T Nation

Appetite Starter?

Hi all,

I have been kind of half-assing it for the past few months and finally have decided to do it all the way this time, I want to bulk up. I have been 143-5 for about a year now, up from 123 2 years ago, and want to hit 165. I am low BF and the lifting is being taken care of, my question/concern is as follows:

This morning I was scarfing down eggs before I have to head to work, and probably about egg number 3 or 4 my appetite dies down… this morning especially bad. I almost ralfed because I kept force feeding myself.
I currently eat pretty much like this every day:
-breakfast: 4-5 eggs, whole wheat toast, OJ
-Mass gainer shake(1300 calories) w/ peanut butter
-lunch: typically I eat some pre-made pasta with steak or chicken or scallops in it, mashed potatoes, can(s) of campbells soup
-extra* Peanut butter sandwich every day, most days one in the middle and before I head to bed
-supper: pasta, mashed potatoes, something with steak
-Mass gainer shake before bed

Point being, I eat pretty healthy, I am just looking for something to make it where I CAN eat even more than this. I of course do shakes pre-and post workout, etc. etc. but I think I need to eat more calories from FOOD rather than just from shakes… anything I can buy that will increase my appetite other than weed?

Put things like flax seed, olive oil, nuts, yogurt, frozen fruit etc in your shake. Put all of those right there and you add about 7 or 800 calories to each of those shakes… Course at that point youd be over 7000 or 8000 calories from what I can see so I’m gonna call bs on you eating all that and being 145…

You eat healthy? You do not know the meaning of the word. You need to figure up the total macros for what you are eating. I see a shit load of sugar - crap gainer shakes, pasta, mashed potatoes,oj and the bread you eat.You may have a decent amount of protein. Can not tell with our macro break down. Looks like you do not get enough good fats, and maybe not enough total fats.

You have NO VEGETABLES listed. And no complex carbs other than the whole wheat toast.If that whole wheat bread does not list whole wheat flour as first ingredient then it is crap.

Your appetite may not be your problem but rather what you are eating. Post a days eating with macro breakdowns per meal and you may get some useful help.

Also you can start by looking up Berardi’s 7 Rules of Highly Effective Eating and follow it. And start reading the other nutrition articles on this site.

… I understand where you are coming from, Cowpaddi, I should probably go back and edit that original post, I was rushing through it before I headed to work.

On ‘pasta’ that was just a catch-all. By ‘pasta’ I mean one of a pre-made dish that I put in tupperware and bring to work. Today was spaghetti and scallops, alfredo sauce, and yesterday was penne noodles and steak, once again with alfredo sauce(Ragu brand if that means anything). I put a can of green beans and a can of corn and EVOO pan-fry up some chicken and put it in there, and eat that with my mashed potatoes(no gravy) some days, and I eat steak burritos from Chipotle, no guac and no sour cream, black beans chili corn and cheese. I eat 7 grain wheat bread, not the cheap Sara Lee shit. I drink ‘simply orange’, most pulp in the bottle. It’s basically eating an orange every glass, lol. Only on rare cases will I eat a can of soup, but if I can’t make lunch or whatever I will pick up a can. 2 chic Fil A sandwiches sometimes find their way in, if I forget both.

I DO eat broccoli, salads once in a while, onions and mushrooms(with my steaks), and celery with natty peanut butter some times. It’s just not an every day thing, my roommate eats my greens like a rabbit, I can’t keep them in the fridge at all times to be honest.

I also realize I don’t know everything, and I came here for help, so I will look up the 7 rules and see what it’s all about, love the input as always, and don’t mean to reply with a novel, I just thought I should set that straight…

Also, am I crazy or did I hear/read somewhere green tea supresses appetite… if it does, I am stoppin that shit. I have one at work if I need a pick me up, and I guess I never put the two together until poring over the details of what I did today.

EDIT: I weighed today after my workout and weighed a flat 150. 13 days ago I was 144 1/2 on the same scale, literally same shoes and same shorts. I still have practically no body fat, I have six countable abs and cuts at the bottom(obliques) and starting to get vascularity in my forearms again. Powercleaned 190lbs 3 times today, SHREDDED a PR… today was a good workout, and it looks like my program is getting me a little progress so far, I have only been doing the weight gainer for literally 10 full days… i just need more appetite so I can grind through this to get 165 pounds by summer :slight_smile: Any thoughts on that while I tweak the diet some?

Your problem is most likely not the fact that you don’t eat enough, it’s probably that you’re not consistent enough. You should add more protein in there and remove the weight gainer (drinking sugar isn’t very healthy) and add more vegetables/fruit, but consistency is key. All you need is a few 100 calories a day more than your BMR… for the next 12 MONTHS, not DAYS, to see results.

Sounds like a catch 22 though, fruits have sugar and so do most veggies, that’s why I really only take the glycogen peri-workout (Bastardization of Thib’s protocol), so I should cut out the weight gainer(proteins carbs and sugars) and eat proteins, and sugars in other places? And then, once again, where is the appetite coming from? I. Heaved. This. Morning. From. 4. Eggs. I hardly kept it down, before I even had my shake.

It took me almost an hour and a half to finish the shake because every other chug would start my stomach bubbling. I hate to be difficult, but it sounds like 3 different ideas and different fixes for a problem I didn’t really need a solution to in this form… if I were able to eat more (and I agree, consistency might be the key in this one, two weeks might be too short to be able to ‘stomach’ all the new calories. I went from 2200-2800 randomly sporadic diet, I am a college student with a job and no meal plan, after all, nothing is consistent in my life lol.

Ditch the mass gainer. Even if it has 100 grams of protein that is only 400 calories out of the 1300 calorie total. There is likely very little fat in it. Which means there is over 200 grams of sugar in it. Also the pasta and the mash potatoes quickly convert to sugar.

In its place use a quality protein powder like Metabolic Drive. You can add in milk,yogurt,some healthy oil, nuts, etc. to add calories. This would be much healthier than the mass gainer and still give you a good source of calories.

Consider adding Surge Recovery as a Pre/Peri-workout drink. At least one serving. Two if you can afford it.

As mentioned earlier: It is difficult to give advice when we do not know what you are eating exactly. You need to list a typical days eating along with macro nutrient breakdown. This needs to be based on what you actually eat not what you think you ate. You most likely need to increase the amounts of protein and healthy fats you are eating.

The green tea is fine keep it. Even if it has a slight appetite suppressing effect it has other good properties.
If the bread list enriched flour as its first ingredient it is nutritional crap. Not all Sara Lee breads are crap. You have to get used to reading the ingredient and nutrition labels until you get a handle on what you are eating.

I know where you are coming from as far as size. I was 6’2" @148 lbs. when I graduate HS. I have since added 125 lbs to that. Unfortunately the vast majority of that was fat not muscle. I need to take what I have learned on this site and actually put it into action.
My only exercise is an endurance one. It is called procrastination. I can not only do it continuously for days and weeks on end but for months and years on end as well.

If you were to provide the additional info I am sure that you would get more help and from more people.

I heard the same thing before, I agree with you the mass gainer isn’t the greatest thing (and even a year ago I wouldn’t have even bought the shit) but it’s just something I did, I got so tired of walking up to the doctor’s scale and being able to say ‘143’ and not being wrong. Ever.

Two years of that, probably seven or eight doctors visits. 143 and 142 when I had strep this last time. I indeed HAVE gained some weight, I dunno, I guess when this bucket o goo runs out I will order some M Drive. Surge Recovery… I have tried NO Xplod before, is it similar, different, or completely different? That shit made me queasy and I am not exactly a fan of puking on my Pumas.

If I order the Metabolic Drive and some Surge recovery, should I also get SuperFood? Is it something NECESSARY or is it supplemental to a good diet(if I ate a different green every day would I be alright, I guess I am asking)
I will write it down and if I can’t straighten it out myself, post it up here for the beatings to begin, as far as daily diet goes.

I am digging the 5 and a half pounds over two weeks, especially since I can honestly say I am still looking low BF and not feeling sluggish during my workout… let’s see if I can’t make this regiment continue in an even better form after I get some M Drive and S Recovery

Yes fruit has sugar, it also has a lot of nutrients in it. Most vegetables are low calorie when served plain. Eat all the vegetables you want along with moderate amounts of fruit. If you went from 2200-2800 calories to whatever it is you are eating now no wonder you are having stomach issues. You added to much to soon. Your two mass gainer shakes have about the same amount of calories as you used to eat in a day.

Eat just whole foods if possible. Try to eat 5-6 small meals through out the day instead of just several big ones. Eliminate the crap from your diet, including the mass gainers. You will feel better. Then if you still need more calories to bulk add healthy calories slowly into your diet.

Have 6 meals of about 400 calories each for starters. Figure out the macronutrient percentages for each meal, do for two weeks and see how your body responds. Then adjust the intake of each meal depending on how you fluctuate on the scale (weekly) and how you feel in terms of energy and focus. And have fish oil with that. I personally take a capsule with 425mg EPA and 325mg DHA with each meal and they do wonders.

If you’re eating healthy enough and the right amounts you won’t have any stomach issue or trouble being hungry by your next meal.

Fruit has a surprisingly low amount of sugar for how sweet it is. Personally, I eat mostly apples, because a huge bag costs $5.

I know how you feel though, I can’t eat in the mornings either (I have to wait 1-2 hours usually, or I get stuffed immediately from nothing) and have a hell of a time gaining mass. Try drinking whole milk, I find I can drink it anytime, first thing in the morning or even after I’ve gotten stuffer already on real food. If you don’t mind drinking light butter, try 10% cream which has even more calories. Better in a (thick) shake though. Also cream is half the price of milk per calorie.

Hey, someguyyy, I had the same issue. Weed used to be the only thing to help me eat more. Then, I really decided to put it all in, and I added a 4th meal: one whole pizza, between lunch and dinner. I chose it because I love pizza, and it was actually possible to eat it all and not want to heave. Now, I’m NOT suggesting you eat pizza to get clean gains. At. All.

That’s what I did. Sure, it worked, but that’s not the point. Your health is more important than instant gains. BTW, you won’t notice how much is fat vs muscle 'til you gain at least 20 more lbs. It can be deceiving when you start out lean, fat is subtle at first.

Anyway, point, cowpaddi nailed it. You added too much, too soon, and most of it was the sugar in your mass gainer. I’ve drank these too, and they blow. Messed up my digestion. I finished what I bought, out of spite, but looking back, I would just throw it out. Go to www.fitday.com and log everything you eat. Not what you plan to eat, but everything you actually put in your face. And keep down.

Lastly, NO-xplode is crap. Caffeine and arginine, which has been heavily hated on here by mostly everyone. I used it as well, of course, and it feels like something’s working, and it is. Just not too sure it’s actually doing anything useful to build muscle. Stick with MD for meal replacements, Surge for workout nutrition, and Superfood and Flameout if you don’t get enough healthy fats and vegetables.

Good luck, keep pumping those big weights.

There is no point in addressing his want to boost his appetite anymore. First of all we don’t know how much he eats. Either he eats what he said and his appetite is gargantuan, or he isn’t eating that and we don’t know how big his appetite is. Second, he gained 6 pounds in a week or two, so clearly its working. You can’t go from 145 to 165 in a day.

Good work on the progress.

By the way… both times you said you almost got sick you were eating eggs. I don’t eat eggs because the texture makes me nauseous, I also have a hard time eating in the morning because I’m not hungry. Maybe your in the same situation. Do you even like eggs? Force feeding yourself something you hate, that makes you feel ill, first thing in morning is not going to help you eat alot the rest of the day.

Memento, I have no problem with eggs, it’s really not that, I just think it’s a combination of me trying to scarf it down too quickly, and too early in the morning. I got up and had about an hour before I started eating, probably too quickly so I could get to work on time. I probably need to cut down on the weight gainer, but at the same time, like mentioned, it’s working. I will cut portions of each shake out and add in things to make up the calories(olive oil and peanut butter have worked, I can throw in a banana and I already take it with whole milk) so I can probably keep it around 1k calories per shake.
fitday.com sounds like a win. Let’s see how that works for me.
I guess it’s just hard to get 6 meals in a day due to the time constraints I have, like if I work from 5-10 I only get a 15 minute break, that’s not enough time to chow down a full meal, I usually get a PB sandwich and a bottle of tea down and barely make it back on in time.

I love the input, let me see what I can do to fix what I have wrong currently.

Make a bolognaise with an onion, some peppers, mushroom, you could even throw in some kidney beans. Then reduce the amount of pasta with it, and increase the good stuff! Not a big change.

The eggs are great for breakfast if you can keep it, try to.

Try making tomato based curries and throw in some mixed veg, you wont notice you’re eating them.

Do you like stews? You can get carrot, swede, parsnip, onion… loads of things will go in there.

Just a few ideas - dont hate eating a lot, eat what you like to eat and try and make it as healthy as you can. Then slowly improve. If you hate what you’re eating, you wont eat it long. Find what works for you.

If you can only manage to eat one PB sandwich in 15 minutes you are flapping your lips too much and not doing enough chewing. I can easily do two sandwiches in that amount of time and I have NO TEETH.
You can premake a protein shake and bring it with you to have at your break. Use it in place of the tea or as the whole meal depending on how it is made. And no this is not one of your mass gainer shakes.
Several people have suggested posting an actual days food and drink intake on here. Yet you have not done so yet. WHY? People can not help you until you post it. They will quickly lose interest in this thread if you do not. Either post it today or make a post committing to posting it by tomorrow night.

Well here it is, this is what I ate yesterday, not what I ‘wanted to eat’ or whatever… I ate all this yesterday.

-4 eggs, 3 slices turkey bacon, calcium tabs, 3 capsules fish oil, vitamin b tab
-weight gainer shake(18 oz whole milk, 2 tbspoons of peanut butter, dash of EVOO) - should be about 1500-1600 calories… ish.
-spaghetti and scallops, Alfredo sauce, probably a ‘ramen to go cup’ size worth of it, if that makes sense
-preworkout ‘jack3d’ and glycogen with 20 g whey isolate, 16oz water, drank 40g whey after workout
-steak and penne noodles, probably twice as much as the ^^^ portion
-can of tuna, mayo, 2 slices of american cheese, 2 pieces of wheat bread = sandwich

  • I opted NOT to take another weight gainer shake, since it’s apparently satan in a shaker bottle, but on a typical day I would have had another one right before bed. For the past week and a half this has only wavered slightly, and that would have been replacing the ‘steak and penne noodles’ with a peanut butter sandwich at work.

… 20-some oz of mtn dew and some 151 rum to finish the night off. It’s Christmas break, after all.

Weigh yourself BEFORE you workout. If you weigh LESS than your previous workout - GO EAT. Do not workout.
What’s the point in burning up another couple hundred calories, if you’re headed in the wrong direction. Eventually you will get tired of postponing training to eat and learn how to pack food into your gut.

TNT

Others can debate the quality but I think in terms of pure calories that is defiantely enough to gain you weight, the second shake would have been overkill for being 150 lbs. You will continue to gain wait for a while with that high an intake. Don’t worry about your appetite if you still wanted to eat more after approx 4000 calories. (Me guessing at portion size).

Also I humbly suggest you ignore TNT, twice.

Listing the food helps. But we need the macro nutrient breakdown to truly help you. Preferably for the meal and day. To do this you need to actually measure the amounts and then use package nutritional info to calculate your nutrient macros. We do not know to suggest that you add more protein, fat or what without knowing the macros of what you are eating. You know XXX grams protein, XX grams fat, XXX grams carbs.