T Nation

Any Workouts that Help Discus Throwers?


#1

I'm a freshman in high school. IM 6'0 285lbs and my bench is 240 power clean is around 190 I squat 405 and deadlift close to 500. I'm throwing around 110 and Id really like to throw for varsity. Preseason has not yet started so I'm looking to get a head start. Any suggestions?


#2

** I am not a thrower or a track athlete **

That being said, I know Dan John was/(is?) a thrower and has written a lot about strength training. I would check out some of his stuff.


#3

Two words: Dan John.


#4

[quote]Roran wrote:
I know Dan John was/(is?) a thrower and has written a lot about strength training. I would check out some of his stuff. [/quote]
Very very yes. I believe he still competes occasionally, and he’s coached tons of high school athletes. The Southwood Program would be the place to start.
http://www.T-Nation.com/article/performance_training/lessons_from_southwood

I’d also suggest reading this, to get your priorities in line:

You’re definitely a big kid and off to a great start, but having a 500 deadlift, a 240 bench, and only a 190 power clean is an indicator that something’s “off” with your training. What are you overhead pressing?


#5

[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
You’re definitely a big kid and off to a great start, but having a 500 deadlift, a 240 bench, and only a 190 power clean is an indicator that something’s “off” with your training. What are you overhead pressing?[/quote]

Super sleuth strikes again, didn’t even notice this. I can’t even begin to understand how you can deadlift 500lbs and only powerclean 190lbs.


#6

Matt Vincent’s stuff is also “thrower centric.” He’s more focused on Highland Games, but he was a college thrower and knows his stuff.


#7

Thanks. I am hungry for the school record which is 196’2


#8

170lbs


#9

[quote]LANESMITH114 wrote:
170lbs[/quote]
I’m guessing that’s your overhead press?

If so, you definitely need to revamp your lifting ASAP, not even to be more “sport specific”, but just to have more carryover and be more well-rounded.

Be sure to read that second article I linked. I’d say you’re certainly “strong enough” on the deadlift, but if you can get your overhead press and clean significantly higher, you should see some good payoff.


#10

[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:

[quote]LANESMITH114 wrote:
170lbs[/quote]
I’m guessing that’s your overhead press?

If so, you definitely need to revamp your lifting ASAP, not even to be more “sport specific”, but just to have more carryover and be more well-rounded.

Be sure to read that second article I linked. I’d say you’re certainly “strong enough” on the deadlift, but if you can get your overhead press and clean significantly higher, you should see some good payoff.[/quote]

I’m not sure I understand what’s wrong with a 170 lb overhead press with a 240 lb bench. That seems to be a pretty good balance to me. Could you elaborate?


#11

[quote]LoRez wrote:
I’m not sure I understand what’s wrong with a 170 lb overhead press with a 240 lb bench. That seems to be a pretty good balance to me. Could you elaborate?[/quote]

On their own, yes, but in the greater context of a 500lb deadlift and 400+ lb squat, it seems slightly disproportionate. The 190 lb power clean is the one that really, really sticks out like a sore thumb to me though, especially for someone focusing on explosive strength.


#12

you are strong enough to start working on your technique! if the disc is the 2kg one, you ll have to spend thousands of hours to achieve that goal. I suggest you start with more realistic goals than throwing 60meters (nearly-olympic level), start by setting a goal of 40meters and then 45 meters and so on…

unfortunately you ll soon realize that it’s far more difficult than you thought it was:( it’s really a painfull and grit-crushing process i am afraid. i am sorry for all the negativity but i wanted to be reallistic. I think that it would be beneficial to improve your hip strength and explosiveness (heavy kettlebell work/power cleans-def. improve that, it’s lame for your strength/plyo work) hope this helps.


#13

[quote]LoRez wrote:
I’m not sure I understand what’s wrong with a 170 lb overhead press with a 240 lb bench. That seems to be a pretty good balance to me. Could you elaborate?[/quote]
I wouldn’t say it’s so much the discrepancy between the bench and the overhead. But when you weigh 285 and you’re an athlete for whom upper body explosive strength is crucial and you’re OH pressing barely more than half-bodyweight, that’s a red flag screaming “needs improvement” and it’s a sign that your training isn’t optimally functional. (“Functional” being relevant in this context since we’re talking about an athlete.)

Also, the relatively-low power clean (compared to bodyweight and especially in comparison to the deadlift) is an indicator that his explosive strength/power isn’t on par with his brute strength. Whether that’s due to him being new to cleans or what, I’m not sure. But if/when he gets even a BW clean, I’d expect his throwing distance to improve on that alone.


#14

I maxed out the OH press machine last night in the weight room at 200lbs.


#15

[quote]LANESMITH114 wrote:
I maxed out the OH press machine last night in the weight room at 200lbs. [/quote]
A) You shouldn’t be trying to max out anything. There’s no benefit other than being able to say “Look what I can do.” And anyhow, knowing you can press 170 pounds (I was presuming that was with a barbell), it’s totally not surprising that you can go even heavier on a stabilized machine.

B) You shouldn’t be using the OH press machine. There’s little carryover to free weights and even less carryover to athletics.


#16

How good is your throwing form.

How long have you been throwing?

My daughter placed in the state meet a few times.

She was tall and strong and good at different sports but never lifted weights

But I saw some small girls throw far with good form.


#17

The discrepancy between power clean vs deadlift numbers could be just a technique thing. I had similar numbers a couple of years ago, 5 plates on the deadlift for a double or triple but for the life of me couldn’t power clean 2 plates. Been stuck at probably around 90 kg for months and gave up (while telling myself that I’m not a hipster crossfitter anyway). It’s only after playing around with high pulls after reading CT’s articles and posts that it finally occurred to me that I’ve been treating the power clean like a power shrug + cheated upright row combo.

Various articles and videos use phrases like triple extension, accelerate past the knees, aggressive standing up/jump, closing the triangle etc etc but me being a dense mofo never really understood any of those cues. Dan John’s from the ground up and this video finally made me understood how to do a proper clean/snatch/high pull:

Some might argue that the advice isn’t the best for olympic lifting but they worked well for a noob like me. My power clean numbers almost literally flew through the roof in just a few days.