Hi all, this has been a wondeful place for me the last few years. Alot of wonderful info and thanks to T-mag I lost a significant amount of fat but seemed to plateaued the last few months. What helped me lose 35 lbs of fat was methoxy-7, md6, t2. Which I thank Biotest so much, they are kickin supps. I would like to lose 10 more lbs of fat while trying to maintain as much muscle mass as possible. I realize more than likely I will lose some muscle though. I have tried everything the last few months and I just can’t get the last 10 pounds lost. I have lowered calories, zig-zagged calories, even upped my calories for awhile, took a break from the e/c stack and went back on it later with T2pro and even T2, tried different weightlifting routines. I’m an endomorph and read that endomorphs need to concentrate on really high reps, so for awhile I switched from moderate low-high reps(8-15) to 25 reps/set. That didn’t help. I was even thinking about switching from my ortho-tri-cyclin pill to those minipills. From what I read on the internet they lack the estrogen hormone but are a lot less potent at preventing pregnancy as well-so that route is out. So basically I am at standstill. I was thinking possible going to the next level. Now a couple of years ago, I tried nandrosol and that worked great. I used 10 sprays and it definetely helped with my physique. I can’t get that stuff anymore and I have been doing a lot of research of what else I could use. Tribex doesn’t work for me, it makes me bloated. I have searched on this forum and tried elitefitness board, obviously if I wanted to use any steroids the best bet for a woman stand point of view would be primo maybe mixed with anavar, etc. Also I thought I read somewhere that Mag-10 is somewhat like primo. Am I mistaken?
I don’t think I want to go the steroid route. So I’m just wondering would mag-10 at 2ml per day for 3 weeks(maybe longer if things go good) be smart. Or would it be a total waste? If I decided to do this I would substantially lower my calories and follow something like a fat-fast guideline. As far as workouts, I haven’t done meltdown training for awhile so I might give that a go again. Obviously I understand the risks and concerns here and if any viriling effects begin, they are irreversible. I know, I have read t-mag for awhile now, but if I could get any opinions from any women or men out there, that would be great. Thanks alot for your help.
My recommendation would be to not go the MAG-10 route and consider 5x5 rather than Meltdown. Perform the 5x5 program for six weeks. After 5x5, consider EDT. 5X5 will increase strength, maintain LBM and help you lose some pesky BF. It’ll also get you set up for EDT. There are quite a few here in the forum that have experienced fanstastic results with EDT. Begin a food journal, if you haven’t yet. Get your diet in order - you really didn’t provide much here in the way of diet information. So, I’m assuming your diet is still an issue? How long exactly have you been training? What is your current composition (BF%)?
Before the over night experts start chirping NO let me just say “Maybe.” The odds are it will work very very well for a woman since they require way less andrenic/anabolic stimulation for results then men… But, here’s what you have to think about:
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There’s about a 50% chance you’ll blow your voice. I’m guessing but about 70% of chicks that I’ve known in serious competition (and winnied up) sound like Tone Loc.
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Don’t worry about them nasty periods, they may take a vacation for several months.
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Watch out for andrenic re-bound & bloating. While winny/anavar and straight 1-Test won’t cause it 4-AD may since most girls bloat up badly when on dbol which is somewhat similar.
The good news is this is just water weight that will drop off like a brick when off cycle -
Oh yeah, and there’s a slight chance of unwanted hair growth (face/back/etc) but I don’t have any percentage guesses on that.
The bottom line is some women can do viciuos cycles of gear and never pay the price and some can look at even a PH cross-eyed and have permanent masculinating effects.
Mag10 certainly would be potent, but the risk is up to you as far as voice/etc.
Thanks patricia for your reply. Here are my stats. I am 5’2" weigh in at 135 at 18% body fat. My goal is to lose the last 10 lbs of that pesky fat and get to 12% bf. I am 100 percent endomorph, my genetics in my family is quite obese, and I’m genetically gifted in the aspect that I can look at weights, and magically grow muscle. Its the fat that just wont’ come off. I have alot of muscle and am very stong(I can leg press and squat more than some of the guys at my gym) but I look like a rock. Really stocky!! TO make the long story short. I have been weight training seriously for the last 5 years. I got into this wonderfull world of fitness to lose the fat that I magically put on when I was younger. I lost almost 50 lbs and got down to around 14-15 percent bodyfat. I maintained that for awhile and loved the transformation I had, seeing how it inspired other people(people saw how sexy muscle can be) and seeing how it made me a much stronger individual, I was destined to maintain this new wonderful lifestyle forever, even though it is downright hard sometimes, right? Well awhile ago things started happening in my personal life, I made some really stupid selfish decisions, and fell into a hole that basically I kept pushing reality away. So basically I stopped every aspect of fitness, stopped eating my 6 small meals a day, and just ate whenever I was hungry, which actually wasn’t much(I seriously didn’t eat very much, I suppose though my macronutrient ratios were proportionately wrong) and gained all my weight back that I lost a few years before. I got back on the horse you could say about 9 months ago and slowly but surely I lost 35 lbs. of fat. But like I said the last few months have been frustrating. A major plateau. I had this problem the first time I lost weight, I tried tribex, yuck, that stuff made me bloat up like a cow. So then I tried nandrosol and I lowered my calories, very low to 1000 calories/day. I took 10 sprays twice a day and broke through my plateau and helped me get to 14 percent. Currently I weight train 4 times a week(during the day), and then 5 mornings a week before first meal I do cardio-HIIT sessions. I do have a food log, I have done that right from the beginning, and am consuming right now 1300 calories/day in 6 meals, 60% protein, 30% carbs, 10% fat. I manipulated calories and ratios all over the place the last few months. Decreased calories, increased calories, decreased carbs, increased fats etc. In the muscle/fat measurement ratio its like I go 1 step forward and then 2 steps back, then back 1 step forward and 2 steps back, its really making me mad. I did read that lyle mcdonalad book on bromocriptine and thought I found the holy grail, but then when I read more things on the internet about bromocriptine I found out that its a FERTILIY DRUG USED FOR WOMEN. What, why didn’t Lyle mention anything about that in his book. So I never got bromocriptine, don’t need to get pregnant but I did increase my calories for awhile(all clean)hoping that would rasie my leptin levels. I appreciate your advice on the 5x5’s but I learned a long time ago, yes, they are incredibly awesome at building stregnth, but as far as me, not a good idea. I put on muscle like crazy(even on below maintence calories) and the fat just stays there, my legs get bigger and my arms get bigger. Yes, I know that if you gain muscle and keep the same amount of fat, your bf% does go down, but I still have 25 lbs. of fat with the scale going up. I just look more bulkier and stockier. Dont’ get me wrong, I still incorporate low reps 2-3 weeks about every 2.5 months, to change things around a bit.
The reason why I asked about Mag-10 was obviously nandrosol doesn’t exist anymore and I really beleived that bringing that 1 little thing into my fitness regiment when I did this the first time helped enormously. But if its more trouble than anything else even at 2ml/day(guys have been writing that 2 servings/day worked the best for them so I actually would be taking almost 1/9 of the dose that guys take), then I won’t try it. This question is to platehead:
If nandrosol didn’t screw up my periods why would mag-10 then? Just because its much more potent. And also, if mag-10 is like primo(I thought I read that somewhere), why would there be a huge water weight problem? And if mag-10 is like primo, why is it, because of the 1-ad or the 4-ad?
Like I said I was thinking of doing a fat fast protocol and lowering my calories to a very low 950 calories/day, over 5 meals, yes I know that is very low, and that is why I am asking about Mag-10, (and using mag-10 not to gain muscle-I have enough muscle)because like I did with nandrosol it would help me maintain most of my muscle mass and since my body is looking to use something for energy at such low calories, like it did last time, it would use fat. Hopefully anyway. Any other suggestions from anybody would be appreciated, and patricia I must say your physique is incredible and is a great inspiration to me, especially you are almost the same height as me, your 5’4" right? I hate being short. Oh, well. Thanks for your guys time. Oh, one more thing, I was thinking of doubling my dosage of methoxy-7 like that study that everyone started doing, but that is incredibly expensive. So I did think of that route also, and it might be the route I take if Mag-10 is out.
Just got done reading this. To all that might be somewhat interested in this topic, check this page out.
www.mesomorphosis.com/ articles/ullis/ contrarian-endocrinology-01.htm
You should re-post this question over on the steroid board, as there are people over there (Tren-freak, Spongebob, Rainbow) who know far more about the issues involved with various types of androgens than the people over here do.
However, I will say this. The androgenic compound in Nandrosol is very different from that found in MAG-10. Nandro was more expensive (than Androsol) because it’s a different substance, one based on Nor-andro rather than Andro. But MAG-10 has the Andro-class of stuff in it - and a lot at that.
I would be very careful if I were you.
Agree w/char: you should be posting your questions about andro use on the steroids board. It seems that is indeed the route you want to go. And I’m assuming that you’ve done your research on this, are quite aware of the possible side-effects and are certain that this is what you need to do to obtain your goals.
Which is why I'm puzzled. You say you gain muscle easily - too easily. And that's not what you want, you're more concerned with losing BF while just maintaining LBM - correct? SO, you are aware that MAG-10 would increase LBM? And androgens in general would do the same?
With all that being said, let me point out a few things: You've been training for only 5-years. And within that 5-year period, you stopped, gained BF and embarked again only 9-months ago. I still don't believe your diet is in order. You also seem to be allowing your frustrations cloud your judgement (and we've ALL been there, trust me). If you haven't read it yet, read Chris Shugart's "Dawg School: The Bodybuilder's Heirarchy of Needs" - it will perfectly explain to you the need of a solid nutritional base.
NOW, the next thing is if you are already set on maintaining a caloric intake of nothing more than 950 cals a day: then you better get ready for the double dosing of Methoxy-7. I also hope you've added fish oil tabs and flax seed oil to your diet. They will provide your body with essential fats - therefore your body won't see the need to maintain that BF you already have (very helpful when maintaining a strict diet). See where I'm getting at?
Oh and yes, I'm 5'4". But I don't see myself as "short" - actually I see myself as being "quite tall" :-) I wish you luck with whatever you decide to do.
You say you build muscle very easily, but are having a hard time losing that last ten pounds. You have been doing some reading, so I’m sure you know that AAS help build muscle, not lose weight. I think you are saying that when you lose weight you also lose more muscle than you like, but if you build muscle as easily as you say, even at below-maintenance calories, I’m not sure why that is a problem. Have you tried cycling bulking/cutting, cut to lose 4 lbs, bulk to gain 1 or 2 lbs, like that? I get the impression you have the genetics to do well naturally, but are in a hurry. You think AAS would help, but don’t want to use Anavar or Primo because they are illegal, so you are looking at OTC pro-hormones like Mag-10, is that right? What’s the rush, are you angry with yourself for breaking training for awhile and losing a little ground?
Firstly, avoid steroids if you can. Without sounding like I am preaching to the choir. I have cycled steroids myself and there were some side effects, which were somewhat reversable. I was lucky. My usually clear skin got terrible boils, my voice did get deeper,had an amazing sex drive! Anyway Winstrol is a good way to go! However; there is a price that you will pay after cycling of roids, yep more side effects. You have to get your priorities right on what you wnat to achieve concerning your physique. You rattle on a bout body types, which is totally irrelavant here. You need to find what works for ‘you’ and by the sounds of it you are looking for that quick fix to lose that last couple of pounds. This is what happends to your body when we diet, it’s a slow tiedious effort to lose those fat reserves. Be patient and take heed ‘’ there is nothing sexier than a natural, femm, built beautiful bod’’ Good luck!