much money a person can spend on supplements you will need to decide which ones are the most important to you. I recommend doing some research on each supplement to decide what's best for you. I've recently reduced my monthly expenditures which has allowed me to increase my budget for supplements and after some research decided to add Surge Workout Fuel and Superfood (hope to receive the shipment in the next day or two) to my supplement stack.

I don't think you could go wrong with any of the supplements you listed, but I think most people would agree Flameout should be near the top of your list or at least fish oil. I also really like ZMA for a months worth at $15, because it's improved the quality of my sleep considerably along with its other potential benefits.


How's your energy level, Malone? Doesn't sound like an issue for you, but I know several guys that like Spike. Flameout is kind of a given, along with their protein &
Surge. BCAAs are good.



I wouldn't steer clear of red meat 100%.

1 it tastes fantastic (better with A1)

2 it's got great fats in it

3 see #1

If your gaining weight and eating a ton, then I'd suggest snagging some Flameout for sure.

Biotest has some great stuff; I wouldn't suggest against any of it really....everyone is different and reacts differently to everything.

Read the "stacks" articles posted above too...


Thanks guys, I'll read through it. Right now I'm thinking of protein, the Surges, Flameout, ZMA, and Superfood.

11-T, BCAA, and Receptormax seem to be the next three I'd be curious to try that might not make the cut (unless anyone strongly suggests otherwise)

And yeah, energy is not a problem for me right now.

thanks again though


Okay so I'm ordering tomorrow, as it stands:


Receptormax and TRIBEX both seemed a tad bit like they all do similar things to a lot of other supplements so I figured it would be overkill. Feedback would be appreciated, thanks for pointing me in the right direction though.


I don't see a problem with any of them.

You might want to start the 11-T & Beta-7 at different times (spaced out) so you can actually see the benefit of them.

That way you'll know what works better for you and you'll know what to order next time. Instead of starting both @ the same time, getting good results and then saying: "shit, i guess i'll have to buy both again to get these results".

Start reading up on BCAAs and how much YOU want to take and when...


Forgive me but you look very young in your avator, Id say seventeen or so, in which case I would most certainly not buy the 11-T. IMO youd be better off with 2x the BCAAs.


Another recent thread on supplements - http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/diet_performance_nutrition_supplements/idea_supplements_for_bulking - has some good info you might want to read, if you haven't already. Are you going with Surge Workout Fuel, Surge Recovery, or both? From reading most of the Surge Workout Fuel thread the BCAA may not be entirely necessary if you're going with the Surge Workout Fuel, but I could be wrong.

If you're ordering all that at once to start taking at once I would get ready for some kick ass workouts!


That's a good point. In the instructions for use it explicitly states for "healthy males 21 years of age and older".


Yeah I'm about to turn 19, but I stopped growing a while back. I'm only planning on started the 11-T after doing the rest of this stuff for a month (feb 1), and if anything is at all off with it I'd stop. That'll let me see just what everything does.

The BCAAs are confusing, no lie. The info at the store seems to suggest a huge number each day, do I really need to take 4 pills three times a day or more (esp when training)? Right now I'm planning on taking two doses of 4 pills between meals, then just doing the Surge Workout Fuel during workouts (since it was suggested that that has BCAAs). If something else would be ideal please let me know.

Thanks a ton!


I think you really just need to do a lot of reading on supplementation. You really don't ever need to go 'off' creatine. And if you do, it has nothing to do with using or not using 11-T.

As far as Receptormax and TRIBEX, they are probably two of the best supplements out there for some. It depends on whether you need to boost testosterone and what your insulin profile is like. At 19, you probably don't need to boost T. I don't know about your insulin. Receptormax has a host of other benefits. It also doesn't matter if there are similar supplements on the market if you're not taking them and would benefit them.

Nonetheless, at your age, your suggested protocol of BCAAs and Surge Workout Fuel seems like a good one. I'd hold off on 11-T for now. Possibly a protein supplement if you're not meeting your needs for your goals with wole food sources.


I would not recommend the 11-T.

The principle reason is a very real and practical psychological thing. (A lot of times things that might be called psychology are bullshit, but there are also some things that have enough truth that ignoring them is not the productive thing to do.)

At age 19 and one year of lifting, you DO NOT NEED an extra edge like 11-T to get good results.

If your progress is not quite good in any given time period, such as the period when you were planning to use the 11-T, then the reason was most assuredly not lack of 11-T, but lacks or errors in training and/or nutrition.

11-T could even be counterproductive -- not to immediate results but to the more important, your learning about lifting and training -- by masking errors and causing you to believe they were the right thing to do.

Furthermore, while I don't have experience in this exact issue with 11-T and I am not saying 11-T is an anabolic steroid because it is not, but it seems to me the same psychological principle applies, I have seen it again and again where a young guy who starts employing what should be an edge for more advanced users winds up becoming psychologically dependent on it. He never learns to train and get good results without the edge, and develops the defeatist attitude that without the edge, he is wasting his time anyway and expects nothing, and therefore gets nothing.

As probably a bad analogy, this is like a guy running a 350 Chevy who hasn't done anything the carbs, exhaust or anything else deciding he is going to run 5% nitro in his gasoline. And if he doesn't have his 5% nitro, then he isn't going to even bother running his stoplight Grand Prix or whatever it is he does - he "needs" it -- and he has lost his focus on things that would be more productive to him like some basic engine-building. Instead he's taken 5% nitro as his fix.

(And in case anyone suggests I'm overblowing the effect of 11-T by making a comparison with 5% nitro, actually 5% nitro is not a huge deal, though it's a significant edge.)


Okay, no 11-T.
I'd heard that you can stop responding to Creatine that well if you take it for too long a period at a time, so I've been going on and off for one month at a time for the last year. Would I be able to just stay on, or only take it after workouts?

And on the supplements, I'll try what I'm getting, then perhaps Receptormax or TRIBEX later, but for now I'd like to see what this does for me, thanks.


I would lay off the Beta-7 and get some more Surge recovery and just double dose it for a workout. You'll see more improvements aesthetically that way.

Beta-7 improves performance no doubt, but double dosing Surge will lead to better muscle gains in terms of cost.


As said no need to cycle off creatine, especially a month


I'll try that, but I want both aesthetics and performance, as I need to both bulk and get stronger for athletics. I should still double dose Recovery even if I'm taking SURGE Workout Fuel?


I see. Well you should focus on one first. Is it that you want to get better at basketball?

We'll if it's just that, then focus on getting better at basketball first. Gaining muscle mass will come with your strength and conditioning program (if you have one) and good nutrition. If mass is more important, start a lifting program for it and eat to gain more mass.

If you are going to try to focus on gaining mass and trying to get better at basketball, you will get small gains in both. If you focused on one, you'll experience great gains.

So for your question. If you have the money, you could take Beta-alanine, SURGE Workout Fuel, and then double dose Surge. Sip on Surge Recovery mixed with SURGE Workout Fuel in 20oz of water 20 minutes before the workout. then after the workout, drink another Surge Recovery.

If you don't have the money, assuming you are going to buy SURGE Workout Fuel, just use SURGE Workout Fuel and Surge Recovery once.

Start reading some articles on this site, they have a lot of great information.