I was just wondering on everyone’s views on being young and being conservative in this day and age. What I mean by this is that almost everyone my age is either liberal or just doesn’t think about politics at all. This is made worse here in the U.K as so many people here have been brought up on benefits, any talk of taking away these benefits brings talk of elitism and the like.
This is made worse by almost every popular website is ridiculously liberal, e.g.anti-gun pro-benefits and i finds it hard to talk rationally to people your age without your opposing politics coming up? I just wanted to see if anyone else has experienced the same problems.
I think the main issue is the definition of conservative. I see it as being being fiscally prudent. But most see it as Jesus is lord and telling other people how to act
I’m young and my political views waver wildly between parties dependent on the subject at hand and it’s individual merits, but I tend to follow a more liberal outlook on most subjects. To disclaim, this is not to say I label myself liberal, nor conservative for that matter. I think, for the U.K. in particular, the rising concept of modern liberalism comes in the increasing disconnect from religion. I know the U.S. is strongly tied to their religious beliefs and how it guides their political views, but the U.K. as a general populace do not hold these popular Western-focused (probably the wrong description, but I’m sure the underlying idea is there) religions to the same pedestal. This has opened us up to a more progressive outlook in that we don’t have to stick permanently to an age-old preconceived guidebook, and we don’t have to give the same thought to traditional taboos. Now this is experiential conjecture, and maybe 5% of the reason, if that, but still worth a thought.
As much as I’m going to regret this paragraph, because I’m woefully ignorant when it comes to economics, I’d argue that another is the youth populace lack of faith in a purely capitalist system. I appreciate the idea, and before anybody pounces on me I’m not a devout socialist, but it’s too easily manipulable for those already in a position of power to maintain their power and crush the rise of newer, contrarian up and comers because of our behavioural flaws. Not to mention the loopholes (insider trading, bribing etc.). Capitalism’s major flaw for me is it’s primary ambition to draw in financial profit at the risk of other important ventures, morality, consumer and worker satisfaction, innovation etc. It’s not the worst we could do, but nor is it the best, it’s an adolescent economic structure.
Now it may seem I’m not appreciative of capitalism or religion, and I’m not, but it’s not impossible that there are some conservative viewpoints on certain issues I’m likely inclined to agree with. I don’t know what they could be, at least predominantly U.S. conservative issues, but I’m sure they are there all the same.
I leave myself open to criticism, I’m sure my argument could be considered vague and flawed, but I aim to expand on my individual views concerning certain positions as the thread progresses, debate is welcomed.
Outside of the anglo-american sphere liberalism and conservativism is basickly the same AKA they champion privatisation, de-regulation, participation in wars. What is called liberalism in England and America is what we outside of that sphere call social-liberalism. Basickly an ideology in the centre with moderate conservatives/liberalists to their right and socialdemocrats to their left. On some issues they are closer to socialdemocrats, but on other they are closer to conservatives/liberalists. I growned to understand that social-liberalism when used within the anglo-american sphere is about value issues like religion, abortion, gay-marriage etc and not economical issues. I am myself a democratic socialist( not socialdemocrat ) and think most conservative/liberalist partys are propped up by the bussines class and act in their benefit. As an working class guy I have no self interrest in voting for them + I dont share the conservative ideal. Also most of the young conservatives/liberalists I have know personally have come from middleclass homes.
@Pittbull.
In Norway we make it simple: Liberalist-conservatives( aka pro-market-captitalist conservatives ) are called conservatives and the religious guys are called christian-conservatives. The christian-conservative party in Norway are centrist in economical questions BTW.
@Kuhuna I think the people that claim our Government was supposed to cater to capitalism are misguided . I am not a died in the wool socialist either but I think when dealing with health care specifically profit is what is over cost and health care should be as inexpensive as possible . I don’t buy that free enterprise can do all things better than Government
[quote]florelius wrote:
Outside of the anglo-american sphere liberalism and conservativism is basickly the same AKA they champion privatisation, de-regulation, participation in wars. What is called liberalism in England and America is what we outside of that sphere call social-liberalism. Basickly an ideology in the centre with moderate conservatives/liberalists to their right and socialdemocrats to their left. On some issues they are closer to socialdemocrats, but on other they are closer to conservatives/liberalists. I growned to understand that social-liberalism when used within the anglo-american sphere is about value issues like religion, abortion, gay-marriage etc and not economical issues. I am myself a democratic socialist( not socialdemocrat ) and think most conservative/liberalist partys are propped up by the bussines class and act in their benefit. As an working class guy I have no self interrest in voting for them + I dont share the conservative ideal. Also most of the young conservatives/liberalists I have know personally have come from middleclass homes.
@Pittbull.
In Norway we make it simple: Liberalist-conservatives( aka pro-market-captitalist conservatives ) are called conservatives and the religious guys are called christian-conservatives. The christian-conservative party in Norway are centrist in economical questions BTW.
[/quote]
It is not hard for me to understand that you could be a Christian and a Raging Liberal. The Jesus I read about was truly liberal Feed the poor , heal the sick all without a drug test
[quote]florelius wrote:
Outside of the anglo-american sphere liberalism and conservativism is basickly the same AKA they champion privatisation, de-regulation, participation in wars. What is called liberalism in England and America is what we outside of that sphere call social-liberalism. Basickly an ideology in the centre with moderate conservatives/liberalists to their right and socialdemocrats to their left. On some issues they are closer to socialdemocrats, but on other they are closer to conservatives/liberalists. I growned to understand that social-liberalism when used within the anglo-american sphere is about value issues like religion, abortion, gay-marriage etc and not economical issues. I am myself a democratic socialist( not socialdemocrat ) and think most conservative/liberalist partys are propped up by the bussines class and act in their benefit. As an working class guy I have no self interrest in voting for them + I dont share the conservative ideal. Also most of the young conservatives/liberalists I have know personally have come from middleclass homes.
@Pittbull.
In Norway we make it simple: Liberalist-conservatives( aka pro-market-captitalist conservatives ) are called conservatives and the religious guys are called christian-conservatives. The christian-conservative party in Norway are centrist in economical questions BTW.
[/quote]
It is not hard for me to understand that you could be a Christian and a Raging Liberal. The Jesus I read about was truly liberal Feed the poor , heal the sick all without a drug test
[/quote]
Jesus wasn’t a liberal or a conservative. I’d explain why, but I’m not sure you’d listen.
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
but I think when dealing with health care specifically profit is what is over cost and health care should be as inexpensive as possible . I don’t buy that free enterprise can do all things better than Government [/quote]
I agree, the cost is basickly the same and the simplest solution is for government to run it, but in an American context I understand why people dont want the federal government to handle it. Its more suited for local governments. I for one would never want the Europeen union to handle the norwegian health care system.
[quote]florelius wrote:
Outside of the anglo-american sphere liberalism and conservativism is basickly the same AKA they champion privatisation, de-regulation, participation in wars. What is called liberalism in England and America is what we outside of that sphere call social-liberalism. Basickly an ideology in the centre with moderate conservatives/liberalists to their right and socialdemocrats to their left. On some issues they are closer to socialdemocrats, but on other they are closer to conservatives/liberalists. I growned to understand that social-liberalism when used within the anglo-american sphere is about value issues like religion, abortion, gay-marriage etc and not economical issues. I am myself a democratic socialist( not socialdemocrat ) and think most conservative/liberalist partys are propped up by the bussines class and act in their benefit. As an working class guy I have no self interrest in voting for them + I dont share the conservative ideal. Also most of the young conservatives/liberalists I have know personally have come from middleclass homes.
@Pittbull.
In Norway we make it simple: Liberalist-conservatives( aka pro-market-captitalist conservatives ) are called conservatives and the religious guys are called christian-conservatives. The christian-conservative party in Norway are centrist in economical questions BTW.
[/quote]
It is not hard for me to understand that you could be a Christian and a Raging Liberal. The Jesus I read about was truly liberal Feed the poor , heal the sick all without a drug test
[/quote]
Jesus wasn’t a liberal or a conservative. I’d explain why, but I’m not sure you’d listen.[/quote]
Offcourse he wasnt, Liberalism( both conservativism and social-liberalism ) didnt exist 30 years A.D.
[quote]pittbulll wrote: @Kahuna I think the people that claim our Government was supposed to cater to capitalism are misguided . I am not a died in the wool socialist either but I think when dealing with health care specifically profit is what is over cost and health care should be as inexpensive as possible . I don’t buy that free enterprise can do all things better than Government [/quote]
I can’t make any particular claims on the American healthcare system, largely because I’m not American and I know little of it, my knowledge is more tied in to the British healthcare system and the tax-funded, publicly available NHS style service we have. I may be misunderstanding as to the extent of your opinions here (and please correct me if I’m wrong), but I agree with you on a grander availability of healthcare, that (at least base level) health service should be freely available as a basic human right and not as something that is to be earned, and even then to not be outrageously inflated, especially given the disadvantages some people struggle to overcome in our modern societal machines. I also think government intervention is necessary in certain aspects of our culture and the issues we seem to be facing at present, healthcare obviously being one of them.
When it comes to the U.S., I will admit that sometimes I find myself confused between the model nature of a “conservative” as opposed to that of a “republican”. I maintain that I hold some ignorant prejudices, not wilfully, but I still attempt to understand American conservatism beyond the arrogance and obnoxiousness of a mainstream republican perspective. My misunderstandings may largely stem from that, as much as I hope they would not.
[quote]florelius wrote:
Outside of the anglo-american sphere liberalism and conservativism is basickly the same AKA they champion privatisation, de-regulation, participation in wars. What is called liberalism in England and America is what we outside of that sphere call social-liberalism. Basickly an ideology in the centre with moderate conservatives/liberalists to their right and socialdemocrats to their left. On some issues they are closer to socialdemocrats, but on other they are closer to conservatives/liberalists. I growned to understand that social-liberalism when used within the anglo-american sphere is about value issues like religion, abortion, gay-marriage etc and not economical issues. I am myself a democratic socialist( not socialdemocrat ) and think most conservative/liberalist partys are propped up by the bussines class and act in their benefit. As an working class guy I have no self interrest in voting for them + I dont share the conservative ideal. Also most of the young conservatives/liberalists I have know personally have come from middleclass homes.
@Pittbull.
In Norway we make it simple: Liberalist-conservatives( aka pro-market-captitalist conservatives ) are called conservatives and the religious guys are called christian-conservatives. The christian-conservative party in Norway are centrist in economical questions BTW.
[/quote]
It is not hard for me to understand that you could be a Christian and a Raging Liberal. The Jesus I read about was truly liberal Feed the poor , heal the sick all without a drug test
[/quote]
Jesus wasn’t a liberal or a conservative. I’d explain why, but I’m not sure you’d listen.[/quote]
Offcourse he wasnt, Liberalism( both conservativism and social-liberalism ) didnt exist 30 years A.D.
[/quote]
Christ’s attitudes were liberal , sorry . A true Altruist
[quote]Loolu wrote:
I was just wondering on everyone’s views on being young and being conservative in this day and age. What I mean by this is that almost everyone my age is either liberal or just doesn’t think about politics at all. This is made worse here in the U.K as so many people here have been brought up on benefits, any talk of taking away these benefits brings talk of elitism and the like.
This is made worse by almost every popular website is ridiculously liberal, e.g.anti-gun pro-benefits and i finds it hard to talk rationally to people your age without your opposing politics coming up? I just wanted to see if anyone else has experienced the same problems. [/quote]
What you are politically is of no significance. You can vote, but really I don’t think it makes a bit of difference, the best way to impact political change is with how you spend your money, and where you spend it.
[quote]Loolu wrote:
I was just wondering on everyone’s views on being young and being conservative in this day and age. What I mean by this is that almost everyone my age is either liberal or just doesn’t think about politics at all. This is made worse here in the U.K as so many people here have been brought up on benefits, any talk of taking away these benefits brings talk of elitism and the like.
This is made worse by almost every popular website is ridiculously liberal, e.g.anti-gun pro-benefits and i finds it hard to talk rationally to people your age without your opposing politics coming up? I just wanted to see if anyone else has experienced the same problems. [/quote]
What you are politically is of no significance. You can vote, but really I don’t think it makes a bit of difference, the best way to impact political change is with how you spend your money, and where you spend it.
I agree, the cost is basickly the same and the simplest solution is for government to run it, but in an American context I understand why people dont want the federal government to handle it. Its more suited for local governments. I for one would never want the Europeen union to handle the norwegian health care system.
[/quote]
This is a great way to put how people see fed. Healthcare here. I have fundamental problems with the idea that you don’t, but this is perhaps one of the greatest concise ways to frame the difficulties for some of my Continental friends, which they can relate to.
I agree, the cost is basickly the same and the simplest solution is for government to run it, but in an American context I understand why people dont want the federal government to handle it. Its more suited for local governments. I for one would never want the Europeen union to handle the norwegian health care system.
[/quote]
This is a great way to put how people see fed. Healthcare here. I have fundamental problems with the idea that you don’t, but this is perhaps one of the greatest concise ways to frame the difficulties for some of my Continental friends, which they can relate to.[/quote]
I am sorry, but I dont understand: “I have fundamental problems with the idea that you don’t”, what is “I don’t” refering to?
Feed the poor , heal the sick all without a drug test