T Nation

Ask Physiolojik Thread


#244

Long term high profile users.
Serge Nubret, used heavily and lived until 70, when he went into a coma and later died.

Arnie, 71 and still going strong. Likely to have been using steroids in some form or other at least until his political career. Probably still on TRT/hgh during that time and up until now, might up the dose for action movies.

Sly Stallone 72, Boyer Coe 72, Frank Zane 76, Bill Pearl 87 and all still living.

Larry Scott died at 75

Guys these days are taking many thousands of mg/week, and its still not killing them in general. Most of the time death by steroids is usually diuretics, insulin coma etc.
I know people that have never touched a steroid in their lives yet died before 40 from cancer.
A guy I knew who was on steroids died in his mid twenties. He was always on, he didn’t blast and cruise or cycle. He blast and blasted. He went to sleep one night and didn’t wake up. I’m not sure what his cause of death was, it could have been a heart attack, recreational drugs were also mentioned. It also wouldn’t surprise me if he was using insulin. As far as I know his parents didn’t want an autopsy.


#245

Gotta say I do worry about this, being where I am in Aus the chances of acquring skin cancer (melanoma) during my lifetime isn’t exactly low haha. I check my skin monthly.


#246

@alldayeveryday did you read the study and see the sample size? I wouldn’t worry too much about it in the dosage we recommend.


#247

@unreal24278 you’re awesome man. But you worry way too much about way too much :slight_smile: your dosages are fine. :slight_smile:


#248

Tis in my nature to worry about things #anxiety, I’m aware I get overtly worried about things that aren’t a big deal, I mean… It’s not like I’m on 2 grams of test a week, and even if I was it still probably wouldn’t kill me. I tend to get anxious about things and then I eventually stop to think about it and I’m like “wait, why was I anxious about that” and then I get anxious about it again a week later hahahaha. Hence why my decisions about stuff tend to flip flop quite a bit. Everyone has their issues, some people (like me) just have more issues than most people, however with as many negatives as I have there’s quite a few positives (high intellect… Um… No that’s about it) wait… The ability to retain movie trivia, does that count?


#249

“To identify agents potentially useful in protecting against TMX-induced toxicity, we screened the NINDS-II library of 1040 compounds containing drugs approved for human use or in clinical trials. O-2A/OPCs exposed to 1 μm TMX for 48 h, which killed >80% of cells, were also exposed to NINDS-II library members at concentrations of 1 μm. We found 27 compounds that protected against O-2A/OPC cell death, in some cases providing almost complete protection. Not surprisingly, treatment with multiple estrogen analogs prevented TMX toxicity, as shown for β-estradiol, which reduced the proportion of PI+ cells by more than half (Fig. 2 A ). Protection also was provided by the antioxidants α-tocopherol and resveratrol, and a variety of other substances.”


#250

Hi @physioLojik, fairly new to this website, thanks for taking questions.

I had one regarding some blood results, specifically the following:

MCHC - 30.8 Ref Range: 31-37 LOW
MCH - 26.7 Ref Range 26-34
RDW - 16.2 Ref Range 11-15.5 HIGH

During a consultation with Defy Medical I was told the aforementioned results could indicate a GI bleed. They asked me to follow up with my PCP and possibly have a stool test. I did so and my PCP said those ranges don’t bother her. I know the ranges aren’t exceptionally out of range. However, my MCH and MCHC have been somewhat low or on the cusp of low for a couple of years.

Should I be demanding the stool test or should I just accept those ranges as is? My PCP also told me my total T level was fine in the 250’s because it was within the reference range, so I’m wary of her.


#251

So easy to do. I would request this anyway. It’s pretty standard.


#252

Right? My PCP often ignores things that are easy to do. I’m currently searching for a new one.


#253

When Drs says not necessary you say I would like to do it anyway just in case. And insist if still says no.
Ik some mds won’t have it. I have a Dr that will order anything I ask.

If you go to a gastroenterologist their will do a colonoscopy. Any hint of blood or possible blood in stool they cover their ass. Plus easy money for them


#254

My Dr has a bit of a god complex. I usually ask for the NP she works with but she’s currently out on maternity leave.


#255

I think you’d have to take a lot lot lot of Tamoxifen to reach a concentration of 1 micromolar, although I could be wrong. 1 micromolar is 1000nmol. It’s like that study that came to the conclusion testosterone and stanozolol kill more cardiac myocytes than controls when left ventricular myocytes (rat left ventricular myocytes mind you) were exposed to concentrations above 10 micromolar. And I’m sitting here thinking “either the drugs are reaching different concentrations in different tissues or they’re just trying to find issues” because it’s almost impossible for a human to take enough testosterone to reach a BLOOD concentration of 10,000nmol on a blood test.


#256

Interesting and thank you for the response. I read the articles but I dont fully understand how it ties in to bodybuilding uses. That’s why I’m asking questions. I see guys talking about “brain fog” due to tamoxifen and fearing permanent brain damage. I know I cant afford brain damage.


#257

Skin Cancer in Australia, it is pretty high. Alternatively many people aren’t getting enough vitamin D because they are always wearing sunscreen and avoiding being in the sun.
So much of getting skin cancer is about exposure to sun, as well as genetics. Gen X are the last of the people from the sunbathing era where getting sunburnt was just part of summer.
Subsequent generations like yours are less likely to get skin cancer because they are more aware of the risks.


#258

The majority of skin cancer is due to inflammation just like any other type of cancer. Work on combating that and cancer has no chance.


#259

@unreal24278 is right. The dosages aren’t even close to realistic. Also myelin is close to my heart - I have multiple sclerosis personally. Diagnosed well before AAS use. I wouldn’t take anything to mess with that.


#260

You have MS?


#261

@flappinit yes sir :slight_smile: relapsing / remitting. So far not too many issues :slight_smile:


#262

There is now ample evidence that proper diet and exercise can reverse symptoms of MS. Of all the things to mention about yourself, that is particularly significant and I applaud your obvious drive to live life in spite of your situation. Knock em dead, dude.


#263

@flappinit thanks man. I never want to ever come across as a victim or a patient haha. And yes - diet is HUGE for MS. As is training as you mentioned. I have a kick ass support system as well - my wife is amazing and knows when to be compassionate and when to really kick my ass haha!

Thanks again man. Your words mean a lot. I have a hard time with people who come up with excuses for why they can’t do things.

Funny story - when I told my wife (who was then my girlfriend in med school) that I had MS she chuckled and said “well, we all have things to deal with and you are the toughest guy I know so it’s an equalizer. Plus, one day I’ll be able to kick your ass - but that day will be really far away.” At that moment I knew I’d marry her. Ok sappy story done.

For all you tough guys out there - don’t forget to bear your soul and heart to a good woman. Support is the best thing for us.