T Nation

Archaic's Lean mass cycle

Hey guys. I posted this on another forum to get advice, so some of you might see this twice. How do you like this choice of drugs for my next cycle. Give me your advice and critcisms. Spare no feelings, gimme the grit. It will be an 8-weeker, dedicated to lean mass gains and concurrent lowering of bf%. Basically, I want to gain around 10-20 lbs muscle, shed a little fat and get the sixer.

Background: bw:230lbs, 11%bf, age: 21. This will be my 4th cycle.

Diet: will be 4000cal./day, with carbs & proteins @ 400gm, and fats at ~100gm. All clean. I may raise or lower this depending how I feel.

Training: will be based around strength/hypertrophy, with rep ranges 3-8. Training 5 days weights a week, one day HIIT, one rest day. Workouts for 1-1.5hours. Based around mainly compound movements and isolation only for weakpoint training.

Week 1 - Frontload of Test E@ 600mg, Boldenone U @ 600mg,
Fluoxymesterone @ 20mg/day,
Trenbolone A @ 50mg/day
Tamoxifen C @ 25mg/day

Week 2 - Boldenone U @ 300mg,
Test E @ 300mg
Fluoxymesterone @ 10mg/day,
Trenbolone A @ 50mg/day
Tamoxifen C @ 25mg/day

Weeks 3 - 5 - Boldenone U @ 300mg, Test E @ 300mg,
Trenbolone A @ 50mg/day
Tamoxifen C @ 25mg/day

Week 6 - Test E @ 300mg, Fluoxymesterone @ 10mg/day,
Trenbolone A @ 50mg/day, Tamoxifen C @ 25mg/day

Weeks 7 - 8 - Fluoxymesterone @ 20mg/day, Trenbolone A @ 50mg/day,
Tamoxifen C @ 25mg/day

Weeks 9 - 12 start PCT with:
Clomiphene C @ 300mg day 1 - 3, and @ 50mg subsequently
Nolvadex @ 25mg/ EOD, No HCG will be used as i don’t think I’ll need it.

Supplements: will include 8 tabs/day milk thistle in weeks 3-5 (when not on halo) and after for possible trouble from the liver toxic 17-AAs. A Tribulus/Avena blend with ZMA also in PCT. Other supplements standard.

Equipoise will be cut after 5 weeks to let it’s long lasting ester taper drug levels down for the end of the 8 week cycle, as well it’s RBC stimulating effect make me not want to run it longer. I like the EQ for the joints and red blood cell endurance benefits (for my HIIT).
The Test Enanthate will also be cut, but after the 6th week instead of the 5th like for the EQ (because the halflife for enanthate is slightly less than the undecylenate ester). It will form a base in this stack for some aromatisation (along with the EQ)to estriol to help potentiate gains.
Halotestin is used for strength gains in the first and second weeks before the long lasting injectables kick in and for the last 3 weeks when the EQ and Enanthate are cut. I am looking forward to massive strength increase when on it…
Trenbolone is the icing on the cake, providing a solid strength, and anabolic base drug. Also will help me cut bf, and get a nice fat pump in the gym.

Well boyos what do y’all think???

I want some before and after pictures bro!!! Nice cycle, looks to be well thought out… Man, I’ll tell you right now, Halo is NO JOKE… My strength is getting INSANE on it. I tested my 225 strength and before I started I got it 14 times, yesterday I tossed it up 23 times. NINE REPS in less than 2 weeks. Granted, I did use a faster tempo and I trained in a hardcore gym, that’s a lot of strength, nonetheless.

You are about the same size I am, although you are carrying a little less body fat than I am. Keep us informed on how you feel, as I will be logging on everyday to see how you feel. Right now I’m on EQ/Winny/halo/test prop/tren and I’m getting stronger just sitting here typing.
Good luck and get friggin HUUUUUUUUUGE!!!

Looks pretty solid man. If it was me i would bump up the test a bit but i’m a bit greedy with that stuff.

Anyway, the one thing i’d say is that you might be running the EQ too long.
To my math anyway, with eq having a half life of about 14 days just after your last shot in the 5th week you would have about 1074mg of EQ snowballed up inside you, and that will take a pretty long time to run out. I’m not entirely sure below what concentration EQ will no longer cause supression but after 6 weeks you will still have around 150mg in your body.

Heres the math:
EQ has a half life of 14 days or quarter-life of about 7 days (not quite but almost).

Week 1
Inject 600mg, which will drop to 400 by next injection

Week 2
400 circulating, plus increase of 300
total: 900

Week 3
EQ drops to 675, inject 300, total 975

Week 4
EQ drops to 731.25, inject 300, total 1031.25

Week 5
EQ drops to 773.45, inject 300, total 1073.45

You are then going to need to wait several half-lives for the EQ to be at a level low enough to make recovery possible. I’ve used it before (not sure if you have or not) for like 12 weeks and i was test-less for a long long time after that. It almost wasnt worth it really. So if i were you i would frontload more of the EQ and let it slowly wind down over the course of the cycle, extend the eq-free period of the cycle at the end, or just not use EQ. You could up the tren (they are both similarly class 1’s or use something like winny which is also a class 1 only with a way shorter half life).

However, everybody reacts differently to these things and if you’ve used it before and liked it, then go for it. Personally i’m not that big of a fan, i got some wicked headaches from it (i was using closer to 600/week which does influence the hematocrit a fair bit) and it makes you hungry like you wouldnt believe which can be a problem for lean mass related cycles.

This is just how i see it anyway, definetly not the be all and end all.

JP

Actually i found an error in my math which threw the whole set of numbers off. In the first week your EQ will only drop to 450, not 400 so this will influence the rest of the numbers all the way down the line, which would put my estimate on the conservative side.

I guess thats what you get while you’re trying to talk about juice and study bio at the same time hah.

I’d like to also point out that this is just my understanding of how half-lives work. Hopefully p-22 or someone will either confirm this or make me feel dumb.

JP

If you want my nose in this cycle then this is what I have to say…

Forget about the Fronloading of the Test Enanthate. I believe that you are going to experience too much estrogen formation in week 3-4 even with your Nolva intake. The gains made with the Test Frontload won’t stick around to well post cycle. I would just try to keep the Test as even as possible. You will get plenty of spike with the EQ frontload. But that spike will be a kinder, gentler spike if you will. I love the Frontload with the EQ. I can vouch that the gains with a Frontload of EQ are much more maintainable than that of the Test E frontload. That is the best way to use EQ. No doubt about that one. If you want this cycle to be as lean as possible then go with arimidex(.25/eod)more if you are prone to more bloat. You will still get the benefits of the Test and the EQ while using the arimidex but without all of the estrogen bloat. Yes, that little bit of estrogen will give you a little more strength. But it will not be anything major. But I feel that the fat that will be gained is not worth it. I would use Test E @ 300mg/wk for its entire duration. I would keep the EQ at 400mg/wk throughout after your initial frontload.
Everything else looks pretty good. The pumps are going to be hellacious with the EQ/Tren combo. Once again this is just my take on your cycle. It is not from the mouth of the AAS God. Whomever that may be.

Good Luck

The Scorp

I believe that one can control the hunger that comes with EQ uesage. Maybe incorporate a little more EFA’s. I think that EQ related hunger scenario is over done. If you read about it enough you can almost induce it to the point where it becomes ridiculous.

T-Matt: Yeah, before and after pictures seem like the goods… I will look into that…

justinP: You may be right about the EQ! I might cut it back to only 4 weeks, but up the dose a little for the frontload… Thanks for pointing that out!

Scorp: I am willing to sacrifice a little bloat for increased gains from the estrogen, so I want to run the test as planned without adex… But you’re totally right that this may not be a pure lean mass cycle… Honestly, I was thinking of running the test at 500mg/week with a 1000mg frontload, so I’m inclined to go a little higher rather than a little lower. I will take yours and justinp’s advice on the fat EQ frontload (maybe up it to 900mg?), and let the levels taper down more for the end of the cycle!

The temporary bloat for temporary gains. Not worth it to me. It’s swelling time for your Bro. Good Luck. I would love to know how much of the gains you actually retain after this nut shrinking cycle. LOL

Still Smirking-

The Scorp

I just quickly scanned this, And in my opinion you don’t need to take the halotestin and trenbolone at the same time. Their effects are so simmilar that it is pointless. Trenbolone is the least toxic of the two, and probably the way to go. I am taking halo right now but only for three weeks. It is a rest from tren, and I plan on hopping back on tren and winny for my diet leading into the contest. Good luck with the cycle though! P-22

Scorp: Some people just can’t forward an image of sarcasm in writing… Be pleased, you aren’t one of them - your words drip with sarcasm; I think it’s a gift!

HAHHA I appreciate your comments. I think my boys will do just fine however… My last cycle included a gram of test a week for eight weeks and I had my girlfried check the boys periodically to ensure no shrikage was occurring. None!

Anyways, is your only advice for this cycle to up the EQ front and lower the test front? Because I find it hard to believe that 300 extra milligrams of test will bloat me up beyond all recognition or cause me to lose all my gains post cycle. I just wanted the frontload of test to get T levels high before I drop the halotestin on week 3. What’s wrong with that??

Do you never front load your longer testosterone esters for that reason? It seems that the levels will peak eventually without the front, it will just take longer.

P-22: you may be right about the halotestin. I’m now thinking about dropping the halo and replacing it with 10-20mg dbol ED for the whole cycle and adding letrozole. In that case I would probably drop the test a bit, to maybe 200mg with a 400mg frontload to prevent excessive water retention. Sound good?

Scorp: Some people just can’t forward an image of sarcasm in writing… Be pleased, you aren’t one of them - your words drip with sarcasm; I think it’s a gift!

And the Scorp sayeth: Tooshay Fatty!

I do not frontload Test. I just do not think that it is necessary. The Spike is to high through the middle of the cycle and a Test blood profile will show it if you ever get one done as I have mentioned before to you and the others. I like the EQ frontload because it is less explosive on the hormone levels than that of Test. If you want to see what I mean then go get some Test profiles done BIG A! I like your idea of running the D-Bol instead of Halo. I concur with P22 on his analysis. I missed that one earlier.

P.S. You know my sarcasm is beautiful. Why don’t you just admit it. LOL

Take care Tiny-

The Scorp