T Nation

Best Mass Program?

Hey guys, I know this is a tough question to answer due to the fact that not every program works for every person and all that but I figured you guys could help me out. I am just now finishing up my fourth month doing Reg Park’s 5x5 Program ( http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/the_reg_park_way_to_serious_size_and_strength ) and want to find a split program for size.

Which split routine gave you guys the best results as far as mass and size? I am not interested in body part specific routines but rather a workout plan that will add mass all over. Please include links to the routine and/or a description. If the workout plan doesn’t include working out the legs, don’t bother posting.

Thanks for any responses.

Try westside for skinny Bastards. I started doing it and have notice soem good gains. I just recently changed the rep scheme to pyramiding routine well see how it goes…

3 training years should be enough time to start making a customized program based on how your body responded to the things you’ve tried.

Why not switch to something vastly different, perhaps a high volume body part split?

Read this thread: http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/professor_x_a_request

and start reading posts made by Cephalic_Carnage.

Those two guys do a better job than most on explaining how to gain strength and size. I know for me that the strength gains didn’t start coming before I started paying attention to how intense I was being in the gym, rather than what program or set/rep scheme I was using. How you split your workouts during the week is not that important, the important thing is to progress on the lifts you do, and to eat enough so that you can.

I wasted a lot of time trying “programs.” Never got very far.

[quote]Mr.Purple wrote:
Read this thread: http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/professor_x_a_request

and start reading posts made by Cephalic_Carnage.

Those two guys do a better job than most on explaining how to gain strength and size. I know for me that the strength gains didn’t start coming before I started paying attention to how intense I was being in the gym, rather than what program or set/rep scheme I was using. How you split your workouts during the week is not that important, the important thing is to progress on the lifts you do, and to eat enough so that you can.

I wasted a lot of time trying “programs.” Never got very far.[/quote]

+2 on everything Purple said.

x 3 on everything purple said

x 4

[quote]MEYMZ wrote:
3 training years should be enough time to start making a customized program based on how your body responded to the things you’ve tried.[/quote]

What a load of bullshit.

The best thing my body ever responded to (and therefor what I have continued to do) were the most traditional and basic body part splits:

Back/biceps
Chest/triceps
Thighs/calves
Shoulders/traps

and…

Legs
Chest
Back
Shoulders
Arms

Like other people have said above, the exact order doesn’t matter, and there isn’t one formula or exact prescription of exercises, sets, and reps that is going to work for everybody.

Everybody starts with the basic exercises, a basic moderate set/rep range, and a basic split. From there you see what works (99% of the basics will work already), and if tweaks need to be made or if your training experience dictates expanding your program, then there you go.

Long way of saying: Don’t look for something perfect, just do something, do it 100%, and the bodybuilding basics are the best place to start.

O’ rly?

[quote]DevinMcAfee wrote:
not every program works for every person[/quote]

I’d say the best program for me when it came to putting on mass was Food and Eating. Seriously, not being a smart ass here. Just eat. When I was in high school I trained for 9 months straight to get ready for my senior year of baseball and I lifted a 4-day split and ate 4,500-5000 cal a day. I put on close to 40lbs in that time with about a 2-3% increase in BF (school had Tanita scales, and thats what they said). I ate everything in site those days.

I want to know just how fucking intellectually lazy people have become!

[quote]MEYMZ wrote:
3 training years should be enough time to start making a customized program based on how your body responded to the things you’ve tried.[/quote]

obviously not
i started lifting in high school under the instruction of a guy who was older than me

for a year I thought that all I had to do was lift weights and take a protein shake after and I would get buff

I have been reading T-Nation for about a year now and have been reading profusely. I posted this just because there are A MILLION programs out there and I would like to see some of the programs that worked best for you.

[quote]DevinMcAfee wrote:
MEYMZ wrote:
3 training years should be enough time to start making a customized program based on how your body responded to the things you’ve tried.

obviously not
i started lifting in high school under the instruction of a guy who was older than me

for a year I thought that all I had to do was lift weights and take a protein shake after and I would get buff

I have been reading T-Nation for about a year now and have been reading profusely. I posted this just because there are A MILLION programs out there and I would like to see some of the programs that worked best for you.[/quote]

You are missing the point. There is no program that will “work” for you. You do the work, and how your split is set up is of minor importance.

I spent a lot of time reading all the articles on here, too. I wish I hadn’t, all I got from it was OCD. lol

Learn the basic bodybuilding approach (as I said, posts made by Cephalic_Carnage is a good place to start).

Eat more.

[quote]mr popular wrote:
MEYMZ wrote:
3 training years should be enough time to start making a customized program based on how your body responded to the things you’ve tried.

What a load of bullshit.

The best thing my body ever responded to (and therefor what I have continued to do) were the most traditional and basic body part splits:

Back/biceps
Chest/triceps
Thighs/calves
Shoulders/traps

and…

Legs
Chest
Back
Shoulders
Arms

Like other people have said above, the exact order doesn’t matter, and there isn’t one formula or exact prescription of exercises, sets, and reps that is going to work for everybody.

Everybody starts with the basic exercises, a basic moderate set/rep range, and a basic split. From there you see what works (99% of the basics will work already), and if tweaks need to be made or if your training experience dictates expanding your program, then there you go.

Long way of saying: Don’t look for something perfect, just do something, do it 100%, and the bodybuilding basics are the best place to start.[/quote]

dang man thats pretty harsh. i think yall are saying pretty much the exact same things. he’s saying that the OP has been training long enough to know his body.

[quote] From there you see what works (99% of the basics will work already), and if tweaks need to be made or if your training experience dictates expanding your program, then there you go.[/quote] yuppers, it looks like thats pretty much the same thing

Simply change your training to the opposite of what you are currently doing and you should see some nice gains.

Your body will adapt to any routine after some time on it, therefore you NEED to vary the stimulus.

If you are doing a full body routine, lower reps, switch to higher volume body part split. I prefer body part split for optimal gains in lean mass and you can periodize your routine, once you find what rep range you respone best to. I.e A high volume phase that works for you may not work for someone else. You need to find out what element you are, whether you respond better to higher reps or lower and then you can periodize your training accordingly.

For example, any reps over 8-10 for me are a bit of a waste for me and therefore I do not go much over that during an accumulation phase on my primary lifts. I handle or/and repond better to lower reps(more fast twitch fibres)

GJ

[quote]Mr.Purple wrote:
DevinMcAfee wrote:
MEYMZ wrote:
3 training years should be enough time to start making a customized program based on how your body responded to the things you’ve tried.

obviously not
i started lifting in high school under the instruction of a guy who was older than me

for a year I thought that all I had to do was lift weights and take a protein shake after and I would get buff

I have been reading T-Nation for about a year now and have been reading profusely. I posted this just because there are A MILLION programs out there and I would like to see some of the programs that worked best for you.

You are missing the point. There is no program that will “work” for you. You do the work, and how your split is set up is of minor importance.

I spent a lot of time reading all the articles on here, too. I wish I hadn’t, all I got from it was OCD. lol

Learn the basic bodybuilding approach (as I said, posts made by Cephalic_Carnage is a good place to start).

Eat more.
[/quote]

Thanks for clarifying Mr. Purple. But it seems some people don’t understand explanations, they don’t want to think, they just want to be told what to do.

My personal program [written by me].
Stats -

  • Height 6ft
  • Weight 196lbs
  • Body fat 11.2%
  • Chest 44"
  • Arms 17.5"
  • Waist 33"
  • Quads 28"
  • Calves 16.5"

Monday/Day one
Back

  • Pull Ups - 4 x A
  • Bent Over Rows - 6 x 15, 15, 12, 10, 8, 6
  • One Arm DB Rows - 4 x 12, 12, 10, 8
  • Lat Pulldowns - 4 x 15, 15, 12, 12
  • Seated Cable Rows - 4 x 15, 15, 12, 12
  • Inverted Rows - 4 x A

Tuesday/Day two
Chest

  • Inc DB Press - 6 x 15, 15, 12, 12, 10, 8
  • HS Flat Press - 4 x 15, 12, 10, 8
  • Flat Bench Press - 4 x 12, 12, 10, 8
  • Dec Smith Bench - 4 x 15, 15, 15, 12
  • Bodyweight Dips - 4 x A
  • Flat Cable Flye’s - 4 x 20, 20, 15, 15

Wednesday/Day three
Hamstrings and Calves
*Romanian Deadlift - 6 x 20, 20, 15, 15, 12, 12
*Laying Hamstring Curls - 4 x 20, 20, 20, 15
*Seated Hamstring Curls - 4 x 20, 20, 20, 15
*Natural Glute Ham Raise - 3 x A
*Barbell Calf Raises - 5 x 50, 40, 30, 20, 10
*Calf Press - 4 x 30, 20, 20, 10
*Donkey Calf [BW] - 1 x A

Thursday/Day four
Shoulders
*Seated DB Shoulder Press - 6 x 20, 15, 15, 12, 10, 8
*Military Press - 4 x 12, 12, 10, 8
*HS Shoulder Press - 4 x 15, 15, 12, 12
*DB Lateral Raises - 2 x 15, 15
*DB Front Raises - 2 x 15, 15
*DB Reverse Flyes - 2 x 15, 15

Friday/Day five
Arms
*CG Bench Press - 6 x 20, 15, 15, 12, 10, 8
*Skullcrushers - 4 x 20, 15, 12, 8
*Parallel Bar Pushdowns - 4 x 15, 12, 12, 10
*Diamond Pushups - 2 x A
*Close Hammer Grip Chins - 4 x A
*Barbell Curls - 4 x 15, 12, 12, 10
*Dumbbell Hammer Curls - 4 x 15, 12, 12, 10
*EZ Reverse Preacher Curls - 4 x 12, 12, 12, 10
*Wrist Curls - 3 x 20, 20, 20
*Wrist Roller - 3 x 5, 5, 5

Saturday/Day six
Quadriceps and Calves
*Leg Extensions - 2 x 30
*Leg Press - 6 x 20, 20, 15, 15, 10, 10
*Back Squats - 4 x 20, 20, 10, 8
*Reverse Hack Machine Squat - 4 x 20, 15, 10, 10
*Leg Extensions - 2 x 30
*Barbell Calf Raises - 5 x 20, 20, 10, 10, 10
*Calf Press - 4 x 20, 20, 10, 10
*Donkey Calf [BW] - 1 x A

Sunday/Day seven
OFF

MJ-Cartwright
Fitness Instructor and Strength Coach
Pontypridd South Wales

[quote]MJ - Cartwright wrote:
My personal program [written by me].
Stats -

  • Height 6ft
  • Weight 196lbs
  • Body fat 11.2%
  • Chest 44"
  • Arms 17.5"
  • Waist 33"
  • Quads 28"
  • Calves 16.5"

Monday/Day one
Back

  • Pull Ups - 4 x A
  • Bent Over Rows - 6 x 15, 15, 12, 10, 8, 6
  • One Arm DB Rows - 4 x 12, 12, 10, 8
  • Lat Pulldowns - 4 x 15, 15, 12, 12
  • Seated Cable Rows - 4 x 15, 15, 12, 12
  • Inverted Rows - 4 x A

Tuesday/Day two
Chest

  • Inc DB Press - 6 x 15, 15, 12, 12, 10, 8
  • HS Flat Press - 4 x 15, 12, 10, 8
  • Flat Bench Press - 4 x 12, 12, 10, 8
  • Dec Smith Bench - 4 x 15, 15, 15, 12
  • Bodyweight Dips - 4 x A
  • Flat Cable Flye’s - 4 x 20, 20, 15, 15

Wednesday/Day three
Hamstrings and Calves
*Romanian Deadlift - 6 x 20, 20, 15, 15, 12, 12
*Laying Hamstring Curls - 4 x 20, 20, 20, 15
*Seated Hamstring Curls - 4 x 20, 20, 20, 15
*Natural Glute Ham Raise - 3 x A
*Barbell Calf Raises - 5 x 50, 40, 30, 20, 10
*Calf Press - 4 x 30, 20, 20, 10
*Donkey Calf [BW] - 1 x A

Thursday/Day four
Shoulders
*Seated DB Shoulder Press - 6 x 20, 15, 15, 12, 10, 8
*Military Press - 4 x 12, 12, 10, 8
*HS Shoulder Press - 4 x 15, 15, 12, 12
*DB Lateral Raises - 2 x 15, 15
*DB Front Raises - 2 x 15, 15
*DB Reverse Flyes - 2 x 15, 15

Friday/Day five
Arms
*CG Bench Press - 6 x 20, 15, 15, 12, 10, 8
*Skullcrushers - 4 x 20, 15, 12, 8
*Parallel Bar Pushdowns - 4 x 15, 12, 12, 10
*Diamond Pushups - 2 x A
*Close Hammer Grip Chins - 4 x A
*Barbell Curls - 4 x 15, 12, 12, 10
*Dumbbell Hammer Curls - 4 x 15, 12, 12, 10
*EZ Reverse Preacher Curls - 4 x 12, 12, 12, 10
*Wrist Curls - 3 x 20, 20, 20
*Wrist Roller - 3 x 5, 5, 5

Saturday/Day six
Quadriceps and Calves
*Leg Extensions - 2 x 30
*Leg Press - 6 x 20, 20, 15, 15, 10, 10
*Back Squats - 4 x 20, 20, 10, 8
*Reverse Hack Machine Squat - 4 x 20, 15, 10, 10
*Leg Extensions - 2 x 30
*Barbell Calf Raises - 5 x 20, 20, 10, 10, 10
*Calf Press - 4 x 20, 20, 10, 10
*Donkey Calf [BW] - 1 x A

Sunday/Day seven
OFF

MJ-Cartwright
Fitness Instructor and Strength Coach
Pontypridd South Wales
[/quote]

Way too much volume in my opinion. Which sets are the ones where you build new muscle?

Paul. You may feel its too much volume, but this program has worked wonders for me.
You have to bear in mind the human body only adapt’s when presented with sufficient stresses, also I used to train with more exercise’s than this.
There is logic to my plan. In that each exercise is selected to target a specific area of a muscle/muscle group, for example.

Back -
*Pull Ups - Using a slightly wider than shoulder width grip, this targets the upper lat fibres and help expand the shoulder girdle.
*Bent Over Rows - Using an overhand grip, drawing in to the navel, targeting the mid lat and creating thickness in the lats, Rhomboids, Lower Trap’s & Teres Major/Minor.
*One Arm Rows - Using the hammer grip, Drawing in to the hip, thus targeting the lower lat, also this exercise stretches the lat, which reacts better to being pre-stretched.
*Lat Pulldowns - Only Use these to completely fry the upper fibres of the lats, where I use the widest grip possible, pulling down to the front, 1.5" from the chest.
*Seated Cable Rows - Due to the Scapular Retraction, the Lower Traps, Rhomboids and Lats are worked, which as with pulldowns I use to toast the back.
*Inverted Rows - Personally think that everyone should include these as they work the entire back region, besides after the workout I can usually only knock out 4/5 per set.
So hopefully you can understand my thinking.
Thanks for the response Paul.

MJ-Cartwright
Fitness Instructor and Strength Coach
Pontypridd South Wales