T Nation

Been Considering a Cycle for a While

Pharma
#1

Age -38
Years lifting - 5 seriously
Body fat - 18 ish
Diet - Mostly on point against some odds
Other medication - Welbutrin - Depression, Pregabalin - Nerve damage
Height - 5’8
Weight - 86kg
Goals - Lean and dry muscular stature Like 86kg @ 12 %

Hi, so I’m considering a cycle and have been for a couple of years. I’m on other meds though as mentioned and I wondered if anyone had advice around whether I could do a light cycle whilst on them.

I have to work really hard at controlling my weight because of the pregabalin. I’ve no idea of the exact mechanism of action or why but for some people they just balloon on it.

I’ve been stable on both meds for a good few years fwiw.

Test prop most appeals and I was thinking something light and short. 75mg ED or there abouts for 6 weeks.

Thanks in advance

#2

Height? Weight? Goals?

Any particular reason why you’d wanna pin prop every day rather than E only twice a week? Why only 6 weeks?

1 Like
#3

Hi, thanks for the reply. I’ve edited the original post.

Re prop I feel like the steady nature of every day and consistent levels will be safer for me given my depression. I’d have concerns about the test e causing periods of low mood.

Further more I really wanted a short cycle of 6 weeks, max 8 and my understanding is prop is the way to go on that front.

#4

Such a short cycle is really only meant for certain situations. Yours is not one of them. For anecdotal purposes only, I stopped taking my SSRI after four months of trt because my depression was gone (after 17 years of being treated). I did so on test e pinned twice a week. Now your brain is different than mine and I’m not saying your results will be the same, but if you want to obtain those goals you laid out then prop for six weeks isn’t going to get you there.

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#5

Thanks for the reply.

That’s fair enough. I’m more than willing to listen here. Okay so I drop prop and go for e or I do a small amount of prop as well to keep levels smooth?

What would you suggest for my situation?

#6

Hi guys, sorry for the bump but I’m keen to know how to proceed.

Doesn’t prop also have the fewest sides? I ask because I suffer awful water retention on the pregab so adding further didn’t appeal.

Are we 100% that

6 (willing to go 8) weeks 75mg test prop ed
25-.5mg adex alternate days
40/40/20/20 nolva 3 days after last jab

Is a bad way to go for a first cycle?

If so could some one point me in the right direction? I really appreciate the help.

Cheers

#7

Yes. If it’s all you can do then you should wait until you can do something a little better. So many guys try to reinvent the wheel. The wheel is great! It works!

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#8

That’s absolutely fair and thank you for the advice. I’m happy to listen but everywhere I look “the wheel” is different.

I cannot seem to find a simple low dose recommended cycle thats consistent.

What is the wheel? Educate me, I want to learn .

#9

Quote

#10

im no dr. but its not a shot in the dark that your depression may stem from low testosterone. Its very much worth getting a hormone/blood panel done before starting so you know baseline and you can make an educated decision from there. Just my two cents .

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#11

Well low dose cycles aren’t always great. You get all the issues of a cycle—specifically the need for pct—without getting the outsized benefits of running heftier doses. Your original layout comes out to 525mg/w, which is right in range of the suggested standard first cycle of test e or c at 500/w. So you’re close enough with the dose. But the reality is that you need the rewards to outweigh the risks. So 500/w for 10-12 weeks is pretty well tolerated in most guys and the gains are great if you eat and train properly. That’s the wheel.

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#12

im no dr. but its not a shot in the dark that your depression may stem from low testosterone. Its very much worth getting a hormone/blood panel done before starting so you know baseline and you can make an educated decision from there. Just my two cents .

Yeah, I’ve considered that. I had some preliminary bloods done back in January but not a full hormone panel which I absolutely will get before starting.

Serum TSH level (XaELV) 1.3 miu/L [0.2 - 5.5]

Serum testosterone level (XE2dr) 24 nmol/L [8 - 31] - Age related adult testosterone reference ranges given

Surprise that my thyroid is quite decent but my actual test level here seemed good. However I understand that can give a slanted view as it’s not the full picture?

Thanks for the reply.

#13

That’s conflicting to a lot I’ve read. This has been the difficulty so much misinformation and bro science.

Seems a lot more straight here though so I’ll go with it. 500mg of test e a week sounds high for some reason but I guess with prop I’d have been going even higher due to its nature in the body.

So as a checklist

Get full hormone panel done
Test 500mg in 2 (?) shots a week for 12 weeks (total needed 6000mg)
Adex on hand begin dosing at 0.5mg if sides appear.
Nolva for pct at 40/40/20/20
Bloods done monthly to make sure all is well

That’s the wheel then?

Thanks for your help, I really do value it.

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#14

Everything he is telling you is good advice . Here the thing with bro science. A lot of it is good information and works well. Bros arent big because it didnt work (doesn’t always mean its the safest or best way tho)

Now once you have all the information thatbis where you have to use your research and make an educated decision.

Yes that is the basic wheel. Altho IMO id start the adex at 0.25 and dont let a lil bloat or itchy nips lead you into adex use

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#15

K.I.S.S.

Weeks 1 - 10: 500mg Test E / week (2 x 250mg pins)
Weeks 11 - 12: nothing
Weeks 13 - 14: 40mg Nolvadex / day
Weeks 15 - 16: 20mg Nolvadex / day

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#16

Thanks so much guys. I’ll use that template. So I only adex if I display symptoms?

I think I have high estrogen naturally cos I have some tits and I bloat really easily.

I’ll roll with it and report back. Legends