T Nation

Another of Those Threads. First Cycle, 22 Years Old


#1

Right guys, I’m one of those boys that feels the need to post his thoughts and plan of action online as to receive recommendations and/or alterations from the experienced users of AAS. I have read the Newbie Cycling Thread which was very informative. Now, you’re probably thinking I haven’t taken it on board because I am under 25, however this isn’t the case. I am planning a career into the world of bodybuilding and feel that after 25 I could have missed some vital years, if you look at the standard of the top guys these days. (yeah the genetic elite, who may be younger than us but look better than we ever will) I have done one show before and that was in the Physique division 2 years ago.

So a bit about myself:

22 years old (competed at 20)
214lbs (competed at 173lbs)
6"1
I am going to include a recent pic (in the green boxers) and a transformation pic that saw me go from 193lbs 10 weeks out to 173lbs on stage, also another picture at 179lbs 4 weeks out)

I have trained since leaving school and properly for the past 3 years. I follow a strict push pull legs routine that I was placed on by my coach in the lead up to my show. (Aaron Curtis) Training every bodypart twice per week.

Tomorrow I have an appointment to have my bloodwork done by my GP who is aware of my desire and is looking to assist me in the way in which he can. I will update the thread with those results.

I think (may be wrong - this is where you guys come in) a blast and cruise is my best option. I am fine with being on Test for the rest of my life. It would go as such:

weeks 1-12 500mg Test E (alpha pharma)
weeks 1-14 .25mg arimidex eod

from that first cycle I would reduce Test E to 200mg each week for the duration of the cruise. question here - would I be better aiming for 250mg per week and pinning 125mg Monday and then Thursday and repeat? or is 100mg fine? then there is the question of the arimidex, would I also half that dose and continue to take eod? I am looking into N2Guard and plan on purchasing and using that for the duration of blasting and cruising. I also plan on keeping Nolva to hand just in case.

Do I look to get down to the weight of 178lbs in the picture at the gym before starting my cycle? I would like to think I put on some muscle in the last two years.

I have no issue with diet or training. (I’m a PT who knows how to build muscle and then cut fat) I have a huge appetite so what I’m wondering is that if I was to hop on in say 4 weeks at 205lbs, should I just eat everything in sight (as to enhance the muscle gain - I’m not worried about fat gain) or should I keep this regulated at a clean yet effective (for me to gain) 3200 calories and see where my weight goes?

I am more than happy to engage in conversation and answer any questions you may have. Thank you very much for taking the time to read my ramblings!




#2

Skip it. Absolutely no reason to bother with that snake oil. There, I just saved you hundreds of dollars over the course of a year. You’re welcome.


#3

500 test for 12 weeks no PCT. Not necessary at 500 imo. Cruise 200-250/wk one injection each week for 12 weeks. You will not roller coaster injecting once a week. Then hop back on at whatever you want the next cycle to do. Remember, you’re only 22 so take it slow on upping dosages each cycle or adding different drugs into the mix.

Personally, I’m against doing them at your age because you have not tapped out your potential yet, but its your life and body. Just be SMART AND PATIENT.


#4

I would hold off on the AI until absolutely necessary. From what I’ve read so far, you should let your estrogen levels be unless they are starting to cause you some issues (sensitive nips and lumps and such) no need to introduce an “anti” anything until you see how your body is going to aromatase and how quickly and aggressively your E2 levels will react to the increase in testosterone. You blood results will give the more medically knowledgeable guys the proper information to more accurately predict that sort of thing.


#5

I wanted to comment on your question about arimidex during the cruise. If you do end up using arimidex (cruise or cycle however I think you should on cycle) you are just going to have to play with the dosage. Since this will be your first cycle and I assume you will be doing post cycle blood work. About 4-6 weeks into your cruise dose your “leftover” cycle test should be gone. Therefore only your cruise dose will be in your body and the levels should be stable for the given dose. If you don’t have any issues with estrogen in your cruise after week 2-3 then I would see where you are at without the arimidex. At 2-3 weeks the extra high cycle levels of test and estrogen will be coming down pretty drastically. So if no issues with estrogen after week 2-3 in cruise I would not take the arimidex then get the blood work around week 6 of cruise.
We need estrogen as I am sure you know and without knowing where your at on a cruise dose it would be real easy to tank it. You can get the blood work with no arimidex then KNOW where your estrogen is at for a cruise dose. It would be very advantageous to know this at the beginning of what might be years of a body building career. Of course if you experience issues then resume the arimidex at a lower dose than what you needed on cycle.

But I am not a Dr. so I only speak from what I have experienced.


#6

Thanks for the replies guys, it’s much appreciated. I will hold off taking anything other than the Test E (AI) until - potentially - any sides flare up. I’ll have the results within a week.

That’s the thing, I am in no rush to dive head first into the world of AAS and would much rather squeeze as much as I can from the littlest amounts possible.

One question I have is should I look to lean down from picture 1 to somewhere in the vicinity of picture 2 before I start to inject? Other than having to diet off some fat later down the line, is there any other benefits to starting as lean as possible? I’m not looking for short cuts to hard work and if you guys think I should start leaner I’ll take 10/12 weeks dieting down first. Only thing is I may need to reverse diet once that cut is over for a few weeks and once my calories are sufficient, then hop on.


#7

Although it is possible it is very hard to only gain lean muscle with no additional fat without being on AAS. The only time you hear about people mysteriously gaining lean muscle while dieting is with DTH based AAS. With those two “facts” (not really facts but I don’t know how else to say it) if you are planning a gaining cycle then you will have to cut or diet afterwards to be ready for any type of stage. I don’t think it matters if you diet now or after the cycle but if you do it first you might be more hesitant to eat enough to gain because you will end up watching that definition go away even if it is only water that is hiding it. If you were planning a cutting cycle I would say diet some first possibly. Since you are gaining you would most likely have to diet again after the cycle. So I dont think it matters weather you do it before or after but chances are you will want to after.

Another thing to consider; even though you are doing a test only cycle that test will help you burn fat at a higher level than natural. Further point; a pound of muscle burns more calories than a pound of fat. You might find the dieting goes faster after you gained muscle mass on cycle.


#8

Thanks for the advice @now_i_care. So after an impromptu trip to Mexico I am back with my results:

TSH - 1.81
Free T4 - 12

Testosterone - 20.4

Sodium - 142
Potassium - 4.3
Chloride - 105
Urea - 6
Creatinine - 115
eGFR - >60

Albumin - 39
Tot Bilirubin - 7
Ala Amino Trans - 34
Alk Phosphate - 79
Gamma Glut Trans - 12

CRP <4

Cholesterol - 4.9
HDL - 1.2
LDL - 3
Tot Chol/HDL Ratio - 4
Triglyceride - 1.5

Tot Vit D - 35

HB - 169
RBC - 5.6
HCT - 0.5
MCV - 89
MCH - 30
PLT - 273
WBC - 9.6
NEUT - 5
EOS - 0.32
BASO - 0.03
LYMPH - 3.7
MONO - 0.4
LUC - 0.15

B12 - 313

Glucose - 4.3

So those are the tests my GP sent for and he says to come back in 6 months time and we’ll do them again. Is 6 months too great a time frame? Should I be looking to go back in 4? (After 12 week blast and 3 weeks at cruise level say) I’ve got the all clear so I’m going to begin on the 22nd of this month and keep a log in here.


#9

4 weeks in and I’m sitting at 225lbs, easily hitting 3500 cals per day and looking to bump it up beginning next week to 4000. I’m just wondering, should I aim to get bloods done 6 weeks in or would it be just as useful to do them now? Also, I found the Medichecks site but am unsure which test to select, which would be the key indicators to check?


#10

Probably push back to six weeks. More time for the test to build up and reach a stable concentration. You’re not going to get bad data at four weeks, but six makes more sense.


#11

6 weeks in and I’m making some pretty decent strength gains. pinned on Monday and jesus christ it has been the worst pip wise so far, struggled deadlifting yesterday and going to have trouble squatting this evening, have to pin my other cheek as well today. I noticed someone suggest using 25g syringes in a thread, would this be more beneficial for me? I’m using 23g.

also booked in to get bloods done next Monday so will have results back some time next week.

I’ve deviated from the plan somewhat regarding nutrition because money has been tight. I’ve basically been eating everything I can get my hands on but over the course of the past week i’d say I’ve struggled to hit 3k consistently. paid tomorrow though so can hop back on the nutrition bandwagon.

feeling fuller, but only strength gains that have jumped up really are my legs. not complaining however as I really need to bring them up to compete in Classic Physique.


#12

Are you pinning ventrogluteal? I’ve found that that particular area is the least painful.


#13

I was probably best placed to that site on Monday although quite a bit of blood did come out tbf. just struggled through my leg session, lunges were trickier than squats on my right glute.


#14

so I’m getting my bloods done this evening but today is injection day. does it make any sort of difference whether I inject before the tests or is this inadvisable? I can’t find any answers to this specific question on the forum.


#15

Free test - 64.6
Estrogen - 352
HDL - 0.9
LDL - 3.7

So my test has trebled, no starting mark for estrogen unfortunately but I’m told 352 is very high - is this cause for concern? Cholesterol is worse than the starting mark.


#16

What are the ranges for e2?


#17

160 is the norm. ranges between 100-190 is their guideline


#18

Holy dickballs. What’s your current AI dose look like? Your test levels look good, based on the first number to the current one.

Do me a favor, because I hate scrolling back and fourth and trying to find what I’m looking for. Can you post your current cycle including AI and ancillaries? Because that’s a huge e2 number.


#19

I’m only running test e at 500mg per week. I have Anastrozole, Tamoxifen and Clomid on hand but the general advice I’ve read is to skip the ai until sides occur. Or maybe I read that incorrectly, I believe that is along the lines of the advice @physiolojik provides. I feel fine, no sign of gyno, maybe a wee bit of tenderness in the nipples but it isn’t noticeable.

hold up, jesus christ my estrogen levels are that of a 22 year old girl


#20

I almost made a joke about how with that e2 level you should compete in the women’s division.