Any Church Goers?

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power.

I would follow jesus but I think whoever has that twitter account is an imposter.

I am a Christian and am a very proud church goer.

JMan- Your point about how you dont like most Christians was interesting, and I agree with you to a point. But your actually right on about giving yourself up to Christ for guidance and forgiveness. I cant say Christians are horrible people but as humans we all sin, every one of us. We all make mistakes and that includes passing judgment on others but I can honestly say that there are some people I go to church with, that I met through church, that are amazing people. No one on this Earth is perfect. But its great to see that there are some followers in here.

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]
Just let the woman be irrational

;)[/quote]

You guys are not getting what she is saying. Of course an internal compass means one has their own rules, but does not mean you have to follow some set of standard “rules” given by an “authority”[/quote]

I really don’t think it means having steadfast rules.

I live in a world that is grey.
[/quote]

I agree with you in that aspect in the sense that the ‘rules’ set out in the Gospels are not necessarily black and white, but they are guidelines for us to try to follow.

I feel you have to look at the idea behind the ‘rule’ to understand it’s true purpose, such as swearing is bad because it deomonstrates a lack of self control or lying is bad because it eliminates trust in relationships.

Matthew 22:35-40
35 "One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question:
36 â??Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?â??
37 Jesus replied: â??â??Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
38 This is the first and greatest commandment.
39 And the second is like it: â??Love your neighbor as yourself.’
40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.â??

Lot of people forget this.

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

The human conscience simply functions on the judgement of your peers, if what you do is accepted by those close to you then you will feel it is justified. Look at slavery, the apartheid, the holocaust, manifest destiny, and etc., it cannot be trusted.

This is not an attack post against you, I honestly would like to discuss this with you.

A like button would be nice!

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]
Just let the woman be irrational

;)[/quote]

You guys are not getting what she is saying. Of course an internal compass means one has their own rules, but does not mean you have to follow some set of standard “rules” given by an “authority”[/quote]

I really don’t think it means having steadfast rules.

I live in a world that is grey.
[/quote]

I agree with you in that aspect in the sense that the ‘rules’ set out in the Gospels are not necessarily black and white, but they are guidelines for us to try to follow.

I feel you have to look at the idea behind the ‘rule’ to understand it’s true purpose, such as swearing is bad because it deomonstrates a lack of self control or lying is bad because it eliminates trust in relationships.

Matthew 22:35-40
35 "One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question:
36 â??Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?â??
37 Jesus replied: â??â??Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
38 This is the first and greatest commandment.
39 And the second is like it: â??Love your neighbor as yourself.’
40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.â??

Lot of people forget this. [/quote]

I actually read through Matthew last night and 35-39 really jumped off the pages (not surprisingly being that it came from Jesus). But I believe your right in that you have to look deeper into rules to find true meaning, and when you find true meaning it is often easier to follow the word/rules.

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

[/quote]

I didn’t realize I was claiming to be superior. I was only pointing out that those who profess to claim cannot necessairly be trusted simply based on their claims.

CHURCH OF SATAN BABY!!!

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

The human conscience simply functions on the judgement of your peers, if what you do is accepted by those close to you then you will feel it is justified. Look at slavery, the apartheid, the holocaust, manifest destiny, and etc., it cannot be trusted.

This is not an attack post against you, I honestly would like to discuss this with you. [/quote]

Those atrocities that you mention here all have a basis in some sort of dogma.

I don’t have any steadfast rules.

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

[/quote]

I didn’t realize I was claiming to be superior. I was only pointing out that those who profess to claim cannot necessairly be trusted simply based on their claims.[/quote]

Sorry, I edited it a bunch, but toss this at the end of my last post:

"The human conscience simply functions on the judgement of your peers, if what you do is accepted by those close to you then you will feel it is justified. Look at slavery, the apartheid, the holocaust, manifest destiny, and etc., it cannot be trusted.

This is not an attack post against you, I honestly would like to discuss this with you."

I agree that those who believe they are able to judge another person based on their moral record is ridiculous whether they believe in a higher power or not.

We can all express disspointment in our fellow man and punish those acts which threaten the safety and well-being of other citizens, but no one is better than the other, we’ve all done hurtful things.

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

[/quote]

I didn’t realize I was claiming to be superior. I was only pointing out that those who profess to claim cannot necessairly be trusted simply based on their claims.[/quote]

I agree. Walk the walk, don’t just talk. Going to church thinking that makes you a Christian is like believing sitting in a garage makes you a car.

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

The human conscience simply functions on the judgement of your peers, if what you do is accepted by those close to you then you will feel it is justified. Look at slavery, the apartheid, the holocaust, manifest destiny, and etc., it cannot be trusted.

This is not an attack post against you, I honestly would like to discuss this with you. [/quote]

Those atrocities that you mention here all have a basis in some sort of dogma.

I don’t have any steadfast rules. [/quote]

Which is why I feel the human conscience cannot be trusted, religion or dogma is not too blame, it is simply human nature being allowed to flourish through fear, ignorance, and greed. Religion was used to justify their actions.

There are no steadfast rules, life is not that simple, every situation deserves to be looked at individually and treated as such. The Gospels and Jesus give us guidelines to help us navigate our existence so that our instincts and insecurities do not fully cloud our judgement.

[quote]turboII wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

[/quote]

I didn’t realize I was claiming to be superior. I was only pointing out that those who profess to claim cannot necessairly be trusted simply based on their claims.[/quote]

I agree. Walk the walk, don’t just talk. Going to church thinking that makes you a Christian is like believing sitting in a garage makes you a car.
[/quote]

I agree with your last point somewhat but it sounds like that has diluted your entire concept of what church is. Church is not just a building where people go to make themselves feel better about the bad things theyve done all week. It is supposed to be a group of believers who want to share, spread, worship, celebrate and live the Gospel. That is church. The reason Im even saying this is because I once was very turned off of church. But through God’s grace I was led to a church that not only feels like a family but has made my walk with Christ so much deeper and beautiful that I feel like I had to share. I dont know if you have had bad experiences with church or not but if you have dont let it keep you from going/trying other places. Theres nothing wrong with trying out different places, not necessarily to “fit” your beliefs but to belong to a community that can help change your life and others through Christ.

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

The human conscience simply functions on the judgement of your peers, if what you do is accepted by those close to you then you will feel it is justified. Look at slavery, the apartheid, the holocaust, manifest destiny, and etc., it cannot be trusted.

This is not an attack post against you, I honestly would like to discuss this with you. [/quote]

Those atrocities that you mention here all have a basis in some sort of dogma.

I don’t have any steadfast rules. [/quote]

Which is why I feel the human conscience cannot be trusted, religion or dogma is not too blame, it is simply human nature being allowed to flourish through fear, ignorance, and greed. Religion was used to justify their actions.

There are no steadfast rules, life is not that simple, every situation deserves to be looked at individually and treated as such. The Gospels and Jesus give us guidelines to help us navigate our existence so that our instincts and insecurities do not fully cloud our judgement.

[/quote]

They may be great guidelines there to follow, but are those who profess to believe actually following them?

I actually think that people are overall good, and the majority do. But those who scream loudest usually fail in action.

[quote]Christine wrote:
Nope.

I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.

Empathy doesn’t require religion.[/quote]

Marry me <3

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

The human conscience simply functions on the judgement of your peers, if what you do is accepted by those close to you then you will feel it is justified. Look at slavery, the apartheid, the holocaust, manifest destiny, and etc., it cannot be trusted.

This is not an attack post against you, I honestly would like to discuss this with you. [/quote]

Those atrocities that you mention here all have a basis in some sort of dogma.

I don’t have any steadfast rules. [/quote]

Which is why I feel the human conscience cannot be trusted, religion or dogma is not too blame, it is simply human nature being allowed to flourish through fear, ignorance, and greed. Religion was used to justify their actions.

There are no steadfast rules, life is not that simple, every situation deserves to be looked at individually and treated as such. The Gospels and Jesus give us guidelines to help us navigate our existence so that our instincts and insecurities do not fully cloud our judgement.

[/quote]

They may be great guidelines there to follow, but are those who profess to believe actually following them?

I actually think that people are overall good, and the majority do. But those who scream loudest usually fail in action.[/quote]

No, they are not, and yes, humans have the potential to be good, but in the end were all looking out for number one which makes it difficult to be truly empathetic or loving towards each other. God is complete in of Himself, both male and female, entirely self sufficient, and entirely capable of unconditional love for His creation.

Don’t look to humans for an example of God’s love, it is really something that you have to discover on your own through your own development, experiences, and acts of kindness. Humans will ultimately always dissapoint you, but Jesus and the examples He gave in the Gospel are what you should reference.

Those who use His teachings to build themselves up or present themselves as better than others, are completey missing the point and shout the loudest because they are desperately looking for someone to validate their opinions and their ego, like a girl in a skimpy dress at a nightclub that just got dumped.

I got nothing against religion, believe what you want to believe. I had a good friend turn totally Christian after him and his wife got married. He got boring and preachy. I enjoy being a part of nothing.

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

The human conscience simply functions on the judgement of your peers, if what you do is accepted by those close to you then you will feel it is justified. Look at slavery, the apartheid, the holocaust, manifest destiny, and etc., it cannot be trusted.

This is not an attack post against you, I honestly would like to discuss this with you. [/quote]

Those atrocities that you mention here all have a basis in some sort of dogma.

I don’t have any steadfast rules. [/quote]

Which is why I feel the human conscience cannot be trusted, religion or dogma is not too blame, it is simply human nature being allowed to flourish through fear, ignorance, and greed. Religion was used to justify their actions.

There are no steadfast rules, life is not that simple, every situation deserves to be looked at individually and treated as such. The Gospels and Jesus give us guidelines to help us navigate our existence so that our instincts and insecurities do not fully cloud our judgement.

[/quote]

They may be great guidelines there to follow, but are those who profess to believe actually following them?

I actually think that people are overall good, and the majority do. But those who scream loudest usually fail in action.[/quote]

No, they are not, and yes, humans have the potential to be good, but in the end were all looking out for number one which makes it difficult to be truly empathetic or loving towards each other. God is complete in of Himself, both male and female, entirely self sufficient, and entirely capable of unconditional love for His creation.

Don’t look to humans for an example of God’s love, it is really something that you have to discover on your own through your own development, experiences, and acts of kindness. Humans will ultimately always dissapoint you, but Jesus and the examples He gave in the Gospel are what you should reference.

Those who use His teachings to build themselves up or present themselves as better than others, are completey missing the point and shout the loudest because they are desperately looking for someone to validate their opinions and their ego, like a girl in a skimpy dress at a nightclub that just got dumped. [/quote]

Yes, I understand that humans are selfish when it comes to the basic needs, yet I don’t believe that every person needs to have religion in their lives in order not to do harm to others. Yet, I still think that some people (a minority) need religion and a set of rules in order to function within society.

For example: I once went skiing with a friend of a friend. The ski trip was with this guy’s church and he was introduced to me by a friend of mine. Seamed like a good guy and I went. The day started with a prayer with him and his church group (no biggie, at the time I wasn’t so sure I was atheist, but was more open). Anyway, great day of skiiing.

As we were driving home, he decided to tell me the story of why he was religious. He told me that he had the chance to rape some girl, and he really wanted to, by the way, but that somehow god told him this was the wrong thing to do. I don’t remember all of the specifics of the story, I was just simply freaked out. (People always want to tell me their secrets for some reason, I guess I’m a good listener). Anyway, what I figured out from this conversation was that some people really needed some sort of higher power to tell them that rape is wrong, and that maybe religion is a good thing for some people.

He never expressed to me that he felt bad for wanting to rape. He only didn’t do it because ‘god’ told him not to.

Anyway, I never went skiing with him again.

As far as I’m concerned, he may be religious, but is completely devoid of any moral compass.

These are the folks I am wary of.

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]ZMorris83 wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:

[quote]XanderBuilt wrote:

[quote]Christine wrote:
I believe that one only needs rules if they have no internal moral compass.
[/quote]

Isn’t having an internal moral compass mean having rules that you set for yourself?[/quote]

No.[/quote]

The human conscience cannot be trusted, we are way too intelligent and perceptive to where we can justify just about anything we do regardless of the negative effect it may have on others.[/quote]

Maybe yours can’t be trusted.

And the conscience of those who claim to have religion can’t be trusted simply upon the fact that they profess to believe in some sort of higher power. [/quote]

So on what grounds do you assume that you are morally superior to myself or anyone else…?

You sound like the Christians that turned me away from church and Ghandi spoke of.

Human nature in of itself is sinful and self-serving, just look at toddlers.

The human conscience simply functions on the judgement of your peers, if what you do is accepted by those close to you then you will feel it is justified. Look at slavery, the apartheid, the holocaust, manifest destiny, and etc., it cannot be trusted.

This is not an attack post against you, I honestly would like to discuss this with you. [/quote]

Those atrocities that you mention here all have a basis in some sort of dogma.

I don’t have any steadfast rules. [/quote]

Which is why I feel the human conscience cannot be trusted, religion or dogma is not too blame, it is simply human nature being allowed to flourish through fear, ignorance, and greed. Religion was used to justify their actions.

There are no steadfast rules, life is not that simple, every situation deserves to be looked at individually and treated as such. The Gospels and Jesus give us guidelines to help us navigate our existence so that our instincts and insecurities do not fully cloud our judgement.

[/quote]

They may be great guidelines there to follow, but are those who profess to believe actually following them?

I actually think that people are overall good, and the majority do. But those who scream loudest usually fail in action.[/quote]

No, they are not, and yes, humans have the potential to be good, but in the end were all looking out for number one which makes it difficult to be truly empathetic or loving towards each other. God is complete in of Himself, both male and female, entirely self sufficient, and entirely capable of unconditional love for His creation.

Don’t look to humans for an example of God’s love, it is really something that you have to discover on your own through your own development, experiences, and acts of kindness. Humans will ultimately always dissapoint you, but Jesus and the examples He gave in the Gospel are what you should reference.

Those who use His teachings to build themselves up or present themselves as better than others, are completey missing the point and shout the loudest because they are desperately looking for someone to validate their opinions and their ego, like a girl in a skimpy dress at a nightclub that just got dumped. [/quote]

Yes, I understand that humans are selfish when it comes to the basic needs, yet I don’t believe that every person needs to have religion in their lives in order not to do harm to others. Yet, I still think that some people (a minority) need religion and a set of rules in order to function within society.

For example: I once went skiing with a friend of a friend. The ski trip was with this guy’s church and he was introduced to me by a friend of mine. Seamed like a good guy and I went. The day started with a prayer with him and his church group (no biggie, at the time I wasn’t so sure I was atheist, but was more open). Anyway, great day of skiiing.

As we were driving home, he decided to tell me the story of why he was religious. He told me that he had the chance to rape some girl, and he really wanted to, by the way, but that somehow god told him this was the wrong thing to do. I don’t remember all of the specifics of the story, I was just simply freaked out. (People always want to tell me their secrets for some reason, I guess I’m a good listener). Anyway, what I figured out from this conversation was that some people really needed some sort of higher power to tell them that rape is wrong, and that maybe religion is a good thing for some people.

He never expressed to me that he felt bad for wanting to rape. He only didn’t do it because ‘god’ told him not to.

Anyway, I never went skiing with him again.

As far as I’m concerned, he may be religious, but is completely devoid of any moral compass.

These are the folks I am wary of. [/quote]

Empathy is a function of the brain, some are naturally stronger in this area, and just like what we have learned from cereal killers, regardless of your upbringing, some humans are unable to understand why what they are doing is detrimental to society.

Religion can be used to guide them down a better path, but understanding why certain acts are hurtful to others and why we need forgiveness is the foundation of Christianity and I hope that guy eventually realized this.