I’m not attacking you whatsoever. I am merely showing you that the preconceived notions people have about gear are often off base with reality. I’m glad to hear you support the sport.
BTW, where does your husband lift? Numbers? I am seriously impressed.
Feel free to search for him, his login is “biggjames”. We live in Montana, so he hasn’t had the opportunity to go to many large meets lately…he most recently has competed in WABDL and USAPL…but he’s going back to strongman and getting out of powerlifting after doing it for over 20 years now…he started lifting in his early teens…which is why I can really see the benefit of starting at an early age.
Anyway, the last meet, which was his last meet for good, he benched 500, squated 675 and deadlifted 655…with nothing more than a belt and wrist/knee wraps. So, no, he is not the best lifter out there…and these are not his best lifetime lifts, but for sticking with the sport for as long as he has, and not relying on the gear, he has done damn well.
Anyway, he’ll probably be irritated that I brought up his name, he’s a very humble person…unlike myself who can often be bitchy.
My other 2 cents: If someone can outbench you in a shirt and can’t do it raw then they can’t outbench you, bottom line. Basically that means if you need assistance to outbench me then you can’t outbench me. Lets call it what it is assisted lifting.
Another retarded thread… Great.
Try this next time you’re in the gym. Get on the bench, work up to a 1RM on 3 boards. See how much heavier this weight feels…? And how hard it is to support it…? Now imagine having trying to support even more weight than that. That’s what equipped guys have to do.
It takes balls to lift off a weight you know could easily crush you. I think alot of people are afraid of this.
I don’t see any equipped lifters ranting on about raw guys. It’s always the other way around. It’s actually funny how the majority of people who start and add to these threads have never competed and don’t even understand what it’s about. (btw, you’re not asking questions to learn if you’ve already made up your mind on what you think)
Look at Mendy. Biggest raw and equipped bench. I don’t think anything else needs to be said.
[quote]halfpintdd wrote:
but for sticking with the sport for as long as he has, and not relying on the gear, he has done damn well.
[/quote]
woah woah WOAH. What the fuck makes you think people “rely” on gear?
Are you saying they don’t train as hard as all the raw die hards?
Are you saying their accomplishments aren’t as worthy?
This is another bullshit argument.
[quote]Hanley wrote:
halfpintdd wrote:
but for sticking with the sport for as long as he has, and not relying on the gear, he has done damn well.
woah woah WOAH. What the fuck makes you think people “rely” on gear?
Are you saying they don’t train as hard as all the raw die hards?
Are you saying their accomplishments aren’t as worthy?
This is another bullshit argument.[/quote]
She is not saying any of the above and why is it a bullshit argument? I went to a meet last year and a guy missed 345 in the warmup room then threw on his shirt and got 455 in the meet. Meanwhile I benched 405 raw in that meet. Is he stronger than me or can he just lift more than me with outside assistance. My point is without the assistance he can’t out bench me.
Everytime somebody brings this argument to the table, everybody gets all hot and bothered. She as well as I and others probably think it is kind of ridiculous that someone can’t get 700+ pounds to touch their chest yet they claim to bench 800 usually without acknowledging the assisstance. You have your way and we have ours and if we think your way is ridiculous then so be it. That is why I will always choose to compete againist lifters lifting the weight and not assistance.
P.S. Nobody questions how hard you work, your character, or anything like that. What the raw lifter questions is your actual strength compared to assisted strength.
Let me ask you a question…??
Was the meet a raw meet…??
If it wasn’t then he out benched you. I’m not saying he’s a stronger raw bencher than you tho.
And yes, that is a bit contradictory.
[quote]jumper wrote:
She is not saying any of the above and why is it a bullshit argument? I went to a meet last year and a guy missed 345 in the warmup room then threw on his shirt and got 455 in the meet. Meanwhile I benched 405 raw in that meet. Is he stronger than me or can he just lift more than me with outside assistance. My point is without the assistance he can’t out bench me.
Everytime somebody brings this argument to the table, everybody gets all hot and bothered. She as well as I and others probably think it is kind of ridiculous that someone can’t get 700+ pounds to touch their chest yet they claim to bench 800 usually without acknowledging the assisstance. You have your way and we have ours and if we think your way is ridiculous then so be it. That is why I will always choose to compete againist lifters lifting the weight and not assistance.
P.S. Nobody questions how hard you work, your character, or anything like that. What the raw lifter questions is your actual strength compared to assisted strength. [/quote]
Well, the guy did get more than you in the meet, and you both played by the same rules, so he deserved to place higher than you in that competition.
If you don’t want to wear a shirt, compete in meets that don’t allow them.
If you want to compete to win, and the competition allows shirts, you should use and try to get the most out of the best shirt you are allowed to use for that meet. Otherwise you’re only hurting your own chances for winning the competition.
It would be like showing up to the Tour De France with a bike bought from Walmart, and calling out Lance for using his suped-up bike.
I think people miss the concept here. just b/c you lift with “gear” doesn’t mean that you don’t have to work near as hard. Those guys that get the most out of there shirts work there shirts very often much like you jumper work your raw bench. you can’t just throw on a bench shirt the first time and add a 100lbs to your bench, sorry just wont happen.
Also this has already been stated if the federation or meet always shirts and you choose not to wear one, and you get beat who are you blaming? according to the rules you competed on a level playing field, it wasn’t like the opportunity was granted to a certain few right? So when I play in a football game and choose not to wear spikes and the guy that did, cuts right past me, its his fault b/c he was “geared” and I wanted to play raw.
[quote]lb4lb wrote:
I think people miss the concept here. just b/c you lift with “gear” doesn’t mean that you don’t have to work near as hard. Those guys that get the most out of there shirts work there shirts very often much like you jumper work your raw bench. you can’t just throw on a bench shirt the first time and add a 100lbs to your bench, sorry just wont happen.
Also this has already been stated if the federation or meet always shirts and you choose not to wear one, and you get beat who are you blaming? according to the rules you competed on a level playing field, it wasn’t like the opportunity was granted to a certain few right? So when I play in a football game and choose not to wear spikes and the guy that did, cuts right past me, its his fault b/c he was “geared” and I wanted to play raw. [/quote]
Actually I think people understand the concept quite well. Folks competing with bench shirts and squat suits are benching with mechanical assistance.
Supposedly power lifting is about how strong you are not how strong you can be with mechanical assistance. I just recently found out about the power lifting club here at school. But after discovering they use gear I have absolutely no interest in competing.
Ive watched some kid that could only press 285 raw put on one of those damn shirts and exceed my personal max. That kid isnt more powerful than I am. Only him plus his mechanical assistance, his shirt, is more powerful than I am. And this is allowed in a “power lifting” competition". Thats freakin ridiculous. Gonna take a huge pass on that.
People come on here that use “stupid powerlifting equipment” and say ohhh you don’t have a clue what you are chatting about, go use a suit yourself, bla bla bla.
Then you have people like me who say “suits are for pussies” bla bla bla.
In actual fact suits increase your lifts artificially. They give a false sense of strength that humans can’t achieve. The sport of “Powerlifting” i believe allows for stupid suits to increase ones lift. Hence why the real weight lifters call it’ the fake lifts.
Forget the sport of “Powerlifting” and go lift some weights or maybe even take up the sport of weightlifting.
People that don’t use powerlifting equipment will never understand it. They don’t actually care, it’s stupid. Why would someone want to live in dreamland. We should all use equipment because we are all missing out on the benefits of dreamland.
THAT SPORT OF “POWERLIFTING” RULES
I love powerlifting. Ohh wait powerlifting doesn’t measure power, it meausures exercise strength :)supposedly.
[quote]Hanley wrote:
Another retarded thread… Great.
Try this next time you’re in the gym. Get on the bench, work up to a 1RM on 3 boards. See how much heavier this weight feels…? And how hard it is to support it…? Now imagine having trying to support even more weight than that. That’s what equipped guys have to do.
It takes balls to lift off a weight you know could easily crush you. I think alot of people are afraid of this.
I don’t see any equipped lifters ranting on about raw guys. It’s always the other way around. It’s actually funny how the majority of people who start and add to these threads have never competed and don’t even understand what it’s about. (btw, you’re not asking questions to learn if you’ve already made up your mind on what you think)
Look at Mendy. Biggest raw and equipped bench. I don’t think anything else needs to be said.[/quote]
Your the only irish person who stands up for equiped powerlifting. Shame on you.
If you are against mechanical assistance, you need to cut out:
belts
wrist wraps
knee wraps
wrist straps
knee sleeves
elbow sleeves
These are all designed to help the person lift more weight safely. And do not say they are used for protection only- if a person wanted to have RAW protection, they would increase forearm/wrist size for wrist straps. They would increase tendon strenght in their knees to replace knee wraps. They would get a stronger core to replace belts.
[quote]Hanley wrote:
It takes balls to lift off a weight you know could easily crush you. I think alot of people are afraid of this.
[/quote]
No, I think it’s a lack of intelligence actually. If you can not physically lift the weight without gear, than why would you want to put yourself in that danger…what happens when the shirt rips?..you said it…it will crush you… and f*** your ass up. So be my guest, use the gear.
But honestly, your profile says you’ve only been lifting for two years, so how much do you really know??? You talk like you’re an expert. At least I admit that I’m a beginner, even though I do know quite about competitions.
Thanks for the posts superscience and adubswils…actually personal experience rather than deffensiveness.
Anyway, I’m done with this thread now. No more pissing matches for me.
jesus christ another one of these threads. I support Hanley on this. Personally I am not sure why you started this thread from what I see you are just looking to pick a fight with people using gear, trying to prove they’re wrong and you’re right.
Basically I have this to say bench shirts aren’t cheating
there is a lot of federations that allow them
they require good amount of work, time, dedication, technique and so fourth (I see that when first training with bench shirt it is like learning how to lift weights all over again the more you improve your technique upperbound strength and so fourth the more weight you will lift in time)
you need to have a respective amount of raw strength and very strong triceps if can bench 300 and only lock out 325 you won’t bench that good in a shirt.
Look at Mike Wolfe, Mendy, and even Kennelly all great shirted benchers with high raw benches too.
please find somewhere else to bitch about this I am tired of subject along with many others
You are fucking retarted. Connective tissue increases and strength and gets bigger through work just like muscles. Obviously in different ways, but an increase in size and strength nonetheless. This is fucking science.
As a side anectdote, Paul Anderson’s hamstring tendon was supposedly as thick as a telephone chord from that era- he sure as fuck wasn’t born with it and he sure as hell wouldn’t have gotten it from sitting behind a desk.
Ok. You guys win- you have managed to piss off the gear lifters. But you know what- we can still lift more than you raw or equipped!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Suckers.
After I reread my post and your post, I realize I overreacted. You asked a simple question and I went off. Sorry, its been a long day and these type of debates piss me off. I guess this is the point of it all.
I like the Lance Armstrong analogy. I don’t understand about all the hate towards powerlifters who use gear…if you don’t like it…don’t compete or compete in RAW federations.
These threads always remind me of people who are gung-ho on rugby bashing football players because they wear a helmet and shoulder pads.
[quote]dead_lifter5000 wrote:
If you are against mechanical assistance, you need to cut out:
belts
wrist wraps
knee wraps
wrist straps
knee sleeves
elbow sleeves
These are all designed to help the person lift more weight safely. And do not say they are used for protection only- if a person wanted to have RAW protection, they would increase forearm/wrist size for wrist straps. They would increase tendon strenght in their knees to replace knee wraps. They would get a stronger core to replace belts. [/quote]
Ive never used any of those devices other than wrist straps. But here is the thing. I would never claim, for instance, that the weight I deadlifted while using wrist straps was my 1RM deadlift weight.
I wouldnt even want someone writing that crap down and calling it a record of mine. That would be silly. And anyone in their right mind would understand that my lift is different from my assisted lift with wrist straps. You can claim all the fancy numbers you want. If its a geared lift then the number does not reflect your power.
The federations have introduced a variable that doesnt need to be there in the competition. Who had the highest total? Was it really the guy who won? Or did he win because of the gear he was wearing that day? Why would you even want questions like that to be a part of such a pure sport?