T Nation

B&C Question for Veterans


#1

Hello all,

Some of you may still remember me I used to be a frequent poster here. Havent been here for a while, still training and still unassissted.
Anyway cutting to the point, I am taking training very seriously now with a view of going pro in Physique in the coming years. To do this I understand I will eventually need assistance.

Im looking to B&C, I have plenty of knowledge and experience with AAS (read my old posts if in doubt) so I know what I am doing. However, as always, being fairly young my only concern is fertility in the long run. I know it is a 50/50 risk when it comes to fertility, some people can conceive on grams of gear while others are infertile at very low amounts.

My question is, in regards to the B&C protocol, ancillaries and compounds used, what is the best way to avoid fertility issues?
My own opinion is to avoid 19-nors as they shut down the system the hardest, and the longer the system is shut down the higher likelyhood of not recovering. Anyone have any experience on this matter?

SB


#2

SB! Nice to have you back. I remember you from when I posted here under rds63799.

Knowing your history, I would say you should definitely NOT touch any 19-nors!


#3

There was a study done and out of 1000 cases, only 3 had fertility issues (2 were twins).

That being said, there are protocols you can take now that will get your count back up and make you fertile again (if you ever lost fertility). I think the risk is EXTREMELY blown out of proportion.


#4

if you can pin for the rest of your life and be responsible with bloodwork and confident you can have at least a steady supply of testosterone then imo there is no reason not to


#5

[quote]CxTucker wrote:
There was a study done and out of 1000 cases, only 3 had fertility issues (2 were twins).

That being said, there are protocols you can take now that will get your count back up and make you fertile again (if you ever lost fertility). I think the risk is EXTREMELY blown out of proportion.[/quote]

what study are you talking about?

test/deca have been studied and prescribed as male birth control…


#6

[quote]Yogi wrote:
SB! Nice to have you back. I remember you from when I posted here under rds63799.

Knowing your history, I would say you should definitely NOT touch any 19-nors![/quote]

Haha yes rds my friend I do remember you.
In regards to the other responses, I could potentially have a supply of test for a long time, however I do not plan to stay on for life. My previous B&C attempt was for 13 months where I did low test high tren and came off with a long taper.
I intend to use the same method to come off this time maybe when the time comes.
Any objections or opinions?

SB


#7

for me personally, I like to go all or nothing, and why prolong the inevitable? Don’t you plan to at least be on a replacement dose of test as it declines when you age?


#8

[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:

[quote]Yogi wrote:
SB! Nice to have you back. I remember you from when I posted here under rds63799.

Knowing your history, I would say you should definitely NOT touch any 19-nors![/quote]

Haha yes rds my friend I do remember you.
In regards to the other responses, I could potentially have a supply of test for a long time, however I do not plan to stay on for life. My previous B&C attempt was for 13 months where I did low test high tren and came off with a long taper.
I intend to use the same method to come off this time maybe when the time comes.
Any objections or opinions?

SB [/quote]

how’s unassisted life treating you?

I remember your taper thread from before. Inspirational stuff that totally changed how I PCT!

You know that you can recover from long periods of shutdown, but that shit’ll not get any easier as you get older.

It’s just a case of being comfortable with the risks, I guess. I’m not, personally.


#9

[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:

My previous B&C attempt was for 13 months where I did low test high tren and came off with a long taper.
[/quote]

How was your libido effected during your B&C?

What were your cruising dosages?


#10

If your old enough to cruise why not shits cheap & works. I’d imagine if you are worried about fertility just get a sperm count done… I have plenty of friends who B&C and have got wives and girlfriends knocked up… Weird thing is most of them had daughters.


#11

[quote]Yogi wrote :

how’s unassisted life treating you?

I remember your taper thread from before. Inspirational stuff that totally changed how I PCT!

You know that you can recover from long periods of shutdown, but that shit’ll not get any easier as you get older.

It’s just a case of being comfortable with the risks, I guess. I’m not, personally.[/quote]

Unassisted life has been ok, ive made some good improvements and am still improving and gaining weight without fat as I’ve got the diet nailed down.
But obviously its not as fast as I would like.

SB


#12

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:

My previous B&C attempt was for 13 months where I did low test high tren and came off with a long taper.
[/quote]

How was your libido effected during your B&C?

What were your cruising dosages?[/quote]

I cruised at 200mg Test E/wk. Libido was ups and downs (no pun intended).

SB


#13

[quote]thehebrewhero wrote:
If your old enough to cruise why not shits cheap & works. I’d imagine if you are worried about fertility just get a sperm count done… I have plenty of friends who B&C and have got wives and girlfriends knocked up… Weird thing is most of them had daughters.[/quote]

Couldn’t agree with this more. Everyone one I have seen who has used gear even a year or two after quitting has had daughters. Interesting.

SB


#14

Ok so the first blast is going to look a little something like this:

Test Prop - 400mg/wk (100mg eod)
Dbol - 30mg/d (roughly 3-4 weeks)
hCG - 500iu/wk indefinitely
Adex - 0.5mg eod (adjust if necessary )

Just want to keep it simple since ive out the game for so long.
Thoughts?

SB


#15

[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:
Ok so the first blast is going to look a little something like this:

Test Prop - 400mg/wk (100mg eod)
Dbol - 30mg/d (roughly 3-4 weeks)
hCG - 500iu/wk indefinitely
Adex - 0.5mg eod (adjust if necessary )

Just want to keep it simple since ive out the game for so long.
Thoughts?

SB[/quote]
Looks solid, could always run dbol bit higher but that’s up to you. Me personally id pin prop ed.


#16

[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:
Ok so the first blast is going to look a little something like this:

Test Prop - 400mg/wk (100mg eod)
Dbol - 30mg/d (roughly 3-4 weeks)
hCG - 500iu/wk indefinitely
Adex - 0.5mg eod (adjust if necessary )

Just want to keep it simple since ive out the game for so long.
Thoughts?

SB[/quote]

increase that dbol!


#17

i’d rather increase the test instead of dbol if i had to choose


#18

Do you think I should up my hcg to 1000iu a week considering my main concern is fertility? I’ve pinned 50mg prop yesterday and 40mg dbol but I’m having second thoughts. I know there’s no harm done yet if i was to stop right now. Hmmm.

SB


#19

[quote]Yogi wrote:
SB! Nice to have you back. I remember you from when I posted here under rds63799.

Knowing your history, I would say you should definitely NOT touch any 19-nors![/quote]

I don’t know why but I never noticed that you were rds63799. I like you more now.


#20

isn’t the 750iu of hCG a week a replacement dose? I’d be wary going higher for any length of time.

I dunno SB, I mean remember all the problems you had with pretty horrendous shutdown before? You had a pretty rough time. Is going back on really what you want? It’s only going to get harder to recover from as you get older. Also, even though these fertility problems are super rare, you don’t exactly have the best of luck when it comes to sides.

Not trying to be a dick or anything, just playing devil’s advocate.