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Balancing Working Out with Judo

Hey everyone,

I have been doing Judo the last couple of months since February. My only other martial arts experience has been about 1.5 years off BJJ, 8 months Muay Thai, and 3 years wrestling.

I have searched on this site, but my situation is a little more unique and more of a scheduling/programming conflict, but I apologize in advance for missing a similar topic…

I realize the typical response to get better at Judo is to do Judo and of course this is valid, however my gym is Graccie Barra and only offers Judo twice a week to supplement standup game for competition. There’s certainly a spillover effect between BJJ and Judo, I just don’t feel interested in BJJ anymore unfortunately.

The Judo class is offered Monday 6:15-7:15, and Thursdays from 7:30-8:45 (PM). I was doing Westside in the morning Monday, Tuesday and Thursday Friday but because of long work commute and only being able to let a certain amount of food digest before working out at 6AM I have opted to go back to working out after work which obviously puts me in conflict with some of these class slots.

I’m fortunate to workout at a pretty legit gym that has Strongman, Powerlifting (a variety of bars, bands, and chains), and Olympic plates. I don’t feel like a traditional bodybuilding split will benefit me much and I wanted to stick to these more functional disciplines.

In addition to conditioning, it seems like a Judo competitor can be benefit from the explosiveness from power and Olympic lifting. Powerlifting because of the strength-speed benefits and the spillover of muscular endurance as absolute strength increases. Olympic Lifting benefiting the speed-strength but also the improved coordination. Strongman probably has less benefits but I see the improved core strength helping balance in addition to strengthening the grip. In addition this variety training helps not to burn out.

While I realize I am not going to become medal in Judo, Olympic Lifting, and win Strongman competitions and Powerlifting meets, I think you can make slow gains in all. Furthermore, several Judo competitors have recommended the strength guidelines for the big lifts (overhead press, bench, squat, deadlift, and powerclean), based on bodyweight outlined in “Starting Strength” by Rippletoe and Kilgore as goals to work toward.

http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/StrengthStandards.htm

I can’t figure out the balancing act here. I could feasibly workout on Thursday before class although I am sure this not ideal and will pre-fatigue the muscles. I have looked at Westside for Skinny Bastards but don’t they don’t seem to incorporate Olympic Lifts which I am somewhat proficient at. Sundays are off limits because both gyms are closed and it’s the only off day my wife and I both have together. Also having drill one weekend a month puts Saturday in Jeopardy. Since I have heard that Strongman routines are better performed in the same setting I was planning on doing those on the 3 Saturdays a month I don’t have drill.

My biggest concerns are the need to have an off day while doing a full body routine, for instance if I did say Clean and Jerks with Front squats one day, and did snatches with back squats the very next would I be over fatiguing the CNS?

Thanks for any help in advance.

Judo is a specific set of skills, as is all other sports. So lifting is a great way to supplement your judo, but if you’re seeking to improve on judo, do more of that, as you’ve already mentioned yourself. Find a judo gym, or take more BJJ and work your grips and leveraging. Or if you just like the stand up, join up rec wrestling programs.

Your biggest concern should be doing too much too soon.

Thanks for the help. Like I said I can only get in Judo class twice a week. I believe I’m going to start doing some BJJ on Saturdays with a Purple belt I know. There won’t be a lot of carry over but the conditioning between rendori and rolling should help.

On the Monday when I have class at 615, if I were to do some Olympic Lifts beforehand, would this be okay? I realize this isn’t ideal, but I was thinking something like 5X3 with the Snatch, and then some of the derivative lifts like Overhead squat, Snatch Grip High Pulls, etc.

Just practice the lifts and don’t go heavy?

Like magick said if you go light you should be good.

Doing some explosive oly lifts would be an awesommme way to fire up your CNS before heading into judo.

Thanks I am going to try doing some snatch work this afternoon before class and see how it goes. I appreciate everyone’s advice.

skillwork
conditioning
strenf training

some one here has mentioned that plenty.

basically- Id keep going til one element of training impacts the other.
or til any of these activities impacts your recovery.

as a sort of rule- particularly for combat types- you can do quite well with a less is more

if judo is monday and thursdays, then i would do weights on sunday, wed, and friday, and run on tuesdays, and take saturday off.

or i would do weights on tuesday, wed, friday, and run on saturday and take sunday off.

thats just what I would do though, don’t know if thats best or not.

[quote]zenontheterrible wrote:
if judo is monday and thursdays, then i would do weights on sunday, wed, and friday, and run on tuesdays, and take saturday off.

or i would do weights on tuesday, wed, friday, and run on saturday and take sunday off.

thats just what I would do though, don’t know if thats best or not. [/quote]

Just my two cents.

I’ve been training MMA in Thailand for the past two months, and during that time I haven’t lifted or even worked out. Instead, I trained MMA, jitz and muay thai 5-6 days a week. The result is that I feel much, much more competent than when I was assisting my combat training with weights.
My kicks are definitely more powerful. My shins bruise and our Thai coaches are noting the difference.

My grips have become vice like… which for anyone who knows jitz, knows a good grip is paramount… and it is taking my jitz to the next level.

Perhaps I lied a bit. I definitely do supplement my MMA training, but not with weights. I’ve been working on yoga and flexibility. Note, yoga is not flexibility training. One thing I didn’t do was neglect my daily bodyweight squats… which is a great barometer of my hip health for training coming up that day.

However, something to note is that I have always added in weight training (consisting 90% of calisthenics) for the past three years… And trained super heavy compound movements for 10+years prior to that, hitting my pinnacle @ 3x bw DL/2x bw squats.

The point of all this is that it took me over 10 years to realize that weight training is very valuable, but not nearly as valuable as getting your ass on the mat or in the ring and getting it in.

It sounds obvious, no? But I think a lot of us tend to get hung up on the S&C aspect of combat sports. Again, it is valuable, but you can do without it…

Rather, instead of S&C consisting of only super heavy compound training, perhaps it would be more fitting for injury prevention, body maintenance, and proprioception training that creates more body awareness, which yoga is especially good for. And is also, my ‘secret weapon’.

I understand many of us want to be amazing martial artists, as well as pack on the muscles, but I implore you… pick one. Just remember that muscles are a side effect.

i agree with you jarvan, if the goal is just to be a better fighter, then lifting weights is… not important.

however the op expressed the desire to do both. I’m similar to him, i do weights and boxing, but to be perfectly honest i suck at both, but to me its just a hobby. I’m never going to be a real fighter.

I do a 2 day 531 lift schedule and then my normal whatever stuff. 531 day 1 is wed and 531 day 2 is sat. It’s worked pretty well for me lately. Might want to give it a whirl.
So right now I’ll be starting boxing cause no judo in the area.

day 1:
Front squats
Bench press
Dips with weight
Chin ups with weight

day 2:
Deadlift
Over head press
Bbell curls
Heavy one armed rows

I run to the gym, and I run to boxing. Only 3km away for both. I walk back though.

My plan:
mon: box
tues: box
wed: gym
thurs: box
fri: break
sat: gym
sun:break

It’s just enough lifting that I progress, but it doesn’t slow my progress with whatever fighting skill I’m learning.

[quote]zenontheterrible wrote:
i agree with you jarvan, if the goal is just to be a better fighter, then lifting weights is… not important.

however the op expressed the desire to do both. I’m similar to him, i do weights and boxing, but to be perfectly honest i suck at both, but to me its just a hobby. I’m never going to be a real fighter. [/quote]

You’re never going to be a ‘real’ fighter because you don’t want to be. And that is perfectly fine. You don’t have to compete, you don’t have to step in the cage, it is completely up to you. And much respect brotha, I don’t think I’m any ‘good’ at any particular thing either. And this is the exact reason why we are going to keep pursuing training with determination… which in turn, will not only help us excel beyond someone with an arrogant mindset, but also find meaning beyond just the sport.

Just remember it is called martial ARTS. Keep training and stay safe. Osss

I guess my question is this, can you train a full body routine one day to the next with no rest day? I know this is largely dependent on how you feel going through a routine but is this generally bad? I was thinking of doing weight training on Tuesday, and Wednesday or Thursday and Friday.

The better question would be, why can’t you do a full-body work for two consecutive days?

since i started judo last fall, i’ve been in the same boat as you. The thing i found to work best for me was lifting in the morning on the same day as judo practice, but absolutely making sure i rest the next day. my schedule was roughly :
tue : am lifting, pm judo
thurs : am lifting, pm judo
sat : lifting
sun : lifting

I don’t know what your judo training atmosphere is like, but in my case i never knew beforehand whether we would spend a day drilling a new technique for either nagewaza or newaza, or doing light sparring and drilling old techniques, or doing full intensity sparring. it always depended on how many black belts showed up to class, when upcoming competitions were etc. As a beginner, a lot of sparring sessions leave me with lots of little injuries, finger sprains, toe sprains.

These all become more manageable with more experience, and your experience with BJJ may already have prepared you for this so it doesn;t apply to you. All i’m saying is if you really want to do both, then its not worth it to be in a situation where a hard practice session throws of your lifting program