T Nation

Attention John Berardi (Did I speak to an idiot Biochem student?)

Surprise surprise, I was at the local GNC store today and had a lengthy conversation with one of the guys that works there. Anyway we were talking and during our conversation I mentioned that I consume just over 350 grams of protein per day. And to say that he was absolutely shocked would be an understatement. He seemed to think that all you need is about 150-175 grams per day maximum. Anyway he went on to explain how I will have massive problems with my kidneys in the future, something about ammonia blah blah blah. I baisically told him he was wrong and he came back with “Trust me man this is my 4th year of Biochem”. He also went onto explain how you body only uses 25-30 grams of protein per serving and the rest is pissed out. So then I told him that by his calculations (eating 150 grams of protein a day) to get my 4000 calories per day I would have to be eating something like 650-700 grams of carbs per day. This guy knew he wasn’t making any sense so he then told me that counting calories is a myth and is inaccurate. Probably the reason he didn’t have much of a body.
John was this guy full of shit or are you just a scientist gone mad? :slight_smile:

hey slaine, not all us bioc students are total twats, i admit at uni that most people don’t even understand what the GI is when they graduate but then again the point of bioc nowerdays is that the students usually go onto do some form of lab work that involves genetics, believe me in england we spend such a stupid amount of time on bloody genetics.

But some of us are knowlegable in such stuff and are usualy the ones you’ll hear of in a couple of years.

if you’d come to me in the shop and said you were eating so much prtoein I would have been i awe at the fact that you could afford so much protein, i know i can’t as a student.

Berardi IS a scientist gone mad. That’s probably why he’s at the forefront of the field right now.

Dude, I just graduated with a degree in biochem and I do believe that the GNC guy is big time full of crap, especially since as a scientist it should have been his responsibility to back his crap up with empirical research. i bet he didn’t cite jack when he told you all that info.

The GNC toad was defenintly full of crap. The same idiots keep saying your body can only absorb 25-30g of protein at one time—bullshit. I think this came from one study, maybe somebody correct me if I’m wrong. You mean to tell me that tatoo and shaq would both only absorb 30g of protein each meal, what a load of shit, study or not.

The amount of protein one should take in, has been a question that has been debated for many years. Recently, at the a Molecular Biology Conference, there was some data that was discussed that actually showed that the athlete needs less protein than a sedentary person. I can not site any abstract or journal articles, but I believe that when the new RDA for protein comes out, the author( of which I can’t remember his name), will be cited extensively. Now, comes the question of whether you believe the data and the other question of whether or not extra protein is harmful to you. For the first question, I believe that a 1g/lb of bodyweight is plenty. The RDA will probably be lower than this. In regards to the second question, I don’t believe that high amounts of protein will be harmful to a healthy individual. I have always followed 1g/lb of BW (except when on ketogenic diet), and have made good gains. Now, all these numbers would be adjusted if you are running some juice. But, obviously the scientific community doesn’t take this into consideration when making RDA levels. Here are my stats so that you don’t think I’m a 150lb geek. I am 6’4 280lbs 13%BF, and am currently working on my Phd in nutrition.

Well, Ive been called mad, but there is no major harm if a healthy weight training individual eats a boat load of protein. I just wrote a chapter on protein supplementation (for a new supplement book to be released in october). When this comes out, I encourage all on this forum to read it for a nice review of all the most frequently asked protein questions and much more!

he has no real studies in his favor, so he used scare tactics. along the lines of ammonia, you might want to watch out for homocysteine levels, which are byproduct of protein metabolism. One of the B vitamins along with a lot of other things can keep homocystein in check though.

I’ve got a BS in Molecular Biology and a minor in Biochem (not much to brag out). I’ll answer your question by saying: not only is that guy full of shit but he’s a fucking moron. I hope he meant it was his 4th year of Biochem the class and not his 4th year in a Biochem program.

GNC’s gonna fire this guy! He shoulda said, geez you oughta use more protein than that in order to sell more product. LOL

I read some really good research (you can see it at iartonline.ca) about how eating more protien causes diminishing returns, and you can achive good nitrogen retention with about 1.3 - 2 grams per kilogram of body weight. Any opinions?

Just about any medical professional would say the same thing if you told them you were eating that much protein. So who’s right? …Who knows. I know I’ve had some weird blood test results that could’ve been caused by high protein diets so at least if you’re gonna eat like this take a week or so off every once in a while and let your body detoxify and cleanse itself.

Man, why can’t you guys and gals ever come in to my GNC? I can’t even begin to tell you how sweet it would be to talk shop with another T-Man or better yet, vixen. I get so tired of dealing with the “Mrs. Joneses” and the newbies who want to try HMB and whatnot. If you are ever in Grand Island, NE, stop in and say hey. My name is Monty.

As a bodybuilder with diabetes, I have found the medical community to be a hindrance. I tske in around 120gm/protein/day at a weight of 147.
I have been told to limit it to 56gm. Fat and carbs would make up the rest. I DO believe, however, that you do not need as much protein as you are taking in.

Thanks guys, it really frustrates me when people like to think they are some sort of experts because they can say “i’m studying this, i should know”. To me unless you put things into practice then whatever you are studying dosent mean shit. I dont study anything at the moment, but because i have researched so many things on better performance via nutrition and put these things into practice at the gym i am confident that my knowledge far outweighs that of most people that study these subjects. Although i will commence studying Sports Science next year, there really is no better place to be learning than from the fellow forum bros here at Testosterone.

Interesting topic. Recently, Professor Michael Rennie from the Department of Anatomy and Physiology at the University of Dundee in the UK and Kevin Tipton from UT-Galveston published a paper (Annual Review Nutr 2000:20:457-483.) discussing that the better trained you are the more efficient that your muscles become at retaining nitrogen (I am not sure that I agree), but the paper is an excellant review. They base their statements on muscle protein synthesis rates and protein balance, not total nitrogen balance. In a later published paper (Int J Sports Nutr Exer Metab 2001;11(1):109-132) Kevin intimates that he is not in full agreement with Rennie. Nonetheless, both of these make for interesting reads. I asked Rennie why the dogmatic stance, his reply was that it is not dogmatic, it is evolutionary and that if I did not by a round of drinks he would not discuss it anymore. Whatever your thoughts are this is a topic that will always be a bastain for debate.