I know I’m trailing off again from what I said early about seeing it through lol, but I’m thinking I should try a natural approach first to see if I can raise it on my own and if not then I will continue with trt treatment.
Im on the Second shot in so I shouldn’t be shutdown so it’s now or never I guess, honestly i should have tried that first before starting trt that was my mistake.
If you feel this way you better try the natural way now instead of later, this way compliance will be better later if you decide on TRT. It usually take 1-3 weeks to get shutdown, but you should bounce back pretty quick. I had been on TRT for 2.5 years and only took 4.5 weeks to fire up my HPTA with no PCT or restart protocol.
If you’re expecting levels at in the high normal ranges, likely will not happen but a solid chance for 20 nmol/L. It’s not like you’re in the 200-300 ranges like some guys, the lower you go the harder it is to see a solid increase.
Eat plentiful and healthy, get good sleep without your phone screen face down and don’t overwork yourself in the gym. These phone screens can light up while sleeping and disrupt sleep.
Yeah I’ll definitely try everything I can. all I want are the symptoms gone so if it’s not high normal but the symptoms are fixed than I’m ok with that for now.
I’m not sure if I’m understanding correctly, you say “it’s not like I’m in the 200-300 ranged like some guys” … well I’m at 286? Not sure what the 14.8 number is though. lol.
One more question, This week my testies have been aching like crazy and doesnt seem to let up is that from the testosterone injections?
The conversion has you at 426 ng/dL.
Oh shit, so really not that bad. Well that decides it than, I will try to go natural for now lol.
Thanks alot for the help man.
Cheers!
I just got out of the trt clinic. the lady there told me that they dont go by the total testosterone, only free testosterone and if i were to continue with treatment the next blood work they do in 8 weeks will not include TT only free and of course estrogen and thyroid among others. That doesnt seem quite right to me, what is your opinion? She was also really trying to keep me on it, she says you got to at least give it a chance for at least 3 months and she says you will see a major difference. felt she was being a bit pushy lol. She says for my age my FT should be at 700 ? what do you guys think?
A lot of the top doctors and top clinics only care about Free T, this is a good sign they are on top of their game.
If you’re not prepared to give TRT at least 12 months, don’t bother with TRT at all. It can take some awhile to dial in, some cases are just more difficult than others.
I’m in a bit similar situation like you. I’m trying now the “natural” approach plus one drug(cabergoline) before I commit to TRT.
First of all your levels around 400(mine are same) are the so-called low-normal range. This is for me the most fucked up place because you and the doctors are hesitant whether you should start TRT. I mean if you are 200 the decision is much more simple. Bear in mind the minimum levels to feel optimal for most people is 600. This is very relative and personal but we talk about statistics here. So you can just take into account the 600 is the minimal optimal range. Then of course the free test is more important.
If you want to try the natural approach this is what you should do - remove ALL processed food from your diet. I mean really all. You need to forget the taste of sugar. All dietec sweeteners also. Try to remove all fast carbs. Eat a lot of meat, eggs, A LOT of vegietables, good fats taking into account calories if you need to cut weight. Try to eat wood fruits. If you have weight to loose you ve got to lower your body fat percentage. You have no idea how much this fucks up our hormones and it is not only aromatization. The main thing you need to battle with the diet and the weight loss is inflamation that can seriously affect hormones.
Stop taking ANY alcohol, you can occaionally 1-2 times a week drink a glass of wine. Stop smoking(everything) if you do.
Get a lot of sleep(7 hours at least) and do a resistance training 3 times a week but not too hard. Whole body trainings with around 7-10 are shown to have many benefits for this purpose.
And finally you can include a few supplements - vitamin - d of course, zinc, magnesium, acetyl l-carnitin, fish oil.
If you try that a few months and it doesn’t work well you will be sure you need TRT. And one more thing - YOU GOTTA DO ALL THIS EVEN IF YOU GO ON TRT to minimize side effects!
Hey man thanks for the input, you are very right it would be much easier to decide if our T was at the 2-300 range.
A friend of mine that referred me to this clinic is actually a bit higher in free T at 390 not sure what his TT is though. He is going all out with trt and is reaping the benefits I guess, he has been on it for 2 months.
For me I cant seem to bite the bullit yet, I feel that I could potentially be in over my head lol.
Thanks alot for all the good info on taking the natural approach, I appreciate that. Do you find that the drug you take (cabergoline) to be effective?
I do have some body fat to lose for sure I’m 198lbs and kind of short ( 5’7") lol however I’m muscular and naturally stocky so I look quite proportionate, I do believe believe my bf percentage is in the high 20s maybe even thirties.
I do work out like crazy 4-6 days a week with heavy lifting and some HIIT, I used to weigh 225 pounds around January so I lost a bit of weight.
Diet could always be better however Its pretty good now.
I’ll give what you said a go with eating better and trying some supplements. See what the bloodwork says in 8 weeks.
Ok so im done with the natural aproach! couldnt get it up for my woman again and we are not in a very good place because of my libido, I took Viagra and definitely helped but i felt like not just my small head was going to explode but the one sitting on my shoulders too, felt really tight in the chest and flushing like crazy, that cant be good for you.
My question is, should i take 50mg twice a week or once per week to start? i noticed the first 2 doses i took i felt quite exhausted around day 3 and throughout the rest of the week for some reason. also should i take Anastrasole with it or leave it out? my E2 pre trt was 41 pmol/L.
No AI.
Go twice a week. avoid the AI unless you need it/ (Like high E2 giving you ED)
Ok thanks guys! I would like to avoid the AI if I could. Although I thought I read something about E2 levels being higher if injecting twice a week?
So I guess I’m a baby with needles apparently lol. I never thought i would be until I did the first two injections the second one being the worst, I froze, I was like a deer in headlights for God sake and took me like half hour to go through with it lol.
I’m injecting in my quad with a 25 g needle that is 1 inch long, I’m worried about injecting into a vein or getting a blood clot from it or something. It’s not the pain, I can care less about that I’m more worried about the other problems that could arise with injecting. Anything to worry about in that regard?
I also have chronic migraines and take alot of advil sometimes up to 10 to 12 in one day if they get really bad. Will that interfere with test cyp? Anyone know?
Twice weekly has a better chance of showing good results, more frequent for lower SHBG.
Twice weekly will likely aromatise less, if it makes any difference at all.You get over that feeling. Just don’t jab and go. Slow in, slow on the plunger, no worries.
The clinic told me to dart it in fast and push the plunger on a count of 10 to 15 seconds. I found it took more like 30 to 40 seconds, it was alot harder to push than i expected lol. I will try the slow in method next time though.
What do you guys think about aspirating, is it a must? the clinic told me it isn’t needed.
what do you think of subq? because i also have a bunch of 25g 5/8’’ long needles. could i use those for IM at 90 degrees (in quads)? It would be nice if there was a better way to administer T.
Thanks again thanks for all the information guys!
I inject almost exclusively sub-Q. 27 ga 1/2" usually. I don’t bother to aspirate. Do not, ever, just jab it in and rush the injection - unless you’re into pain and hard lumps under the skin. Slow and easy is the least painful and least problems.
Where do you inject? is the stomach the best?
AI’s have some bad side effects and the majority on TRT do not require them from what I have read. You can further avoid the use of them by lowering your body fat percentage the more fat you have the more you aromatize testosterone, but the biggest way is more frequent injections with lower doses. I do daily sub q injections myself. I use an insulin needle and inject into different zones. If you google sub q injection sites you will see the different places you can do it. I would recommend checking out the book TOT bible by Jay Campbell and checking out the stickies through this forum page as well. I saw you wanted to try natural routes first, in my experience it doesn’t really work that well. sadly, if your test is low enough that you almost qualify as hypogonadial at such a young age. The only thing that will really bring your testosterone levels back up to an optimal range is TRT. Just read and learn as much as you can to be aware for yourself and be your own advocate for your treatment and health. You will do great!
I usually inject in the stomach.