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Best Discipline for Bad Shoulder?

Hello there all,
I’m a long time lurker in the combat forums, and i know there are plenty of good folks who can help with my dilemma.

I’m a grappler or should I say I was. I used to grapple to be more specific Aikido was my discipline, and I would love to get back into it.
But almost a year ago I was involved in an accident, was rear ended from behind coming downhill, the impact of the hit made my car jump over the “center divider curb area” smashed into a small tree a sign or two and lets just say I ended up losing control of my car and ended up ricocheting off the parked cars on the other side of the curb on the side of oncoming traffic, this was 3 lanes of on coming traffic that I went through to hit the parked cars on the opposite side. I walked out (crawled out of my car, because more than just one side of my car was smashed in) just fine, I was a bit shaken up, but still breathing and in good health.

The next few days I was sore, I didn’t make anything of it, being glad to have survived, got a physical and x rays and check up done. Everything was okay and normal. A couple months later I was messing around in bed when I hurt my shoulder. I believe that my shoulder got hurt because the joint capsule was a bit shaken up and “loose(er)” than before. So basically I had a 155+ lb person sitting on top of me while I’m face down laying on my stomach. I try to do a 180 spin from under this person (which I had done plenty times before) and that is when the shoulder got hurt.

Could not move in at all, wanted a sling for it, it felt loose like it was hanging on by just a thread, it felt “dead”. Went in; got MRI with contrast, came up as a partial SLAP tear (labral tear) doc sent me to rehab, felt so much better after a month, doc said its up to me if I wanted to go under the knife, he said and as did other professionals that I asked if it does hurt or bother you in every day activities then no need for surgery.
Opted to not go for surgery. Have not grappled since, went in a few times to the doc he said try it out, if it hurts then its up to you.

My question is what other disciplines can I try that wont put too much undue stress on my shoulder (I know in a sense that’s rhetorical but hopefully ya’ll get what I’m saying), at least not the type of twisting and turning that grappling does.

Thanks

Wing Chun may be good for you. It’s the martial art that Bruce Lee trained in.

It was developed by a Chinese nun to make martial arts practical for both men and women.

It’s a powerful art that does put stress on the shoulder but not nearly as much as aikido or judo. It focuses on soft blocks (parries) and fluidity. Basically, it avoid tensing your muscles.

Well what are your goals in regards to training? Do you just enjoy the workout aspect or athleticism required for martial arts/combat sports?

If so then Tae Kwon Do or Tang Soo Do are both very kick oriented arts and for that reason will not stress your shoulder nearly as much as a grappling or punching based art. You could also look into Bill Wallace’s material; Bill is a great example of someone who pretty much built his system around the fact that he had an injury which limited him and yet was one of the most successful full contact Karate/kick boxers in history.

Pretty much every grappling art that I can think of will put a fair to a lot of pressure on the shoulders. Even arts where there are no joint locks of the shoulder per se (like folkstyle wrestling), there is still a lot of stress put on the shoulder joint.

I train with a couple guys who had torn labrums and both opted for surgery. One still has trouble with his shoulder (but is a bit older and has several decades of very rough training under his belt and admits that he probably waited too long to get the surgery) while the others shoulder has steadily been getting stronger since he got the green light from his doctor to start training (full force) again. He still says he feels it some if he does enough push-ups, but he doesn’t have any issues with it during grappling, striking, MMA, or RMA training (while the first person does and has to avoid a lot of techniques directed towards his bad shoulder).

I’m not telling you to get surgery; I am not a medical professional and even if I was I wouldn’t advise people over the Internet. Just offering some anecdotal evidence that I’ve gathered from a couple of Martial Artists who have been in the same boat as you.

Good luck.

I had a shoulder reco last year and there is no way known I would do a grappling sport.

I am trying to play reserves level local footy (aussie rules) and even basic tackling has me worried.

That being said I have been doing Muay Thai for the past 2 months (normally three classes and one or two sessions at home of shadow boxing and/or bag work) and have had zero issues (knock on wood).

Maybe I have just been scarred mentally cos I have so many issues with my shoulder (probably 30 dislocations) but I wouldn’t be brave enough to go into a heavy wrestling/grappling focused sport.

So I have found Muay Thai to be pretty good, I haven’t done any heavy sparring, but I have done some freestyle light sparring, so not just pad work and it’s been good to me.

Nice Post Sento

being clear with yourself about your goals
is a good start

Ive had a few shoulder ( and other ) injuries that did not keep me from training or competing

torn labrum - ac separation - broken collar bone - dislocated shoulders

now take that with a grain of salt
I was a D1 athlete with a very different set of priorities and a very hard head
at the time I also had many resources PT -Chiropractor - university trainer- all helping me make a strategy for recovery
and to be able to keep training

while I am far more likely to be from the tape it ice it rub some dirt on it school,
by no means am I telling you to train - or endanger your health.

see what is possible see what ROM you have without compromise
see what kind of everyday shit like sleeping and posture do to your shoulder
and while I only feel these words as I get older - its ok to train to just feel good

[quote]kmcnyc wrote:
Nice Post Sento

being clear with yourself about your goals
is a good start

Ive had a few shoulder ( and other ) injuries that did not keep me from training or competing

torn labrum - ac separation - broken collar bone - dislocated shoulders

now take that with a grain of salt
I was a D1 athlete with a very different set of priorities and a very hard head
at the time I also had many resources PT -Chiropractor - university trainer- all helping me make a strategy for recovery
and to be able to keep training

while I am far more likely to be from the tape it ice it rub some dirt on it school,
by no means am I telling you to train - or endanger your health.

see what is possible see what ROM you have without compromise
see what kind of everyday shit like sleeping and posture do to your shoulder
and while I only feel these words as I get older - its ok to train to just feel good
[/quote]

Good advice. I’ve had shoulder problems, including violent dislocations. For me, I had to get smart about my rehab, and include more weight training in my routine. I found handstand work for time made a big difference to the stability of my shoulder joint when it was extended. I also included a lot of direct shoulder isolation work, high rep raises from all angles, rotator cuff work, band pull aparts, shoulder dislocates with with a broom handle, lots of stretching (lying on the floor with arms at right angles to the body, bending the elbow up so forearm is at 90 degrees to upper arm, then trying to rotate the arm back as one, until the back of the hand, wrist, forearm is flat on the floor). My dislocations came one after the other in the space of a few months. It set me back about a year, but I was able to reach a higher standard of performance than I was capable of before my dislocations.

My point is that you have to find out what your body will and wont respond to, and ask yourself how motivated you are by a particular sport. Boxing is a big part of who I am, so I found a way to keep moving forward. If I wasn’t that arsedby boxing, I probably wouldn’t have bothered. For you, maybe you need to ask yourself what would you really liked to be involved in, and then look at how you would work with your injuries to allow yourself to compete.

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:
Well what are your goals in regards to training? Do you just enjoy the workout aspect or athleticism required for martial arts/combat sports?[/quote]

My goal(s) are self defense. Not just the workout portion of the training but actual training itself (not sure if that makes any sense.) If I just wanted to get a workout in, there are plenty of programs/workouts to accomplish a sweat dripping, heart pounding, ass whopping feeling. But thats not why I practice(d) martial arts. My main goal is self defense. One of the reasons I prefer Aikido is because of the fact that I don’t have to “throw” myself into a “fight” (again sorry for my lack of explanation), as in if someone attacks me, I’m able to throw them off balance and get the fuck out of there, the first option being not to even engage with that person, but if I’m “backed up against a wall” then to be able to get by the person without causing harm in any which way, and if the person still comes after you to be able to “pin” them down.
Long term training goals “were” to practice Aikido, Hapkido, Krav Maga, and other similar arts. I say “were” because after some time training Aikido I realized that that is all I would have time for and I’m not a MMA fighter, I just want to be able to get out of a situation if I ever end up in one. I’m not the type to go around looking or starting a fight, I’m NOT a stand up fighter, don’t ever want to square off against anyone. I can also say that my training in the martial art has calmed me down a lot.

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:
If so then Tae Kwon Do or Tang Soo Do are both very kick oriented arts and for that reason will not stress your shoulder nearly as much as a grappling or punching based art. You could also look into Bill Wallace’s material; Bill is a great example of someone who pretty much built his system around the fact that he had an injury which limited him and yet was one of the most successful full contact Karate/kick boxers in history.[/quote]

I’ve been considering kick boxing/ muay thai/ type of training, a leg/ kicking based training, since I have no training in that. Now might be a good time to get some practice with a kicking based training during my downtime with my shoulder. Just wondering what kind of a stressor each type would be on my shoulder.

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:
Pretty much every grappling art that I can think of will put a fair to a lot of pressure on the shoulders. Even arts where there are no joint locks of the shoulder per se (like folkstyle wrestling), there is still a lot of stress put on the shoulder joint.

I train with a couple guys who had torn labrums and both opted for surgery. One still has trouble with his shoulder (but is a bit older and has several decades of very rough training under his belt and admits that he probably waited too long to get the surgery) while the others shoulder has steadily been getting stronger since he got the green light from his doctor to start training (full force) again. He still says he feels it some if he does enough push-ups, but he doesn’t have any issues with it during grappling, striking, MMA, or RMA training (while the first person does and has to avoid a lot of techniques directed towards his bad shoulder).[/quote]

Thank you for this little ray of hope. I don’t have a complete tear per se, and have talked to some professionals regarding my situation. And its basically up to me. My shoulder seems to be a bit cranky at times. But I am working with a coach who specializes in shoulder care and I can say that push ups won’t be the concern to me, just being able to grapple without hurting myself.

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:
I’m not telling you to get surgery; I am not a medical professional and even if I was I wouldn’t advise people over the Internet. Just offering some anecdotal evidence that I’ve gathered from a couple of Martial Artists who have been in the same boat as you.

Good luck.[/quote]

Thank you once again was looking forward to your opinions/ words/ input

[quote]Kirks wrote:
I had a shoulder reco last year and there is no way known I would do a grappling sport.

I am trying to play reserves level local footy (aussie rules) and even basic tackling has me worried.

That being said I have been doing Muay Thai for the past 2 months (normally three classes and one or two sessions at home of shadow boxing and/or bag work) and have had zero issues (knock on wood).

Maybe I have just been scarred mentally cos I have so many issues with my shoulder (probably 30 dislocations) but I wouldn’t be brave enough to go into a heavy wrestling/grappling focused sport.

So I have found Muay Thai to be pretty good, I haven’t done any heavy sparring, but I have done some freestyle light sparring, so not just pad work and it’s been good to me.[/quote]

For starters I’ve never dislocated my shoulder, and I can understand the mental feeling of being scared, or hesitant as I like to say. I still have that feeling myself at times, I just take it as a positive, it teaches us or at least me to be cautious. I’ve been doing my share of re/pre-hab drills/exercises.
I’m glad to hear about your Muay Thai experience though.

Thank You

[quote]kmcnyc wrote:
Nice Post Sento

being clear with yourself about your goals
is a good start

Ive had a few shoulder ( and other ) injuries that did not keep me from training or competing

torn labrum - ac separation - broken collar bone - dislocated shoulders

now take that with a grain of salt
I was a D1 athlete with a very different set of priorities and a very hard head
at the time I also had many resources PT -Chiropractor - university trainer- all helping me make a strategy for recovery
and to be able to keep training

while I am far more likely to be from the tape it ice it rub some dirt on it school,
by no means am I telling you to train - or endanger your health.[/quote]

Haha, I know your from that mindset, so let me just get one thing straight did the Dr. ever clear you to be squatting, or . . . did you just feel the need for a heack weight on your back. Now I’ve just been cleared to squat, I tried it out, didn’t like it and now have a alternate for it.

[quote]kmcnyc wrote:
see what is possible see what ROM you have without compromise
see what kind of everyday shit like sleeping and posture do to your shoulder
and while I only feel these words as I get older - its ok to train to just feel good
[/quote]

My ROM and sleeping on my shoulder was a pain in the arse, a big one too, I’m sure you know.
But I’ve re-habbed quite a bit; no pain sleeping on my shoulder (just a bit cranky at times), can do various types of push ups; spiderman push ups, feet elevated push ups, crawls. etc

Thanks for stopping by and dropping a few words.

[quote]LondonBoxer123 wrote:

[quote]kmcnyc wrote:
Nice Post Sento

being clear with yourself about your goals
is a good start

Ive had a few shoulder ( and other ) injuries that did not keep me from training or competing

torn labrum - ac separation - broken collar bone - dislocated shoulders

now take that with a grain of salt
I was a D1 athlete with a very different set of priorities and a very hard head
at the time I also had many resources PT -Chiropractor - university trainer- all helping me make a strategy for recovery
and to be able to keep training

while I am far more likely to be from the tape it ice it rub some dirt on it school,
by no means am I telling you to train - or endanger your health.

see what is possible see what ROM you have without compromise
see what kind of everyday shit like sleeping and posture do to your shoulder
and while I only feel these words as I get older - its ok to train to just feel good
[/quote]

Good advice. I’ve had shoulder problems, including violent dislocations. For me, I had to get smart about my rehab, and include more weight training in my routine. I found handstand work for time made a big difference to the stability of my shoulder joint when it was extended. I also included a lot of direct shoulder isolation work, high rep raises from all angles, rotator cuff work, band pull aparts, shoulder dislocates with with a broom handle, lots of stretching (lying on the floor with arms at right angles to the body, bending the elbow up so forearm is at 90 degrees to upper arm, then trying to rotate the arm back as one, until the back of the hand, wrist, forearm is flat on the floor). My dislocations came one after the other in the space of a few months. It set me back about a year, but I was able to reach a higher standard of performance than I was capable of before my dislocations.[/quote]

Yes I definitely agree with that, I doing my share of re-hab and pre-hab exercises plus more, hence I’m working with a S&C coach from right out of T nation. I’m doing a fair share of isolation work/pre-hab so that is not a concern.

[quote]LondonBoxer123 wrote:
My point is that you have to find out what your body will and wont respond to, and ask yourself how motivated you are by a particular sport. Boxing is a big part of who I am, so I found a way to keep moving forward. If I wasn’t that arsedby boxing, I probably wouldn’t have bothered. For you, maybe you need to ask yourself what would you really liked to be involved in, and then look at how you would work with your injuries to allow yourself to compete. [/quote]

As I’ve stated earlier I definitely know what works/hurts for me and what doesn’t. I’m putting a lot resources (financial, time, energy) into coming back to my grappling. It truly is something that I like doing, and as I said the martial art has helped me become a calmer person, which sure isn’t a bad thing. Ranzo posted in another fourm about training around an injury or handicap. Which I’m 100% on board with, My only concern being not hurting myself further.

Thanks your your words and I’m glad you came back stronger.

[quote]Seachel_25 wrote:
Wing Chun may be good for you. It’s the martial art that Bruce Lee trained in.

It was developed by a Chinese nun to make martial arts practical for both men and women.

It’s a powerful art that does put stress on the shoulder but not nearly as much as aikido or judo. It focuses on soft blocks (parries) and fluidity. Basically, it avoid tensing your muscles. [/quote]

Thanks for that info, the last two lines that you wrote are basically the same thing/concept of Aikido (weird/funny).

I’ve had a well-documented run of awful luck with my shoulder - it’s dislocated a number of times, it’s always kind of weak, and I have to avoid certain movement patterns like the plague while being careful to not put it at a disadvantage leverage-wise.

And that’s every day life, not in MA’s - I mean I gotta be careful ANY time my left arm is extended all the way.

That being said, I have absolutely no problems with it boxing as long as I don’t fuck with it. I can’t throw a rear hook (I’m a southpaw) and I can’t really throw any kind of body shots except for a straight left to the body, but any other time, as long as I’m throwing straight it’s OK.

It pretty much completely keeps me out of fighting, and it limits my sparring to once in a blue moon because it’s just so unstable, but at the same time, I can keep training and I know that it’s there if I needed it in a real-life encounter.

Find what you can do, and work around the limitations. You may never compete, and it might make things a pain in the ass, but you can do it. My advice is go for some striking art that doesn’t put your arm in the awful leverage positions that grappling does.

Boxing, kickboxing, Muay Thai… all good choices. And they make you a bitch to deal with on the street :wink:

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
I’ve had a well-documented run of awful luck with my shoulder - it’s dislocated a number of times, it’s always kind of weak, and I have to avoid certain movement patterns like the plague while being careful to not put it at a disadvantage leverage-wise.

And that’s every day life, not in MA’s - I mean I gotta be careful ANY time my left arm is extended all the way.[/quote]

I guess guys like us become more cautious about our body movement and awareness of the surroundings. I can only take that as a positive and move on/keep on trekking and work with the limitations.

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
That being said, I have absolutely no problems with it boxing as long as I don’t fuck with it. I can’t throw a rear hook (I’m a southpaw) and I can’t really throw any kind of body shots except for a straight left to the body, but any other time, as long as I’m throwing straight it’s OK.

It pretty much completely keeps me out of fighting, and it limits my sparring to once in a blue moon because it’s just so unstable, but at the same time, I can keep training and I know that it’s there if I needed it in a real-life encounter.

Find what you can do, and work around the limitations. You may never compete, and it might make things a pain in the ass, but you can do it. My advice is go for some striking art that doesn’t put your arm in the awful leverage positions that grappling does.

Boxing, kickboxing, Muay Thai… all good choices. And they make you a bitch to deal with on the street ;)[/quote]

Thanks for the recommendations, been basically thinking about the same marital arts save for boxing though.

young n,

I am sorry to hear about your injury. You have already received some good responses.

For the record, I would not be comfortable in assuming that the acceleration, deceleration, jarring, and stresses that you will put your shoulder through training boxing/kickboxing are going to be easier to handle than those associated with grappling. This is especially true if the class/gym you train in has you holding pads for other students/training partners as well. It may prove to be more, less, or equally provocative. I would not even want to venture a guess without doing a full history and exam.

Of course the above comes witht the huge stipulation that I am not YOUR doctor. It sounds like your doctor is comfortable with you training, so I wouldn’t let a perceived issue prompt you to switch disciplines or not try something new. Instead, pick what you most want to do, because that will be what is worth the headache of training around injuries. If you want that to be boxing, give that a go. If you want to go back to Aikido, do so. Maybe take most of the four corners throws on the other side, but do so.

No matter which discipline you choose, be diligent with your pre-hab/re-hab. You mentioned that you have contracted a qualified coach for your lifting/training. That is excellent. If they are also handling/recommending what to do in this area, follow their advice. It is easy to brush off the pre-hab stuff because it isn’t as much fun as hard training. The issue is you can’t get better if you are in surgery.

If you are looking for a pre-hab/re-hab resource I will direct you to kmcnyc’s fantastic “Mobility for Old Farts” thread in the Over 35 section. Even if you don’t make the age cut it is well worth checking out. Don’t be one of those guys who decides they shouln’t read it/worry about it. Every instability maker you easier for the other guy to take your balance. Every injury/ache is one lest punch he has to land. Fuck all that. The whole idea is we want the other guy to be the injure one. IF he wants us hurt, THAN he needs to eat his wheaties and get it done himself. Don’t do his work for him by courting injuries.

kmcnyc’s thread:

FighinIrish’s Log(You might have already checked this out. He has a bunch of views)
http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_boxing_fighting_mma_combat/log_o_the_irish_20

Regards,

Robert A

Wanted to add,

In FighinIrish’s training log I wrote out the “High Mileage Warm Up”(just what I call it) that I do/recommend to anyone that gets to a certain experience level/age with all the bumps/bruises that go with it. If you already have a focused warm up/cool down from you coach or Physical Therapist than by all means continue with that. I am not in a position to make specific recommendations RE your specific injury. However, if you don’t have a formalized pre/post plan or struggle to get your injury management work in around your training it may be worth a read. It would be worth it to check out Irish’s thread anyway, so its in there.

I know I am really harping on the whole pre-hab/active care thing as opposed to which style, but I think that it is the more important point. Paying attention and actually doing the stuff we all know is “important” is actually important. It becomes even more key as we age, but lets keep in mind the saying “it’s not the years, it’s the miles” are realize that someone who spend there time in a dojo/gym is going to be a lot higher mileage than the typical “active” person. The time to pay attention to this stuff is before you don’t have a choice. There are stages.

STAGE I
When we are young, and you may well still be there, we are bullet proof. In fact, a bottle of whiskey and waking up next to some strange pussy seems to have more restorative power than all of Bethesda Naval Hospital. At this point we can work through damn near anything.
STAGE II
At some point, we aren’t bullet proof any more. We don’t magically heal. We actually have to deal with injuries.

Now this is still fairly easily done. A little rest, some ice, tape, analgesics, and a little bit of PT and we snap back. So, while someone at this stage does need to “do something”, they can kind of half ass their rehab/doctor’s orders and still get back into training/competition. At this stage getting piss drunk at a party doesn’t seem to impede healing to any degree. For healthcare provider’s people at this stage are a joy because they make you look awesome. Pick some kind of relevant treatment and the patient sings your praises. In this stage you are still wearing injuries like they are a badge of honor. You know you will get better.

STAGE III

The next step tends to hit at some point in the college years. Now, injuries actually have to be dealt with. PT’s, DC’s, actual treatment plans, the whole nine yards. Even worse, you may start to have actual residual effects. So, even after you are “back” you still have a “bad” knee/shoulder/thing’a ma jig. Neoprene is your friend. If you are here it is absolutely imperative that you start paying the fuck attention to rehab/pre-hab. Read kmcnyc’s thread. Follow your coach’s and PT’s advice. The goal is to stay in this general stage as long as possible.
Stage IIIa
At first an injury has to have a distinct, causative event. In other words, something happened to hurt you. You got thrown, hit, twisted…something. You can point to a moment and action and say “This is when it happened, and this is why.” Your clue that this is different than stage II is that you cannot half ass your rehab anymore or you don’t come back. Also, shit hurts. Even after you think you are better, it still hurts. Now the concepts of “pre-hab” and “re-hab” get muddy because “Who the fuck knows if I am doing these face pulls to recover from the last injury or ward off the next one. I just know I have to do them.”

This is still a perfectly serviceable place to be. You can still have a long athletic career.

Stage IIIb
This is the first really bad place. Now, you don’t have to “do something” to be injured. Normal practice/activities can sometimes do it. If you ever find yourself saying “I don’t know what I did, but_____”, “I must have twisted wrong, or something.”, or “All I did was sneeze/cough/pick up a pencil/etc.” to explain your current state of broke dickedness you are here. Instead of knowing a four corners throw or wrist lock did you in, you just know “something” did. Now normal workouts/seemingly normal stuff can lay you up. Also, you have a list of things you just shouldn’t do. The list is full of things you took for granted in stages I and II, like bench press, or squat, or run stairs, or do bridges. All of a sudden you can’t read a training program without modding it.

You can still practice martial arts in this stage and beyond. However, being a competitor is going to be an issue if you don’t find some way to get back to IIIa. This usually means getting honest to god evaluated by people who know what the hell they are doing. You have to get healthy, to be able to train like you used to. If you don’t do that you drift towards IIIc.

IIIc
I would like to describe this in terms of what you should and should no longer do, but those realizations are as much dependent on stubbornness as they are diagnosis. So instead of saying “you retire”, or “you have no choice but to _____” I will instead give you a way to know you are in full on stage IIIc danger zone.

All of a sudden viagra commercials aren’t funny any more.
Now I am not saying you see one on TV and scramble to write down the number. Or that you immediately schedule a visit with your PCP to “Ask if Viagra/Cialis/SteelCock is right for you.”, but they just aren’t funny “ha, ha”. Instead of “those poor bastards” it is more of a comforting "I’m glad that is around if I need it. Not that I would ever…"kind of deal.

If you don’t do something to arrest your slide at this point, you may well and truly hit not be able to fix things. Sliding through this stage is what takes people from “retired from competition” to “I can’t even get on the mat anymore”. Even if you find that you well and truly cannot return to full on training it is important to rehab as best you can. Lest you wind up in Stage IV.

Stage IV
Let’s just say this one is designated “Never trust a fart.” and realize we don’t want to be here.

So seriously, pay attention to pre-hab/re-hab and the advice of the people you have paid to give you good advice. And pick an activity that you like/love enough to keep you coming back to it. Because if we live long enough we all walk through some of the stages. If we choose wisely, it might seem worth it.

Regards,

Robert A

i can t multi quote from an ipad- so this is easier

youngun as for being cleared for training- all rolling is out.
I went to a new chiro a few years maybe two? he is former D1 football , track and field type threw the hammer.
he trains and had me spell out exactly what I do.
after some evauation and some treatments- he basically said.

I know you are going to train and be stupid- so GO squat , clean and pull.
go as hard as possible - until its an issue. but the rest of the week go dick around in the gym

he also gave me a regemen of a shit ton of activation mobility and straight out rehab to do daily.
I also take a massive amount of things like MSM glucosimine fish oil, some other joint shit
and do a TON of lx ball work every day.

train until shit doesnt work

Robert A thank you for the props.
I will admit that its a shitty feeling - worse then getting hurt- when shit just starts to not fire properly.
worst is usually your opponent can tell before you can
first you are tricked that its a position thing- or the other person is just faster
then in post analysis - you realise that you are just slowing down

[quote]kmcnyc wrote:
Robert A thank you for the props.
[/quote]
Your thread should be required reading.

Honestly, it is the kind of thing that can save careers if done soon enough.

I managed to get myself close enough that I could see IIIc coming. In fact the whole viagra thing was a line stolen from one of my friends/colleagues. It was more along the lines of “Pretty soon those viagra commercials aren’t going to seem so fucking funny smart guy.” I largely managed to reverse course, so it can be done to a degree.

RE slowing down

I was never at the level you lived on.

For me improvements in technique or tactics could/can patch a lot of physical limitations. Getting into teaching early on my focus was often on getting a beginner up to minimal competency the fastest, or how to get individuals with limited time/background to develop and maintain useable skills. Simply sticking around and learning more tricks seems to help in that venue.

Operating against a younger/faster/less busted up opponent who also has equal skill and at least as much desire to “win” is a hell I don’t really envy you for facing.

Regards,

Robert A

[quote]kmcnyc wrote:

I know you are going to train and be stupid- so GO squat , clean and pull.
go as hard as possible - until its an issue. but the rest of the week go dick around in the gym

he also gave me a regemen of a shit ton of activation mobility and straight out rehab to do daily.
I also take a massive amount of things like MSM glucosimine fish oil, some other joint shit
and do a TON of lx ball work every day.

train until shit doesnt work

[/quote]

Thanks for chiming back,
I’m also on a steady diet of “warm up” drills, I say warm up because the mobility, activation, re/pre-hab drills are all included in my warm up routine. And this “warm up” is done daily. Also I’m right there with you on all those joint supplementation.
Only difference is I’m not cleaning or snatching, though I am pulling (deadlift variations.)

Once again thanks for the insight.

Thanks a bunch Robert A.